Hunter 216 standing rigging replacement

[Hunter216]

I decided I should replace the standing rigging on our 2004 Hunter 216 for a variety of reasons, not the least being I really don’t know how old the rigging is. I am careful to visually inspect all the components and don’t see any problems but I’m not as positive as I would like so it’s time to pour a little more $ into the hole in the water

This also coincides with my recent interest in synthetic rigging which is one of the options I’m considering.

The 216’s rig is relatively simple and small so this won’t break the bank but part of this thread will be me comparing the current classic stainless wire rigging with more modern synthetic material. The forestay on the 216 is integrated into the furling jib so I won’t be replacing that component and it’s a B&R rig so no backstay (at present) to deal with either. That leaves the upper and lower shrouds, mast tangs, spreader tips, turnbuckles and chainplates to consider.

I also have at least two alterations in mind:
1) The ability to add some additional support without adding a backstay that would interfere with the large roach of the 216 mainsail.
2) The ability to attach the shrouds during mast stepping but quickly bring them to proper tension once the mast is standing. I’m thinking something like Hyfield levers but I’m open to suggestions.

Following are some drawings from the 216 manual for reference.

 

[Hunter216]

I’m curious about the mindset, policy (insurance and official), rules of thumb, etc around the frequency of replacing standing rigging.

I don’t have any first hand knowledge about this but have heard and read some things like, every 10 yrs or some insurance policies require periodic third party inspection.

It also strikes me as odd that boat builders don’t seem to be required to publish detailed information about this rather critical element. Things like Loos gauge or equivalent gauge numbers for the original rig, recommendation on frequency of inspection and/or replacement of components sort of like a best before date system, date of manufacture stamp etc.

 

[shemandr]

I like the idea of synthetics but the reality of a 21 foot boat favors SS wire - I think. If you are hell bent on reducing weight, or would like your launches to be easier not having the relatively stiff wire to deal with than by all means. But I think SS wire will outlast the synthetics, cost less and ultimately be easier to adjust and maintain.
As for the inspections I guess this isn't a requirement because masts falling due to standing rigging failure doesn't happen that much in the coastal market. We all know instances of demastings but the ones I've had first hand knowledge of were related to collisions in races. And not every rigging failure causes the mast to fail. I've seen lowers fail due to punching into a wave but the mast stayed up. Same with at least one spreader failure. Other mast failures can be attributed to having too much sail up for the conditions. Inspections won't fix that.

 

[SkookumZac]

I don't pretend to be an expert but my understanding of synthetic rigging is that it has to be 'stretched' to proper tension. When the rig is down for trailering, the shrouds contract again making it difficult for you to get fast consistent tension on the rigging every time you step the mast.

I have been frustrated with stepping the B&R rig and getting proper tension in a timely manner. A Johnson Lever on the forestay is certainly a good upgrade, but is not compatible with a CDI furler. I have considered adding two Johnson levers--one on each upper shroud. Costs twice as much, tho.

-Z

 

[jssailem]

I decided I should replace the standing rigging on our 2004 Hunter 216 for a variety of reasons, not the least being I really don’t know how old the rigging is.

Well you know it could be 15 years old. The questions are:

1. Is that really only 2 years because the boat was stored in a bot house, pampered by a professional rigger and only sailed by a little old on first Sunday of June during leap years...
2. Or 22 years because the boat sat on a mooring, sailed by Igor who felt "Use all the Sails no matter the breeze", if the rails were not a foot beneath the water the boat was just sitting still, all sailing is racing, all racing is flat out hair on fire green water over the bow.

Inspection is helpful. Knowing your starting place even more so. Knowing how and where you plan to sail equally so.

Reports are that sailing North of the 38 parallel in moderate conditions is easier on rigging than sailing in the tropics. I suspect it is the exposure to heat and cold. Expansion/Contraction, salt water, sailing year round in calm/storm conditions - or just sitting out the tropical storm conditions in a hurricane hole all take a toll on the rigging.

I used all of this to decide on my rig refitting. A great decision. I am very happy with the results.

 

[Hunter216]

Valid points all, thank you.

It’s my perception that there are lots of people out there that have bought a used boat and have no idea how old the rig is or what it has been put through.

I’m just finding my way through this endeavour, attempting to educate myself along the way.

A very interesting thread imho in this forum that I found informative. In particular the DIY fittings that i didn’t know existed and @CloudDiver posting about synthetic.

Any experience with Hi-Mod / Hayn Marine?

Sta-Loc and Hayn "compression" terminal fittings have been around for decades and decades. When properly done by a DIY-er hey're equal or better than professionally done rotary swages in terms of reliablity and longevity. Compression terminal fittings are, however, more bulky than rotary swaged...

forums.sailboatowners.com

 

[Hunter216]

Other mast failures can be attributed to having too much sail up for the conditions. Inspections won't fix that.

True that!!! No fix for sailor error!

 

[Hunter216]

Johnson lever

I tried to use your link and it didn’t work for me. Might have to restart my device.
This is where I got the idea for the Hyfield

Hunter 216 Owner Modifications and Upgrades

Hunter 216 Owner Modifications and Upgrades

hunter.sailboatowners.com

 

[Hunter216]

sailed by Igor

I’ve gone sailing with him, still shaking my head!

 

[Hunter216]

I thought I should measure up my existing rig and I’m pleased that the dimensions match the tech drawing in the user manual. As I don’t plan on moving any of the connection points on the mast the measurements should help me determine how to alter any of the component lengths to arrive at the correct overall length.

This is upper shroud

This is lower shroud

This is the spreader lengths and the end piece that holds the upper in place

This is the chain plate

 

[jssailem]

I went with HyMod connectors. I have 35 foot boat that I intend to sail in remote waters where a failed shroud might need to be repaired. The added expense may not be used but it was a consideration based on ease of repair in remote locations. They are heavier than a traditional swaged shroud.

I would not use them on a Hunter 216.
They are expensive. It is unlikely I would be in a location with the H216 boat that does not have resources to repair a shroud.

A professional swaged shroud (Mechanical hydraulic press) should last an owner their boat life. Half the cost or less.

 

[Hunter216]

I went with HyMod connectors. I have 35 foot boat that I intend to sail in remote waters where a failed shroud might need to be repaired. The added expense may not be used but it was a consideration based on ease of repair in remote locations. They are heavier than a traditional swaged shroud.

I would not use them on a Hunter 216.
They are expensive. It is unlikely I would be in a location with the H216 boat that does not have resources to repair a shroud.

A professional swaged shroud (Mechanical hydraulic press) should last an owner their boat life. Half the cost or less.

Thanks again for your perspective, always helpful. I doubt if I will utilize them in my refit for the reasons you indicate but will included them as part of the review as I hope the end result might prove to be of some value to other users of the forum.

My sailing season has ended unlike you west coast sailors (however I did live in Vancouver for a few years - windsurf and ski on the same day mid winter, miss that) as our play pen gets sort of solid I mentioned that I’m doing this for a variety of reasons. One of the others is I enjoy researching and sharing what I discover, I find myself with some free time lately.

I was something of a Luddite about steel vs synthetic but after splicing up some soft shackles and really loading them up I’ve come around to the realization that the “new” materials have a role to play.

The eventual price/performance differential of just replacing exactly what I have with some alternative might be silly but I’m looking forward to the process of finding out.

Again thanks for your thoughtful input. I’m guessing you are wearing your survival suit this time of year!

 

[jssailem]

Experimentation can be fun. It is a path to innovation.

At onetime I thought the Survival suit might be an option.


But one walks a around like Gumby. Not very flexible getting to and from the mast to tend the sails. I opted for a dry suit.


LIght weight, flexible, and I can sail the boat without feeling like the Micheline Man. It works for me. I still move about the boat like the edge was a 500 foot cliff. I figue the dry suit might keep me alive long enough for someone to find me Or give me enough time to figure out a solution.

Fortunately I have not had to try out any of my ideas. But like they say about sailing. Sail long enough and you are bound to run aground. So I keep exploring.

I look forward to your write up. And one more sail before the holiday arrive or the Marina does a shutdown because the surface water has iced up.

 

[Hunter216]

Having windsurfed most of my life I've tried various "solutions" and like most things there are always compromises. Thick neoprene drysuit is great when your in frigid water (Squamish river/ Howe sound - spring runoff - ice cream headache cold) but not so good on a sunny summer day in English Bay - pass out from heat exhaustion.

Bottom line is if you are in water too long that eventually leads to hypothermia I'm not sure any suit is going to prevent the inevitable. Wise choice you made as the key is to stay out of the water in the first place!

You mention innovation and cold water apparel hasn't stopped evolving either. These guys and others are making some good stuff. The fly on this one is especially thoughtful, not that I have ever peed in my wetsuit

MSOS

Visit the post for more.

oceanrodeo.com

 

[CrispyCringle]

Unless your showing some rust stain near the end pieces or popped strands, excessive kinks, you could probably spend the time and money elsewhere. Just me tho.

 

[jssailem]

Yes. That suit looks nice. Appears more suited for a cold weather operator. I have the Heat model from the same company. The zipper idea would have been a nice feature. Sudden urges are not encouraged. I have learned to stop drinking coffee a couple of hours before donning the suit and setting sail. We do what we can do.

 

[Hunter216]

Unless your showing some rust stain near the end pieces or popped strands, excessive kinks, you could probably spend the time and money elsewhere. Just me tho.

Valid point and good advice about what exactly to look for. My guess is the rigging is original, so 15 years old. I am third owner and although cosmetically well cared for I don’t have first hand knowledge of the first 14 years of service. There are “memory” curves where the uppers go through the spreaders but no other visible signs of trauma. I guess it’s more peace of mind knowing that everything is up to snuff and the 216 is a relatively small boat so not like I’m refitting a mega-multi-mast-monster or MMMM (Did I just invent anew acronym?

The other issue is I haven’t spent my complete budget allowance for the fiscal period, I have to get rid of that somehow or I will have a hard time negotiating with senior management trying to get an increase for next year.

 

[CrispyCringle]

Valid point and good advice about what exactly to look for. My guess is the rigging is original, so 15 years old. I am third owner and although cosmetically well cared for I don’t have first hand knowledge of the first 14 years of service. ......
......The other issue is I haven’t spent my complete budget allowance for the fiscal period, I have to get rid of that somehow or I will have a hard time negotiating with senior management trying to get an increase for next year.

Ahh yes. Understood.

 

[Hunter216]

I find myself going down the internet rabbit hole on occasion. I mentioned above how old our 216 is. I had just assumed it was a 2004 model as that's what the PO said it was. I thought I should be sure because if maybe if I ordered a component that was altered somewhere along the lifespan of production it would ensure I got the correct "version". Little did I know that the little plate on the aft end of the boat would lead to research about how to interpret the "HIN" - No plate that simply reads "Made in 2004"

There is however a second small plate that reads "A660" - I have no idea what that is about.

Turns out the Transport Canada posts this "simple" standard. Not that the Hunter 216 was made in Canada but apparently the USA and Canada have a reciprocal agreement about this so Hunter didn't have to add the "optional" two digit country code at the beginning.

So using this secret decoder ring for my number HUN22275D404 yields that the D4 means it was made in April of 2004 and the 04 means it is a 2004 model year.

Simple EH!

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Hun-Hunter
22-model
275-number of boat made
D- month hull laid
4-year hulll laid
04- model year 2004