I am launching my Hunter 23.5 for the first time. Do you recommend opening the ballast vents before you launch or after you launch and tied to the dock? The latter seems more sensible or maybe it really doesn't matter?
Hunter 23.5 launching
- Thread starter Chris Flanagan
- Start date
The boat floats a few inches higher with an empty ballast, so I leave mine closed until after she is floated and free of the trailer. There is no rush to get the ballast filled. Just dont sail until you do.
I think either way is fine. I prefer to open mine before launch as it take a few minutes to fill. I like to wait until everyone (and everything) is in the boat before closing the valve. I would say that it is important to close the valve once filled because even a slightly open valve will allow water to move and escape when under sail.
Having been involved with this boat from the beginning not only as a dealer who sold nearly 20% to 25% of the production line, and much other, I use to show my customers to do the following:
1. Make sure the ramp is long enough to launch. Avoid a busy ramp in the beginning or on a weekday to
learn how to do so.
2. Walk the length where the boat sits on the trailer to the ramp to insure there are no overhead wires, trees,
overhangs, etc. so the mast will not entangle that causing an accident.
3. Put the mast up with the supplied mast raising system (if you want direct advice, feel free to ask here or
send me a private message as I designed the system) and secure.
4. Have a line tied to the bow and one to the stern held by one person or two and back boat into the water.
Highly suggest that the water valve be open and when you do unscrew the big wing nut, put foot on top
of it just to make sure it is down to allow water to enter the water ballast chamber before the boat goes '
into the water. It takes about two minutes to fill the chamber (suggest this as you will not step onto an
unbalanced boat vs. without the ballast.)
5. Back the boat down the ramp and stop momentarily ( suggest practicing backing the boat on the trailer
if you are new at this before going to any ramp for experience). Release the trailer bow strap and safety
chain. Never put face around the winch handle as some have done and got seriously whapped in the
face. Yes there was a lawsuit once by one customer of mine but he did not prevail. Have a firm hand
on that handle. Then back the boat into the water. Sometimes a gentle quick braking will assist the
boat coming off with the trailer stopped. Just insure the line from the stern is behind the trailer guide
post.
6. Tie boat off to dock with fenders attached ( keep fenders on the boat attached once clear of trailer or
will snag on the trailer guide and then put down).
7. Step on board the boat and the first thing to do is look thru the air vent or feel with you finger thru the a
air vent to insure the ballast tank is full and close off the tank by closing off air vent with the supplied
bailer plug and closing that big wing nut. FINIS
I know all this sounds stupid but only to see mistakes made in the past is why I use to teach the above for novices. I too was a novice once upon a time.
1. Make sure the ramp is long enough to launch. Avoid a busy ramp in the beginning or on a weekday to
learn how to do so.
2. Walk the length where the boat sits on the trailer to the ramp to insure there are no overhead wires, trees,
overhangs, etc. so the mast will not entangle that causing an accident.
3. Put the mast up with the supplied mast raising system (if you want direct advice, feel free to ask here or
send me a private message as I designed the system) and secure.
4. Have a line tied to the bow and one to the stern held by one person or two and back boat into the water.
Highly suggest that the water valve be open and when you do unscrew the big wing nut, put foot on top
of it just to make sure it is down to allow water to enter the water ballast chamber before the boat goes '
into the water. It takes about two minutes to fill the chamber (suggest this as you will not step onto an
unbalanced boat vs. without the ballast.)
5. Back the boat down the ramp and stop momentarily ( suggest practicing backing the boat on the trailer
if you are new at this before going to any ramp for experience). Release the trailer bow strap and safety
chain. Never put face around the winch handle as some have done and got seriously whapped in the
face. Yes there was a lawsuit once by one customer of mine but he did not prevail. Have a firm hand
on that handle. Then back the boat into the water. Sometimes a gentle quick braking will assist the
boat coming off with the trailer stopped. Just insure the line from the stern is behind the trailer guide
post.
6. Tie boat off to dock with fenders attached ( keep fenders on the boat attached once clear of trailer or
will snag on the trailer guide and then put down).
7. Step on board the boat and the first thing to do is look thru the air vent or feel with you finger thru the a
air vent to insure the ballast tank is full and close off the tank by closing off air vent with the supplied
bailer plug and closing that big wing nut. FINIS
I know all this sounds stupid but only to see mistakes made in the past is why I use to teach the above for novices. I too was a novice once upon a time.
Thanks Dave and I do appreciate the detail! I went through the retrieval process with the previous owner but not launching. I trailered a GP14 for a couple of summers, but not a sailboat as big as my Hunter. I am keeping the boat at Lake Nockamixon near Quakertown PA and they have great facilities with four nice ramps for launching and also a lot of Hunter's in the marina. I practiced the mast raising and it went smoothly, just hoping the weather cooperates tomorrow. Happy Sailing!
You are welcome and feel free any time to contact me via forum email. I do not share information with anyone to include contact information.
I never open and fill my ballast until after it's off the trailer and at the dock, for the same reason that Crispy gave above: I need it to float as high as possible until it's off the trailer.
Rather than argue the point with anyone who disagrees, let me suggest that it depends on the slope of your ramp. Mine is quite shallow. With the ballast closed, I still have to push from the bow and/or start the engine and put it fill throttle in reverse to get it off the trailer. This is with the tailpipe of my minivan gurgling under water so I can't back down any farther. And of course, the tongue extension is out.
Retrieving is sometimes similar. I get it on the trailer as best I can, pull it up the ramp a bit, empty the tank, close the ballast value, and back into the water again so I can float it and winch it properly up against the bow roller.
BTW, I used to think that string-arming my winch was actually moving the boat closer to the bow roller but after 15 years I finally noticed that it mostly just deforms the ladder and the trailer frame itself. If you don't believe me, try extending and collapsing the tongue extension with the bow strap extremely tight and completely loose. Yes, it took me 15 years to realize that if I loosened the bow strap completely I could extend the tongue without taking a sledge hammer to it. The tight winch strap bends the front portion of the trailer frame up, pinching the tongue extension in its bracket.
If your ramp is steeper than mine, it may well be that you'll notice no difference either way, even if you are slow enough to let the tank fill before taking it off the trailer.
I have a friend who had a H270, the wing-keel diesel inboard model. His ramp is so steep that when he backed it into the water, the boat would float and the trailer would literally hang by its bunks caught on the top of the wings, with the wheels not even touching the bottom. Unfortunately, the reverse was true when he retrieved: the trailer was so deep in the water that the wings would be _above_ the bunks. When he pulled the boat out, the wings came down on the bunks and squashed them flat. Ouch. In the end, he had to drive the boat into position at just the right depth, and back the trailer into the water and underneath the boat. Adding a drop hitch to his pickup made this positioning a little less critical. For various reasons he sold the 270 and has a 260 now. He regrets that: the H270 was nice.
Rather than argue the point with anyone who disagrees, let me suggest that it depends on the slope of your ramp. Mine is quite shallow. With the ballast closed, I still have to push from the bow and/or start the engine and put it fill throttle in reverse to get it off the trailer. This is with the tailpipe of my minivan gurgling under water so I can't back down any farther. And of course, the tongue extension is out.
Retrieving is sometimes similar. I get it on the trailer as best I can, pull it up the ramp a bit, empty the tank, close the ballast value, and back into the water again so I can float it and winch it properly up against the bow roller.
BTW, I used to think that string-arming my winch was actually moving the boat closer to the bow roller but after 15 years I finally noticed that it mostly just deforms the ladder and the trailer frame itself. If you don't believe me, try extending and collapsing the tongue extension with the bow strap extremely tight and completely loose. Yes, it took me 15 years to realize that if I loosened the bow strap completely I could extend the tongue without taking a sledge hammer to it. The tight winch strap bends the front portion of the trailer frame up, pinching the tongue extension in its bracket.
If your ramp is steeper than mine, it may well be that you'll notice no difference either way, even if you are slow enough to let the tank fill before taking it off the trailer.
I have a friend who had a H270, the wing-keel diesel inboard model. His ramp is so steep that when he backed it into the water, the boat would float and the trailer would literally hang by its bunks caught on the top of the wings, with the wheels not even touching the bottom. Unfortunately, the reverse was true when he retrieved: the trailer was so deep in the water that the wings would be _above_ the bunks. When he pulled the boat out, the wings came down on the bunks and squashed them flat. Ouch. In the end, he had to drive the boat into position at just the right depth, and back the trailer into the water and underneath the boat. Adding a drop hitch to his pickup made this positioning a little less critical. For various reasons he sold the 270 and has a 260 now. He regrets that: the H270 was nice.
Chris: If you have a marina slip and only launch and retrieve once a season, it's easy to forget to put on the mast raising "bridles" (some people call them "baby stays"). I forgot once but fortunately it came down without damage. I realized it only when the mast came down beside the stern mast crutch instead of in its slot. Do whatever you can think of so you don't forget!
Thanks Rick, yes I did forget them when practicing lowering the mast and brought it back up and put them in which went much more smoothly! Thanks for all the advice, very helpful!
Rick; I was use to normal ramps most of the time but you are quiet right with shallow ramps and thank you for pointing that out. As for extending the trailer tongue. I use to do that if needed before going to the ramp on a flat area. The wheels are kept chocked and safety chains still attached. Once the trailer is off the ball, then I removed the safety chains. However if you want to extend while hooked up, again chock the forward section of the wheel if on flat only, drop the trailer tongue jack, jack the front of the trailer up enough until the trailer tongue is loose or not connecting to the receiver walls of the trailer or where it slides into. YOu are trying to get the pressure off so it will move forward smoothly. Just make sure the safety retaining bolt is still there so the whole tongue does not come out.
Rick, Thank you so much for that little tidbit of information about the trailer extension and tension on the winch strap. I purchased my 23.5 last fall and had to extend the tongue to get the boat out of the water and on the trailer. The tongue seemed to come out easy enough. But there was much swearing and gnashing of teeth trying to get the tongue back in. I couldn't figure out where the bending stress was coming from, but that makes total sense. Ill add that to my notes. It was really a pain to get back in and I know the strap was tight for transport.
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Rick and Crispycringle; Boy rereading reminds me of those old days with shallow ramps. Ok, after reigniting my old brain on shallow ramps, this may help.
My wife had a dodge caravan Rick so this might help. You know how far you can go in. I use to unstrap the winch strap before going into the water with a 23.5 on a shallow ramp and then hit the brake. Most of the time the boat would come off. maybe with a little practice this might help launching.
As for trying to get the boat all the way up to the winch stand bow roller, never try that but get it as close as you can. Then do the bump by moving forward and brake. Every time tighten up where the winch strap has become slack when the boat moved forward. It might help to put and I cannot think of the pads out of Plastic I think to the bunk boards but that would help a lot vs. the carpet but you have to put a strap over the rear of the boat which I always did. Do you think a conversation on the phone to the both of you would help. been there and done it but it took comments to make my old fartitis brain to recollect that.
My wife had a dodge caravan Rick so this might help. You know how far you can go in. I use to unstrap the winch strap before going into the water with a 23.5 on a shallow ramp and then hit the brake. Most of the time the boat would come off. maybe with a little practice this might help launching.
As for trying to get the boat all the way up to the winch stand bow roller, never try that but get it as close as you can. Then do the bump by moving forward and brake. Every time tighten up where the winch strap has become slack when the boat moved forward. It might help to put and I cannot think of the pads out of Plastic I think to the bunk boards but that would help a lot vs. the carpet but you have to put a strap over the rear of the boat which I always did. Do you think a conversation on the phone to the both of you would help. been there and done it but it took comments to make my old fartitis brain to recollect that.
Hi Dave,
Yes I have done most of the things you just mentioned. And more, such as squirting dish soap all over the bunks before retrieving (might have been Rick Webb's idea?) so the boat might slide better when hitting the brakes.
Thanks for the offer of help; always appreciated (and you and I have indeed spoken at length on the phone over the years!) I actually don't need any help for this; it's all working for me. I really have no trouble launching and retrieving all by myself, but if the ramp was any shallower than yes, I'd be in a bind. I only have to launch once a year so I don't have as much practice as folks without a marina slip. I just wanted to illustrate/justify that it can make a difference in some cases to keep the ballast valve closed until the boat is off the trailer.
Another reason I keep it closed when launching is that on my fresh-water lake, depending on the conditions, the water on the ramp is deep chocolate brown with lots of floating bits of crude (plant matter). I fill the tank at my slip at the deep end of the dock, or even outside of the marina, where the water is very clear. Not that I know that the brown water is going to be a problem or cause odors, but might as well use the clean water!
Yes I have done most of the things you just mentioned. And more, such as squirting dish soap all over the bunks before retrieving (might have been Rick Webb's idea?) so the boat might slide better when hitting the brakes.
Thanks for the offer of help; always appreciated (and you and I have indeed spoken at length on the phone over the years!) I actually don't need any help for this; it's all working for me. I really have no trouble launching and retrieving all by myself, but if the ramp was any shallower than yes, I'd be in a bind. I only have to launch once a year so I don't have as much practice as folks without a marina slip. I just wanted to illustrate/justify that it can make a difference in some cases to keep the ballast valve closed until the boat is off the trailer.
Another reason I keep it closed when launching is that on my fresh-water lake, depending on the conditions, the water on the ramp is deep chocolate brown with lots of floating bits of crude (plant matter). I fill the tank at my slip at the deep end of the dock, or even outside of the marina, where the water is very clear. Not that I know that the brown water is going to be a problem or cause odors, but might as well use the clean water!
Dave, thanks for the offer to help. I dont think Ill have any problem with trailering. At least judging by the off loading a few weeks ago. Im at a different lake than where I purchased the boat. The ramp seems nice and deep and a good angle of steepness. I just couldnt figure out why the tongue extension was so difficult to get back in when I took the boat out last year. I think Rick has the answer.
Generally most ramps have a gentle sloping ramp which does not create issues but it is the shallow ramps like the two of you encounter. For most that is not the case and when launching once a year vs. trailering all the time is also a different matter. One thing I did carry in my inventory or arsenal when encountering shallow ramps as you describe was to change the angle of the trailer. I would use a drop style hitch ball sometimes 4 or 6 inch inverted. I would change that out for shallow ramp issues changing the angle of the trailer for launching but extra caution when off loading. Whatever you find works for you is the way I would recommend.
Remember gentlemen this is a forum to share ideas and I cannot remember everyone's paticurlar situation. There are those who glean information from me and likewise from you to. This is why this forum is great. Each situation has a different twist; however, you know how to get hold of me if you need to pick my brains. As age creeps up, I tend to forget some of those hair raising things I use to do. I have successfully launched boats with mast up using a crane over a bulkhead, bridges, building and so on but those are cases I will not help nor recommend as it will take professionalism to do such. If I can ever find my journal of unusual photos to include a bridge launch, I will post it but will not discuss the details that went into that one. Right now I am trying to get burns on my right leg to heel so I can help a couple of fellows who contribute here with their boats in a few weeks. I help because I want to give back sometimes doing more than most.
Thank you again for your contributions as the information on shallow ramps can be very useful to those like you who have to deal with it.
Remember gentlemen this is a forum to share ideas and I cannot remember everyone's paticurlar situation. There are those who glean information from me and likewise from you to. This is why this forum is great. Each situation has a different twist; however, you know how to get hold of me if you need to pick my brains. As age creeps up, I tend to forget some of those hair raising things I use to do. I have successfully launched boats with mast up using a crane over a bulkhead, bridges, building and so on but those are cases I will not help nor recommend as it will take professionalism to do such. If I can ever find my journal of unusual photos to include a bridge launch, I will post it but will not discuss the details that went into that one. Right now I am trying to get burns on my right leg to heel so I can help a couple of fellows who contribute here with their boats in a few weeks. I help because I want to give back sometimes doing more than most.
Thank you again for your contributions as the information on shallow ramps can be very useful to those like you who have to deal with it.
Crispycringle;
On steep ramps just be careful that the trailer guide ons as I call them do not catch under the hull to deck flange when putting the boat on the trailer.
On steep ramps just be careful that the trailer guide ons as I call them do not catch under the hull to deck flange when putting the boat on the trailer.
Yes, Ive had the pleasure of that happening already. Took me a minute to figure out why the boat was suddenly crooked on the trailer. Live and learn.
You can extend that but would suggest removing the taller ones when traveling. I see I am not the only one up..
Now to work on a brass n scale steam engine this morning. Trying to sell it.
Now to work on a brass n scale steam engine this morning. Trying to sell it.
Hi Chris. I have a Hunter 23.5 at the Nokamixin Marina. I launched it a couple of weeks ago. If you have any questions, let me know. I am up there pretty much every Saturday.
I should have added use one if the two middle ramps for easier launching. Back into the lake until your bumper is about in the water. I was able to unhook and give the boat a little nudge and it floated right off the trailer. They are nice ramps there.