Here we go again... another teen sailor!

[wonkodsane]

Agreed MS!

No driving with kids in the vehicle.

Kids may not ride bicycles, skateboards, rollerskates, or scooters.

Helmets and pads are required for all.

Children are not allowed to run.

Swimming is only allowed when supervised and in 6 inches or less of water.

10MPH speed limits for all (electronic governor on the engine)

All vehicles must now continually play "Pop Goes The Weasel".

Pampering and coddling is a terrible way to turn children into adults.

http://www.ted.com/talks/gever_tulley_on_5_dangerous_things_for_kids.html

 

[Dave D]

Sorry, haven't been on in a few days and don't have time to back read all the way. My 2¢...

Being that the sailor is a minor, the parents should have the right to approve/deny the request to go for it. Since there is no historical evidence that sailors of her experience level and preparation run a greater risk of fatality, then the family's local Government should stay the heck out of it. Further, if her parents want to see little Suzy-Q chase her dreams and support/assist her, then THEY should be on the hook for whatever financial burden a rescue would carry. I just shudder at the thought of tax-payer funded rescue personnel being used to ensure the safety of someone who wants to purposely go off the beaten path on their own personal adventure. We all need to get reaquainted with the reality of the risks associated with reality.

 

[Old Skool Neil]

While I agree with Dave D's position on risk and rescue, his comments included a premise that is typical in many of the posts in support of the current quest:

. . . if her parents want to see little Suzy-Q chase her dreams and support/assist her . . . .

This assumes it's he kid's dream. Nobody around here even considers that the kid might be living out the parent's dream (likely dad's). We've seen recently one instance while the kid is crossing oceans, dad's in front of the cameras with a microphone thrust in his smug face and soliciting reality TV and book deals. I'm not making this up, it really happened.

So while you supporters are telling us we don't know and because we don't know we shouldn't have anything to say about it, remember that there's a lot you don't know either, including whose dream it really is.

 

[Ross]

Mainsail , you left out No sex until age 40, women die in child birth and some young mothers kill their babies.

 

[wonkodsane]

So while you supporters are telling us we don't know and because we don't know we shouldn't have anything to say about it, remember that there's a lot you don't know either, including whose dream it really is.

I think most of us who you have characterized as supporters were careful to qualify whether or not the young lady wanted to do it, not whether her parents wanted it. I know I have specifically mentioned her desire to attempt the task.

As for the cost of a rescue, the expectation is no more or no less than it would be for any marine rescue. Mariners are rescued by coast guards, commercial vessels, and navies all the time, those organizations manage how they are remunerated on their own, regardless of the individual rescued. The young lady and her parents would be required to pay it back, if necessary, just like any one of us that required rescue on open water.

 

[Ross]

I will bet good money that more money is spent on automobile rescues in this country each year than is spent world wide on rescuing sailors. Fire departments , police, ambulance and paramedics, wreck and debris removal highway equipment repair and replacement.

 

[jimmyb]

Maine,
No disrespect but your post using the age of 40 is a bit of an exageration. I dont recall anyone here sayiing the child should or would wait that long. I understand the passion but ya have to keep it reasonable or it gets unbelievable.

When you call everyone opossed a Nanny you have just made the same mistake you are charging them with. The opinions are mostly stated from the view point of imagining sending one of their own out to sea. They too have the right to do what they will with their child. It cant be a one way street. In that no one here has any leagal or moral influence on the situation it is ALL just opinion.

God Bless, jimmyb

 

[Maine Sail]

Maine, you are one smart dude when it comes to boats, but I have to seriously question your liberal thinking (not political liberal, but "let them do anything they want" liberal thinking). Just about everything you listed there has some kind of supervision. Sailing on the open ocean does not.

BIG DIFFERENCE MY FELLOW MODERATOR, BIG DIFFERENCE!

Supervised death is different how? Still dead..... Dead is dead supervised or not. But still your premise is based on a "what if" because a teen death doing this type of adventure has not yet happened.


I guess the difference is in how we were raised. I was raised and spent the large majority of my youth on boats or on the ocean. If I was not fishing I was on my sail boat, not there then I was surfing or rowing. My parents stopped coddling me near the water at around 10 or 11 as by that age I was self sufficient.

I also think you have the liberal conservative thing backwards. You're view point that you know better than I how to raise my child is born out of a liberal ideology eg: it takes a village to raise YOUR child because you are to stupid to make these decisions on your own. This is the same line of thinking that has banned sugars, juices and sfot drinks from many schools because others know better how your child SHOULD be eating..

I oppose the "it takes a village", "your to dumb to raise your child so we the people must step in" attitude with every ounce of my convention. So we'll just have to agree to disagree...

 

[Ross]

JimmyB,Are you familar with the word "Hyperbole"? Four sylibles.

 

[Maine Sail]

Maine,
No disrespect but your post using the age of 40 is a bit of an exageration. I dont recall anyone here sayiing the child should or would wait that long. I understand the passion but ya have to keep it reasonable or it gets unbelievable.

Yes EXACTLY, an EXAGGERATION, to show how CRAZY I feel your position is so I editorialize it with one EQUALLY as crazy...

When you call everyone opossed a Nanny you have just made the same mistake you are charging them with.

I believe I discussed "nanny attitudes" and did not single anyone in particular out..?

 

[Brian D]

Maine, I never said I know how to raise my kids better than you or anyone else. Remember, I lost on of my kids so I take this really to heart. I don't want parents joining the same club as me.

We (collectively) have already been dupped once before by little miss Abby in her statement "I've been dreaming of this since I was 13". And we all fell head over heels on her adventure just to be slapped in the face by the parents and their deals.

So I have said my piece and will back away. I have read everyone's opinion and am glad we had this discussion. Next time we meet on this subject will be when she is safe at home, either by succeeding or failing. Then I am sure there will be a million "told you so".

 

[Ross]

My kids and my grand kids know when something doesn't feel safe. When my youngest was about three we were walking along a sidewalk and came to a steel grate over some basement windows. He was walking by himself and being very independant until we hit that grate and he grabbed my finger just to be sure. He didn't freeze he just wanted a little reassurance.
I have a split fioyer house and there exists a railing on the living room floor side of the stairs. The little kids always think it a grand adventure to walk the outside of that railing above the stairs and some adult has to tell them to "be careful" ,"don't fall". You couldn't pry that kid loose with tools and they are out there because they want the thrill of something a little beyond completely safe.

 

[Steve Dion]

Brian:

What have you started here? 72 posts in a little over 48 hrs. Are you crazy?

PS: My condolences about the loss of a child. We most my nephew at the age of 23 and no one in the family has gotten over it so I feel your pain. It is a hole in you that can never be filled.

 

[Ross]

Death is a 100 percent certainty. We will all die. I have had a brother killed in combat, a cousin murdered, a nephew commit suicide and a nephew that died from a brain tumor, and a wife that died of unknown causes at age 26. I am 72 and have many friends that died old. The ones that I mention died young. Not one of them died doing what they dreamed of doing.
My grand daughter was four when she climbed a ten foot ladder onto my boat to watch me work. I asked if I needed to tell her to be careful and replied witha simple "No".

 

[jimmyb]

My kids and my grand kids know when something doesn't feel safe. When my youngest was about three we were walking along a sidewalk and came to a steel grate over some basement windows. He was walking by himself and being very independant until we hit that grate and he grabbed my finger just to be sure. He didn't freeze he just wanted a little reassurance.

Well if your using this as an example then why not give more credit to the mothers initial reaction to the idea. After all the comparison would lend to the fact that she had some kind of "intuition" and shouldnt that be heeded.

Im sorry but the comparisons of 3 year olds walking over grates is so not relative. Your HYPERBOLE is fanciful but not really along the lines of a real debate.

You want an example, heres one. The local gun club puts on a machine gun shoot. An 8 year old boy pays his $20 and with his fathers full blessing the so called adult supervisors hand him an uzzi sub-machine gun. The kid shoulders the weapon and pulls the trigger. The gun discharges, recoils, pivots in his hand bounces of his trigger finger and discharges again right into his forehead. The child lay bleeding and dies from his wound. Whos fault was it? It certainly was not just a tragic accident it was a mess from the beginning. All the competative shooters in the club petitioned against the shoot to begin with including mysef. In fact it was cancelled that year until the greed of club officers overroad the common sense saftey issues involved. I urged the club president personally and warned he was risking the well being of others and the club itself. We all knew it was a matter of time and we were not suprised when it happend. The father was given a false impression that this was a safe event and it was not. So was his judgement of what was right or wrong for his child correct? It is not always cut and dried. No one in his right mind would let a friggin 8 year old shoot a short barreled short stocked weapon like that. Parents do NOT always have the right idea regardless. They do the best they can with what information they have to work with. Ironically the paper stated this was one of the boys "dreams". His last one.

This is heating up too much for my liking anyway and I think out of the idea of Govt intervention in our lives. As I stated I am against this with all my being and I really dont recall anyone in favor off that here. I would rather hold my tongue from here on than to abraid my fellow sailors. I feel you all have good intentions and wish you all the best and safe sailing to you.

God Bless, jimmyb

 

[Ross]

There is a term that has not been used here yet and that is "Informed Consent". In the case you mention the father was not well enough informed to give consent. He didn't even know what he didn't know. Had probably never fired such a weapon and had no idea of the recoil. I rather doubt that he permitted his son to use a power jigsaw or power drill and certainly would allow him to run a skilsaw. As long as ego doesn't get out in front of judgement most people do alright.
The last words before hospital treatment for a lot of people is , "Hey Y'all watch this"!

 

[Winkfish]

The last words before hospital treatment for a lot of people is , "Hey Y'all watch this"!

The Cajun version is "Hold my beer and watch this!"

 

[jimmyb]

As long as ego doesn't get out in front of judgement most people do alright.
The last words before hospital treatment for a lot of people is , "Hey Y'all watch this"!

Yes indeed!

Ego is huge in the non competetive world of firearms, but believe it or not in competetive shooting we do all we can to make the playing field even by helping others (Very much like on this sight). Makes for much better competition. No bravado there, just the pursuit of shooting center shots.

Not to change the subject but who was the OLDEST to go round the world?

 

[Ross]

This may be the oldest: http://www.dclark.com/sub_proj.html

 

[Douglast]

you know ...a mother brought a child to a doctor worried because the child was exhausted,very little energy,wanted to sleep often.
The doctor asked what the childs average schedule was during the week aside from school.
Mother repiled,music lessons,figureskating,swimming,ballet,gymnastics,basketball,tennis..etc etc having the daughter busy from 6:30 am to 9:30 pm daily.
The doctor told the mother to eliminate several activities.

Why do some kids have to do it all like their life is over at 16...??..gotta leave somethings for later.

My two boys i raised myself...and they were on three wheelers,snowmobiles and motor bikes from the age of three onward..i even seen my one boy come off a rock face withs his sled at 14 the other have a hard hard crash on his motor bike not judging his jump right..thank God for His Grace that they were not seriously injured.

So im not the coddling type,and i really enjoyed all the posts and the views of all..but in closing if my boys were fourteen and wanting to do this sail trip this young lady is doing...i would be on board..different strokes...different folks...have a great safe weekend fella"s