How to control the mast rotation

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Kestle

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Jun 12, 2011
702
MacGregor 25 San Pedro
r.oril said:
Sumner - I missed your question on the tention for the stays. Right now I think I am at 20 and 17 but I noticed that the lee stays were a little slack yesterday on the big gusts. I will crank them down some more for the next trip.
I just got 4 new turnbuckles to replace the old ones. The new thrust bearings should be here in the next few days.

It was real cool to watch the mast rotate as I tacked and the shape of the sail looked great. Not having to mess with the furler was a real treat also.
We have found MAJOR VARIATIONS among tension gauges, even from the same manufacturer. When racing, we commonly will bring our gauge over to another boat to measure, if they are really out-pointing us. If you have a chance to sail on a friendly one design race, offering to compare specs with other boats over cocktails will teach you a lot and introduce many life long friends. Gentlemen allow others to use their own gauge on anothers faster boat to understand rig tension better. We keep logs of tension for different wind speeds for all stays on the boat for racing.

We have seen BIG variations among tension gauges, even between new ones.

Jeff
 
Oct 31, 2010
136
88' Macgregor 26D Whiskeytown Lake, CA
I'm in the process of swithing to the rotating mast concept! Like R.Oril, I have a 26D as well. I'm using adjustable running backs and a stock Hobie 18 mast extrusion which is the same lenth as the stock 26D/S. Its also has the same elipticle shape as the 26M mast 3.5" x 5" so its fits the Mac rotating hardware to a T.
Also, I am moving the forestay tang 3' up the mast for more jib sail area. You have to have a beefier mast to move the hardware upwards or your spar could colapse.

I would recommend having your sails re-cut or having new ones made because rotating masts add camber or depth to your sail shape making it hard to "power point" or flatten your main sail when beating up hill.

sail on Garth!
 

r.oril

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Oct 29, 2008
586
MacGregor 26D and Catalina 30 26 - 30 Lancaster, CA
Kestle said:
We have found MAJOR VARIATIONS among tension gauges, even from the same manufacturer. When racing, we commonly will bring our gauge over to another boat to measure, if they are really out-pointing us. If you have a chance to sail on a friendly one design race, offering to compare specs with other boats over cocktails will teach you a lot and introduce many life long friends. Gentlemen allow others to use their own gauge on anothers faster boat to understand rig tension better. We keep logs of tension for different wind speeds for all stays on the boat for racing.

We have seen BIG variations among tension gauges, even between new ones.

Jeff
Hey Jeff, I was thinking that there were many different answers for the rig tension. Lucky for me I have a daggerboard tunnel to support the mast. Last time out I saw some slack on the lee side when I was at 25 degrees with just the main. Question would be, better loose or better tight?

As for the sail, a new M sail cut to fit my mast might be the way to go also.

I received the thrust bearings and will install them today and test them on Monday if the weather is good for Lake Pyramid.
 

Kestle

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Jun 12, 2011
702
MacGregor 25 San Pedro
Sorry, I have no idea on tension for a rotating mast. However, I really suggest you keep a log of stay tension at different true wind and boat speeds. The variation surprised me.

Jeff
 

r.oril

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Oct 29, 2008
586
MacGregor 26D and Catalina 30 26 - 30 Lancaster, CA
Sorry, I have no idea on tension for a rotating mast. However, I really suggest you keep a log of stay tension at different true wind and boat speeds. The variation surprised me.

Jeff
Great idea! Lake sailing is very gusty but I will be sailing in San Diego the end of April and will have time to make adjustments over three days.
 

Sumner

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Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
Sorry, I have no idea on tension for a rotating mast. However, I really suggest you keep a log of stay tension at different true wind and boat speeds. The variation surprised me.

Jeff
I don't have a clue either, but 20-30 lbs. seems really light. We are right in the 280-320 range if I remember right. About what the gauge called for 5/32 wire which is what we run on the forestay and shrouds. The backstay is 'tight' but not tensioned like the other rigging. We don't race and would have no idea how to tension it for racing. We also have the chain plates on the shrouds, so couldn't tension those while underway. Also after what Jeff said I don't have any way of knowing if our gauge is accurate. Jeff when you say they are not always accurate how much difference are you seeing between them? 5%, 10% 20% or more?

Our rigging wasn't noticeably slack when sailing the boat when we got it, but in Canada when I went on another boat I noticed that their rigging was a lot tighter than ours. I asked him, how he tensioned it and he said that he got it to the point where if you pulled on it, at about shoulder height, that it would come in towards you about 1 1/2 inches. Of course we can all pull differently. We then adjusted it that way and made it tighter that what it was.

When I re-rigged the boat...

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/macgregor2/rigging-24.html

...I used the gauge and got closer to what the recommendation was there and that made it even tighter. It is now at the point that I can pull the forestay forward and pin it with the mast raising system and then put the Johnson lever over and pin it and don't have to mess with the turnbuckle like I had to with the hank-on sails.

I know that a lot of people are doing just fine with pulling the forestay forward and pinning it and not even tensioning further with the turnbuckle. Before we got the Johnson lever we always turned the turnbuckle in a good ways after pining the forestay. Seeing the wide differences in tension I guess it isn't real critical on our boats.

I do like how ours is tensioned now. When I go forward and grab the shrouds they are very stable. I think we will stay where we are at as it is working for us.

I could see where with the rotating mast that extreme tension might restrict it from movement. It would be interesting to hear from M owners that have a gauge and know what tension they are running.

Sum

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Kestle

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Jun 12, 2011
702
MacGregor 25 San Pedro
I'm racing in Marina Del Ray Saturday, and will check my log on he boat. Been dealing with a wife and her flu for a few weeks. 1st real outing this year!

Jeff
 
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