Hunter 260 Versus Seaward 26RK

[Tedd]

We currently sail a Macgregor 26S. We're going to upgrade to something roomier in a year or two, for longer trips, but we would like to stay with a trailerable boat. There are a few options but the two that stand out as being within our price range (depending on the year) and a significant step up from the Macgregor are the Hunter 260 and the Seaward 26RK. I know these boats are in some ways not directly comparable. For example, we're going to pay more even for an older Seaward. But, based on what I know so far and what our priorities are, I came up with the comparison below. I'm interested in Hunter owner's thoughts on this. Do you agree with my assessment? Thoughts on the factors I haven't rated? Other things I should consider?

Factor	Hunter 260	Seaward 26RK	Advantage	Comment
Aftermarket Support	Excellent	Poor	260
Ease of Launch/Recovery	Good	Good	260
Ease of Resale	Very Good	Good	260
Ease of Rigging	Very Good	Good	260	Expect mast handling to be easier on 260
Interior Light/Portlights	Very Good	Good	260
Interior Space	Excellent	Good	260
Purchase Cost	Lower	Higher	260	Depreciation might not be that different
Tow Vehicle	SUV or Pickup	Pickup Only	260	Allows us to have one vehicle
Towing Weight	4,800 lb	6,000 lb	260	26RK needs 3/4 ton pickup, probably
Brand Reputation	Very Good	Excellent	26RK
Builder Support	Good	Excellent	26RK
Likely Equipment	Good	Very Good	26RK	Toilet, shower, etc.
Quality/Ruggedness	Good	Very Good	26RK
Sailing Qualities	Good	Very Good	26RK
Stiffness	Good	Very Good	26RK
Anchor System
Engine	Outboard	Inboard		Both have advantages and disadvantages
Galley
Lifelines/General Safety
Owner Network	Large	Small But Keen
Sailing Lines of Sight
Storage Space

 

[rgranger]

Nice list and I'd have to agree with each of your assessments.

Assuming you have the tow vehicle for either then neither boat is clearly better.... ask yourself a different set of questions and then list which boat is better suited. Here is something to get you started

1. What type of weather are you more likely to sail in? Do you find yourself sailing in lighter air more often (260) or do you sail in areas with blustery breezes (26RK)?
2. How often a year will you launch and retrieve your boat? Often (260) or only once or twice a season (26RK)
3. How much time will you spend on (in) your boat at anchor (260) vs. how much time will you spend sailing (26RK)?
4. Do you mostly day sail where you can pick your weather windows more accurately (260)? Or do you think you will be doing longer trips (passages) where you are more likely to get caught in unexpected storms (26RK)?

 

[Tedd]

@rgranger :

Thanks, those are all great questions that will factor into my choice.

For the record, we tow and launch every trip but, because we do, we rarely day sail. When we go it's almost always at least over night, and usually two nights or more. We spend a lot of time at anchor, much more time than we spend sailing. So interior space and comfort are a high priority. My sense is that you're right that the Hunter is a quicker boat to set up and launch. I'm sure the Seaward can be made manageable on that front, with some organization and a few modifications, but the edge goes to the Hunter.

At the moment, we sail mainly on lakes, and winds are light to moderate. But we plan to take longer trips in this boat, in coastal waters. Still fairly sheltered, nothing you could call blue water, but more challenging than what we've dealt with so far. I do want something that's capable for those times when the conditions get challenging, and I feel like the Seaward is probably the better boat, in that respect. But I will plan and execute our trips with due regard to the boat's capabilities, regardless of what boat we end up with. One of the reasons I prefer a trailerable boat is that I can get to great sailing areas without having to sail through some of the challenging passes along the way.

 

[rgranger]

You might want to think about getting a new main for the 260 and have two sets of reef points added. That would get you into the 20 kts wind range and sheltered coastal cruising would still be a good choice.

 

[jviss]

Builder support: I believe both Hunter (Hunter-Marlow) and MacGregor are out of business; how did you come up with good and excellent, respectively, for these?

Also brand reputation: I know this is a sensitive topic, especially in the Hunter Owners forum, but I would be curious about the spectrum of brands considered? I mean, on a scale of Chrysler to Hinkley, or something like that? From my fairly ignorant perspective I would rate Hunter over MacGregor for brand reputation. But, I would be careful in any event, as I've seen some examples of poor building practices on Hunters in this forum. Here's one that recently came up for the Hunter 260:
H260 Service Upgrade

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

SBO HAS ALOT of support and currently owned by a former Hunter employee. As to stiffness, you are correct about the 26 RK but not sure but weighs more which is not good for towing. However, Hunter 260 is designed to be strong but flexible with the use of a foam sandwich core in it; thus the boat is lighter for towing. It has a dedicated mast raise system that works which I know the designer. It sails in a sense flatter but faster. Equipment used is good. I could go on but wanted you to know some facts. Most of the hunters built were designed using principles and experience from boats built and raced solo by the owner of Hunter.

As far as both boats, I would recommend both.
Dave Condon
Former dealer (American Marine & Sail Supply)

 

[walt]

My experience has been that builder support matters with the motor but for the rest of the sailboat.. much less important.

The Mac 26S is still the perfect boat for me but I like the two choices you are thinking about.. Here are a couple more things that would be important to me..

What is the sleeping arrangement. Do you have to crawl over someone to get up in middle of the night. If you are in a high lightning area, will you be sleeping with long ungrounded lightning rod somewhat over you head?

Zebra mussel inspections when traveling. Crossing into California is easy.. but crossing into Idaho or Utah can be a hassle especially if the inspector is having a bad day and somehow knows about water ballast. Even without the water ballast, sometimes the inspections can be a hassle but water ballast complicates this.

Are you the type that tends to ground underwater stuff on the boat (I do every year even on a lake I am familiar with) or sail in an area where you are likely to ground. The swing centerboard water ballast boat is about as tolerant as you can get for grounding and I assume the Hunter 260 would be better here.

Your "problem" sounds like a lot of fun!

 

[Tedd]

@jviss :

I'm going to assume that it was a typo when you said Macgregor, and you meant Seaward, since we're not discussing Macgregors, here.

Marlow-Hunter appears to be still in business, and they list the Hunter 260 as one of their Previous Models, so I'm going to assume it's the correct company.

Seaward has an excellent reputation for customer support. They're now being built and supported by Island Packet Yachts, but IPY is also now owned by Hake Marine, which was the parent company of Seaward. So it seems reasonable to assume that they've maintained their standards of customer support. But I don't have any testimonials to support that. I'm interested in what you may have heard.

 

[Tedd]

@walt :

Our current boat is a Macgregor 26S. It's really great value, and you can't top it for being easy to tow and set up, for a 26 foot boat. But I know my wife isn't going to be happy, long term, without standing head room and some other amenities that the Macgregor doesn't offer.

We're in the Pacific northwest (or Pacific southwest, as I like to call it, since we're in southern BC), so lightning's not a big issue. But with the Mac, on those rare occasions when it's a risk, I lower the mast. I have my mast-raising system set up so I can do it on the water, and the mast comes down in a minute or two. Since we tow and launch a lot, I intend to set up our next boat the same way.

We don't expect to ever sail anywhere other than British Columbia, so jurisdictional issues aren't a problem. Grounding's not a big issue here, either, for the most part. Finding shallow enough water to anchor in can be a challenge, though, and, partly for that reason, I never sail anywhere without a chart. But I admit that do like the swing keel, even so, and wanted the 26S Macgregor instead of the 26D, for that reason.

Yes, I'm very happy to have this "problem!" We bought the Mac with the idea that we'd see how much we would like sailing and aim for something bigger, if we did. (And when I say "how much 'we' would like sailing" I mean "how much 'my wife' would like sailing, since I already knew what I wanted.) We're still considering non-trailerable boats because we want to do some serious cruising. But moorage cost around here is a pretty strong disincentive. The annual cost for a 30-foot slip is close to what we paid for our Macgregor!

 

[jviss]

I'm going to assume that it was a typo when you said Macgregor, and you meant Seaward, since we're not discussing Macgregors, here.

Ah, yes, you are correct. Brain fart on my side.

Marlow-Hunter appears to be still in business,

Appearances can be deceiving. There's been discussion of them on this forum. Seems their factory is shut.

 

[ronhanson01]

You can still get hunter replacement parts for the site sponsor which is nice!

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

SBO IS STAFFED AND OWNED BY FORMER HUNTER EMPLOYEES. THEN THERE ARE OWNERS WHO OWN HUNTER S THAT MANY SHARE THEIR WEALTH OF INFORMATION. Then there is me as a former dealer who has a vast wealth of information to share. Support here is pretty darn good. FORGOT THE OTHER EXPERERIENCED SBO SAILORS WHOM NEET TO BE PRAISED AS WELL AS THEIR KNOWLEDGE IS VERY VALUABLE

 

[Tedd]

Thanks, @Crazy Dave Condon . Those are exactly the sorts of reasons that I rated the Hunter as excellent in the "Aftermarket Support" category. It seems to me that, except in very special circumstances, aftermarket support is much more important than support from the original builder of the boat. Loads of people are having satisfactory owner experiences with boats built by companies that have long since vanished from the scene.

 

[David in Sandusky]

For me, brand reputation is the least important factor on the list. As a group, we know these boats. We know how they were built, and how they sail. We spend most of our time on this site talking about how to maintain them. So we maintain a "boat reputation" not a builder reputation. The quality of support this site gives to Hunters is a lynchpin of that idea.

If we were talking about a new boat design, with which we have no such experience, then builder/designer reputation would be critical.

I am impressed with Catalina's long term support of their line of boats. But I see that this site achieves at least the same level of support for Hunter boats.

 

[Tedd]

@David in Sandusky :

Yeah, I think we're really talking about the same thing. I don't own a Hunter, nor have I been involved in the sailboat market for very long. So, in that sense, all the boats are "new boat designs," to me. Brand reputation, to me, means exactly what you said: A bunch of owners who know the boats--how they were built, how they sail--and who also have experience with other boats, will vouch for them. Not what millions of know-nothings on the internet think, but what people who actually know this particular brand think. (As a Macgregor owner, the distinction between those two things is stark, for me!)

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

A lot of support here with Catalina too besides the other groups.

I was close to Frank Butler who asked me about new or redesigning boats as a dealer. I understood that I was the only one whom he reached out to for smaller boats plus I stood up to him when I felt he wrong. He respected me for that. However the Crazy part of me came out after a boring dealer meeting in Annapolis one year. He opened up the meeting for comments. I stood up and walked over to him and started singing the Cat Meow song ending with a purr
Frank said he knew I was crazy but now he knew I was absolutely “Nuts.” The whole room laughed so hard and the meeting immediately adjourned for the dinner party which was now in a good mood. Mission accomplished with a thank you from most including my staff

 

[Tedd]

Great story, @Crazy Dave Condon ! I had seen your moniker here and wondered where the crazy part came from. Your story reminds me of a couple of the guys in my vintage car racing club, who like to sing a song about German sports cars called "Mit ze motor in ze back" (sung to the tune of The Happy Wanderer).

I like the Catalina 250 a lot, and it was high on my list before I bought the Mac 26S. But standing head room is a non-negotiable requirement for our next boat, so I'm not considering it.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Introduced that boat as well

 

[rgranger]

@David in Sandusky :

Ye. (As a Macgregor owner, the distinction between those two things is stark, for me!)

I've owned and sailed two Macgregor V21 and a Macgregor V22-2.

Loved all three boats and did some decent coastal cruising in the 22. I would often go hours without seeing land on the V22.

 

[bmorr]

WE went from a Mac 26c to a h26 (water ballast) about 10 years ago. We love the interior and cockpit of the Hunter (sails great also). It does take longer to set up, but I only do it 2 times a year so my system may not be the most efficient. Be sure and check the beam, over 9 feet requires a permit in many states.