I had the forestay pin worked its way out during gusty winds, which caused the mast to fall. (Very exciting) The solution was a pad lock instead of a pin. It is easy to take on and off and completely secure.
Hunter 260 mast fell from forestay pin falling out
- Thread starter dglauber
- Start date
What kind of pin did you have that came loose? Did the ring ding or cotter pin fail or come loose without noticing?
This is the second case of forestay pin failure in 2 days! The other guy figures that a flapping rope (jib sheet?) snagged the ring in the pin and bent it. I didn't get the full story though. I would be interested in the details here. It seems to me that the forestay /pin is one of the most vulnerable parts of the boat. I wouldn't mind to build in some redundancy.
One of the biggest causes of failure is the circular ring being snagged by a line or rope pulling on it distorting the shape. I see so many photos of lines around the attachment of the forestay that sometimes it scares me so now I am preaching here. Never leave lines around the base of the forestay and most of this goes away. If using a d dent ball style clevis pin or one that you push on one end to allow the ball end to release and remove, that is very unsafe unless it is secured in place via a second means so it cannot fall out should failure of the locking ball mechanism should fail. Regretablly this occurred to me as a dealer and in one case the mast fell thus I paid for shipping and the mast to replace that as a former dealer. After that, I always use cotter pins to secure the clevis pins on the forestay and folks make sure they are stainless as you will not believe the amount of non stainless cotter pins that have been used I found and made it a habit to remove and replace myself at my cost. Sure an extra minute goes into the set up but for safety reasons, this extra minute is vital to your safety.
I use a threaded D shackle with the pin that has the hole in the end that I then safety wire. I seem to have horrible luck and I don't what that pin backing out and then falling out. I tighten the pin down with my multiplier when I put it in and have always had to use my pliers to break it free when we drop the mast but even still, I wire it to remove any doubt that it will stay tight.
Sam
Sam
While I love the ease of ring removal, and cuss cotter pins if I foul their removal, a cotter pin is drastically safer than a ring on installations such as base of forestay.
A cotter pin requires very specific dexterity and intentional forces to be removed. And if installed properly, has a low probability of being snagged, even though a snag causing distortion is extremely unlikely to allow accidental removal, given the multi prong precise nature of cotter pins.
A cotter pin requires very specific dexterity and intentional forces to be removed. And if installed properly, has a low probability of being snagged, even though a snag causing distortion is extremely unlikely to allow accidental removal, given the multi prong precise nature of cotter pins.
Not only do they require dexterity but those stainless cotter pins hurt like hell when they stab you under the finger nail! Stiff little buggers. I can see why someone would use a mild steel pin in it's place but not a good idea.
Sam
This. DO NOT use ring-dings on standing rigging. A properly sized properly installed cotter is going nowhere.
Take it from a guy who is required by racing rules to safety wire a good majority of bolts on a 450lb missile that regularly exceeds 150mph... I love my stainless aircraft wire and the spinning pliers that are used to correctly twist it, and I am exceedingly good at installing the wire neatly (two or more bolts wired in sequence so that bolt heads cannot turn counterclockwise), BUT I will say safety wire is not a good idea on the deck of sailing vessel. When you twist and cut off the tails of safety wire you leave a lovely little pigtail of twisted wire that is dang sharp. The potential for snagging a line and tearing it up like all heck is just too just too great for any benefit provided by safety wire over cotter pins.
FYI, let me make it clear how safety wire is properly used: The bolt needing securement is wired to another bolt or hard-point, wrapped in clockwise direction as to prevent the bolt from turning out counterclockwise from vibration. Using safety wire to secure clevis bins provides NO benefit over cotter pins. The ONLY place I could think of where safety wire would be helpful on a sailboat is on the aux engine or generator if equipped; that equipment has operating vibration where safety wire is the ideal mechanical back-up for bolts after loc-tite and proper torque.
FYI, let me make it clear how safety wire is properly used: The bolt needing securement is wired to another bolt or hard-point, wrapped in clockwise direction as to prevent the bolt from turning out counterclockwise from vibration. Using safety wire to secure clevis bins provides NO benefit over cotter pins. The ONLY place I could think of where safety wire would be helpful on a sailboat is on the aux engine or generator if equipped; that equipment has operating vibration where safety wire is the ideal mechanical back-up for bolts after loc-tite and proper torque.
Cloud diver,
Totally agree, that stuff is viscious. I have been impaled with safety wire so many time in the last thirty years I hate to think of the amount of blood loss I have incurred. Used properly and the tails tucked in tight in certain locations it is fine to use. Our forstay has a clevis with a threaded pin that has an eye in it. I safety that eye to the clevis and tuck the tail in tight to prevent it from backing out.
You are correct in that it needs to be done corectly. Not all applications require twisting of the wire between fastners. A lot of acessories run a single untwisted wire between a series of fastners. All depends on the application and toque values.
Sam
Totally agree, that stuff is viscious. I have been impaled with safety wire so many time in the last thirty years I hate to think of the amount of blood loss I have incurred. Used properly and the tails tucked in tight in certain locations it is fine to use. Our forstay has a clevis with a threaded pin that has an eye in it. I safety that eye to the clevis and tuck the tail in tight to prevent it from backing out.
You are correct in that it needs to be done corectly. Not all applications require twisting of the wire between fastners. A lot of acessories run a single untwisted wire between a series of fastners. All depends on the application and toque values.
Sam
Wow, that brings back memories of working on Phantoms (jets, not daysailors) back in the 70's. We safety wired fasteners as well as threaded on electrical connectors to keep everything from vibrating loose. Lives depended on it.
Here is an ideal place for safety wire.
The wire is pulling the lever on the left to the lever on the right which is being pulled up to the cross pin with the tail tucked up out of the way. Motor won't come loose and it does present a bit of an issue to a would be the if in the middle of the night looking for a quick snatch and run. Not much of an issue if they have tools but more than nothing.
Sam
The wire is pulling the lever on the left to the lever on the right which is being pulled up to the cross pin with the tail tucked up out of the way. Motor won't come loose and it does present a bit of an issue to a would be the if in the middle of the night looking for a quick snatch and run. Not much of an issue if they have tools but more than nothing.
Sam
Since my post, I want to thank you all that back me up on the use of stainless steel cotter pins and seizing wire out of stainless steel. It really is important folks that you listen to everyone on this because circular rings have no business for the forestay clevis pin. Again thank all of you for that tremendous safety response.
Many furler installations that I have seen on H26 use two stainless straps between the furler drum and the bow tang or bow u-bolt. This often gives rise to use of a second clevis pin supporting the forestay which also needs to be considered.