How much wind or sea state is too much?

[DrJudyB]

Just a thought for the day:

There are three typical situations in sailing:
*Not enough power
*Sailng Nrivana: Perfectly powered up and the helm is perfectly balanced
*Too much power and there's too much heeling and too much pressure on the helm.

When thre's not enough power, the boat isn't going as fast as it could downwind or working its way upwind effiecienly and effectively. So you and you do every thing to take advantage of the wind that there is. You trim to increase the power of the sailplan by optimizing draft

Nirvana - the sails are perfected trimmed and are getting just enough power so that the helm is perfectly balanced, and boat is sailing flat and fast.

Too much power. Boat is heeling too much. Helm is tugging and the boat is trying to turn one way or the other and you are fighting the helm. You need to depower the sail plan to get back to Sailing Nirvana.

The way you tell the difference between the three states is by the speed of the boat, the angle of heel, and the pressure on the helm. Those are the three bits of input you need to decide what to do.

Learning what a boat "feels" like when it's being sail to its potential is the first step in learning to sail, IMO. That's Sailing Nirvana

 

[spartacus99]

Took the boy out sailing yesterday. I worked on moving the Genoa track block forward and backward and tensioning the sail just right to spill air in higher winds or flow faster across the main. Practiced man overboard drills, got hit with a surprise squall! But saw the wall of white coming and got the sails down fast. No was not in the wx report. Lots and lots of sail trim practice,saw 5.5 kts in 12-15 kts of wind, previous record was 4.9. Also, tried and successfully sailed without a tiller, just balancing aerodynamic loads on the sails. It was really neat how she would, in a gust, turn into wx helm, right up from her heel, then fall off and pick up the original heading. Who needs autopilot!?

Coming home my son looks at me and says, dad I'd rather do this than anything else any day. Aww man. Great evening.

 

[spartacus99]

Sunset picture.. had to turn into the wind so yeah sails luffing pretty hard.. but good pic right?

 

[Leeward Rail]

Sunset picture.. had to turn into the wind so yeah sails luffing pretty hard.. but good pic right?

Spartacus99, reading those two posts has me grinning.

Your son's comment. The concentration on his face in that photo. You showing passion to know everything you can.

It doesn't get any better than that.

When people ask why I love sailing, I try to explain exactly that type of thing.

 

[azguy]

Put some freakin lifelines on that boat, seeing that little guy in the cockpit without them sent chills up mu spine.

 

[DrJudyB]

Put some freakin lifelines on that boat, seeing that little guy in the cockpit without them sent chills up mu spine.

I personally think a boat without lifelines is safe enough for kids (older than crawlers/toddler.) Being only about 2' high, lifeline don't prevent people from falling overboard. People fall overboard above the lifelines. And, on a small boat with narrow decks, they make it very hard to go forward so they constitute a hazard.

The boy is wearing a life jacket, and, IMO, that's the most important thing. I assume he can swim well enough that he wouldn't panic.

IMO, Crawlers and toddlers should be watched by a parent every single minute on board. Netting on the lifelines is a must for such young ones.

 

[Alan Gomes]

Put some freakin lifelines on that boat, seeing that little guy in the cockpit without them sent chills up mu spine.

My local yacht club teaches sailing to kids no older than that using Optimist dinghies, and those don't have lifelines (not to mention the fact that they can capsize).

 

[DrJudyB]

Yeah! Today my 12 year old and I will be taking turns sailing our Pico, a "tupperware" 12' dinghy with no lifelines, just a hiking strap for my toes. He learned to sail in dinghies without lifelines on San Francisco Bay in 10-20 kts of wind.

The forecast is for 87, and winds of 10-20 mph on an inland lake, Woodward Reservoir about an hour from here. We're throwing the dinghy in the utility trailer, with a cooler, and heading out to meet some friends for a beach party.

.... it's gonna be tough on my non-existant abs.

Our "other dinghy" is a 1973 Snark, made of styrofoam. LOL. My son and his friends have been taking that out on lakes by themselves since they were 6.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Nanny State?

IMO, Crawlers and toddlers should be watched by a parent every single minute on board. Netting on the lifelines is a must for such young ones.

My children are 38 and 27. Neither of our two boats that we've had them on when they were growing up had netting. Am I a bad parent?

Oh, those two kids are still alive and active sailors.

 

[DrJudyB]

My children are 38 and 27. Neither of our two boats that we've had them on when they were growing up had netting. Am I a bad parent?

Oh, those two kids are still alive and active sailors.

Just to be clear : I wasn't saying that Stu or anybody else is a bad parent if they do things differently than I would. Just voicing my opinion that children under the age of two require constant supervision while on board and that netting for toddlers under age 2 is a very good idea.

 

[CaptDon01]

On the subject of lifelines, my personal opinion is I wouldn't have a C-22 without them, and both of my current C-22's are equipped with lifelines. I find them beneficial, and add to our secure feeling when in the cockpit, and besides, they provide a great backrest when steering from the cockpit combings when the wind picks up. The bow and stern pulpits, as well as the stantions, are through bolted, and extremely strong. As for the hazard of going forward on skinny decks, why would anyone choose to do that? The Catalina-22,(with the exception of some of the older original design C-22's), have a large hatch for easy access to the forward deck.

View attachment 88774

View attachment 88775

And starting with the "new design" C-22's in 1986, all C-22's came from the factory with the new even larger forward hatch, and the halyards led aft to the cockpit.

Don

 

[jmczzz]

I appreciate Sparta sharing his great day with us, and the picture of son and his comment priceless. Couldn’t help but notice his life jacket. Seems to me skipper dad is doing his job on all counts. Warmed my heart. Thanks James

 

[Gene Neill]

Coming home my son looks at me and says, dad I'd rather do this than anything else any day.

AWESOME.

 

[CaptDon01]

I appreciate Sparta sharing his great day with us, and the picture of son and his comment priceless. Couldn’t help but notice his life jacket. Seems to me skipper dad is doing his job on all counts. Warmed my heart. Thanks James

"Ditto"

Don

 

[Leeward Rail]

I appreciate Sparta sharing his great day with us, and the picture of son and his comment priceless. Couldn’t help but notice his life jacket. Seems to me skipper dad is doing his job on all counts. Warmed my heart. Thanks James

Double Ditto.
spartacus99: You sir are doing EVERYTHIING right IMO.
I wish more people, especially parents, were like you.

 

[Chief RA]

I have a framed picture of my grandson steering our 26' Clipper Marine and it is on my dresser. My wife and I raised him from birth and he is 26 now. He still spends the weekend with us every 2 weeks. Those times are special and I will never forget.
Chief

 

[piedpiperIII]

Wonderful story glad you and your son enjoyed it and IMO no better way to do so.

 

[spartacus99]

Okay I figured out too much! Forecast was for nice easy 10 knot winds so I broke out the 150 % genoa....

Winds rapidly shot to 15.. maybe 100 kts? All I know is the wife is screaming, the side of the boat is down in the water, we are crushing 3 foot seas as we drive straight through them; "walls" of white baywater tossed over the top of the boat. I'm working on something up front and suddenly I'm in the frigging Volvo ocean race trying to tell the wife wife to just let go of the mother ------- tiller! (Happy father's day kids! Add that to your vocabulary...) But she can't because she's on the white knuckled terror ride from hell and needs something to hold onto!

So between trying not to laugh hysterically because it was fun, assuring the kids that none of the new vocabulary they heard was actually spoken, comforting the wife and taking down the genoa... it was a good day and I learned a new limit.

 

[spartacus99]

Also...on a totally unrelated note.

150% Genoa for sale... cheap!

Happy father's day for the old men out there.

 

[jmczzz]

Nice post. I am wondering how the children reacted? Hope they enjoyed and learned more than a new word. I tend to not fly a genny when the mate is aboard just stick to the jib. Avoids a lot of relationship dificulties.
I include myself in the group wished a happy day. thanks,
James