Have any of you tried this....

[Sumner]

We would like to add a traveler for the main, but have spent all of our money elsewhere:cry:. I was reading about an older 32' boat that didn't have a traveler, but two main sheets V-ing down from the boom to both sides of the cockpit. I can get a fiddle with a cam and a second fiddle to make up another main sheet for about $65.

I'm thinking about adding an eye strap to both sides of the cockpit on either side of the center one that the main sheet hooks to now. In normal wind conditions I could just use the one sheet in the middle like we do now. For high winds in particular I could add the second one and put it off to one side and move the one we have now off to the other side. Using one or the other depending which tack we were on.

I'd like to do this for better sail control and to reduce the heeling in higher wind conditions making the boat handle better and to make it easier on Ruth . I also see where in light winds you can use the side opposite the side you would use in high winds for better sail control also.

I can see where the traveler would be nice and maybe someday would like to have one, but can't see where this wouldn't work, just not quite as adjustable as a traveler.

So has anyone done this?

Thanks,

Sum

Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID

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[walt]

You could probably make something work - Id make sure you can change things quickly...

My main use of the traveler is to keep the sail flat and tight but still allow it to be sheeted out in higher winds. Without the traveler, you can sheet way out but the sail gets baggy - not what you want in high winds. I think you can use a vang to somewhat accomplish the same thing - but the traveler does a better job and all the controls are easy to get at.

You also need to be able to change things fast and if I get hit by a gust, I can keep the main sheet tight but release the traveler. My traveler also will automatically tack to the same position on the other side.

The PO must have spent some fairly big bucks on it.. glad it was there when I got the boat.. I did have to rebuild the sheaves in it however - replaced most of the ball bearings.

 

[Sumner]

..........You also need to be able to change things fast and if I get hit by a gust, I can keep the main sheet tight but release the traveler. ..........

Thanks. We would still be able to release the main sheet on the side that was working, as we do now if hit by a gust, as the other side would be slack.

We have the vang now, but in high winds moving the main sheet to the low side of the boat helps to keep the heeling leverage down on the boat that the main presents. At least that is how I think it helps along with being able to keep the main flatter so it isn't as powerful. Both main sheets would be attached to the boom and deck with snap links, so they would continue to be easy to attach or move.

..........The PO must have spent some fairly big bucks on it.. glad it was there when I got the boat.. I did have to rebuild the sheaves in it however - replaced most of the ball bearings.

You were lucky the boat came with the traveler. I can't see how to do a traveler for under $250-$350. I'd like to try and make one at some point just for the he** of it.

Anyone else been on a boat with two main sheets?

Sum

Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID

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[Robspan]

My boat doesn't have a traveler but it does have a couple of eyes in different spots on both sides of the main hatch. I shackle the mainsheet to one of the eyes and have a makeshift traveler. Unless I were going to race the boat, this works fine for me.

If you have a vang, you can tighten that to flatten the main and attach the mainsheet to a spot on the high side. That gives you good mechanical advantage for trimming the main. Of course, on our boats, the vang doesn't work when the poptop is up.

 

[walt]

Sort of a combo traveler- accidental jibe preventer??

 

[MrBill_FLL]

I also do NOT have a traveler.

I use the vang, mostly when running / reaching, and on occasion I've added some bungees to the boom, and my cockpit SS rail, to help keep the end of the boom down.

upwind, I just partially luff the main, or reef.

on long tacks I can see using the outboard mainsheet. but not for short tacking... just too much work.

edit: actually I'm attaching bungy to bottom of stantion...
(see red bungy cord on port)

http://forums.macgregor.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=118494&#post717032

 

[ffaubert]

I'm not sure if this is the same thing you're looking for but the previous owner of my V25 put a board across the cockpit seats just before the entrance into the cabin (sorry, not sure what the term for this is).

There is a track on the board with a Harken block on each end and a slide in between. There is a block and tackle with a cam cleat from the mid point of the boom down to this slide. It looks like there should be a line from one side of the slide to the block, around to the other block and back to the opposite side of the slide to make a circle.

There is a different arrangement at the clew end of the boom. Here there is a sheet going through a pulley on each side of the stern up to the boom then back down to another cam cleat in kind of a continuous loop.

Would that be a main sheet with a traveler? It looks like they're doing the same thing to me. I could take pictures this Saturday if that would help.

Frank

 

[timebandit]

Here is a picture of my poor man's traveler. You have to unload the main to adjust but it is fast and good if you are on a long tack. It also allow the main sheet to be moved out of the way when at anchor.

 

[mcorse]

You can loose a lot of cockpit space with travelers. We've got an 85 M25 that the PO has rigged as a single handed daysailer, part of what he did was to install the traveler track on the cockpit floor just under the companionway and run the mainsheet to a mid-boom bail. Unless you're sitting on the transom you're tangled in the mainsheet.
We went back to the stock end boom mainsheet attachment (with no traveler), but I've admired the Catalina 22's that race on our lake and their stern rod travelers. If you were to invent such a thing, I'd try to copy it.

 

[Robspan]

I'm probably going to get some disagreement on this, but I don't think much of travelers in the cockpit - unless the boat is raced - for the following reasons:

1. If it's in the cockpit, it's relatively close to the end of the boom, so it doesn't cover much sweep. That means it's only useful on a beat or very close reach. If you're more off the wind than that, you need a vang or to attach the mainsheet to a lower point anyway. Travelers located on top of the cabin get a lot more sweep and are therefore much more useful, but our boats have poptops.

2.When I'm at anchor or tied up, I like to sit/lie facing aft with my feet up on the seat and my back against the cabin top. If there's a traveler, I'm sitting on it and that's uncomfortable.

3. I can attach the mainsheet to an eye a little above or below centerline and get almost as much efficiency as a traveler. Unless I'm racing, that's good enough for me.

 

[mcorse]

I'm not sure if this is the same thing you're looking for but the previous owner of my V25 put a board across the cockpit seats just before the entrance into the cabin (sorry, not sure what the term for this is).

There is a track on the board with a Harken block on each end and a slide in between. There is a block and tackle with a cam cleat from the mid point of the boom down to this slide. It looks like there should be a line from one side of the slide to the block, around to the other block and back to the opposite side of the slide to make a circle.

There is a different arrangement at the clew end of the boom. Here there is a sheet going through a pulley on each side of the stern up to the boom then back down to another cam cleat in kind of a continuous loop.

Would that be a main sheet with a traveler? It looks like they're doing the same thing to me. I could take pictures this Saturday if that would help.

Frank

Frank, it sounds like your PO and mine did the same thing. Do you use both the mid-boom sheet and the clew end sheet at the same time? I haven't tried that... I just rig one or the other. Anyone know whats correct?

 

[Sumner]

..........3. I can attach the mainsheet to an eye a little above or below centerline and get almost as much efficiency as a traveler. Unless I'm racing, that's good enough for me.

The above is what I have in mind, but if the need arises I would run two sheets with their block and tackle to the eyes that are off center of the center one. We sail on relative narrow lakes that require tacking often and with the second sheet I wouldn't have to try and move the one from side to side.

80%-90% of the time I see us just using the one sheet either in the middle or to one side or another. I would like to be able to sail in higher winds and take some of the scare factor away for Ruth. It is my understanding that you can delay reefing with the use of a traveler and also have more control with less healing after reefing using it. Hopefully this would have some of the same benefits.

Thanks for the input guys,

Sum

Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID

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[ffaubert]

To Mcorse,

No I haven't tried both together.

Actually, I haven't sailed her at all yet. I'm hoping to get out this weekend and see what happens.

Frank

 

[Robspan]

Sum,
As others have said on this forum, excessive heeling doesn't make the boat go faster - just the opposite - and it increases the scare factor. The trouble is that with the water ballast so high up, these boats are tender up to a point. I think the best solution is to reef early and often.

 

[Sumner]

Sum,
As others have said on this forum, excessive heeling doesn't make the boat go faster - just the opposite - and it increases the scare factor....

Sorry, maybe I haven't been clear.. :cry:. I'm trying to avoid excessive heeling when the wind pipes up.

Besides reefing I understand that a traveler will reduce heeling in higher winds that can be added to the gain of less healing from reefing.

Laying in bed I think I came up with a home-made traveler system that I think I can build for $50 to $75 in parts or maybe less and in a resonable amount of time. It won't be pretty, so Harken isn't in danger , but it will be easily removable so I won't have to look at it all the time or have to step over it.

I found out yesterday that all of the pain troubles I've had for the last 4 months is another hernia so that will probably get operated on next week and sailing will be put off for a month and I can work on smaller less strenuous projects like the traveler.

c ya,

Sum

Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID

Our Mac Pages

Mac-Venture Links

 

[Robspan]

Sorry about the operation. I'm sure we all wish you a speedy and complete recovery.

 

[MrBill_FLL]

I think you could use the base of the stanchion like I did, and call it a day. (OTOH, the stanchion backing is just 4 little washer, so they could be beefed up)

The jib track on timebandits boat looks good and cheap, but its pretty short.. (imho)

my suggestion is get a good 2 line reefing system in place, and do that.

using the traveler, will allow you to carry more sail in higher winds, and go faster* ... but its riding the ragged edge of control.

(which might make reefing even harder)


* = not necessarily faster
Sum, sorry to hear about the injury! take care!!!

 

[mcorse]

Travelers and heeling

Sorry, maybe I haven't been clear.. :cry:. I'm trying to avoid excessive heeling when the wind pipes up.
http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/macgregor/macgregor-links-1.html

Let me see if I can draw some fire here: I don't think that any traveler implementation will decrease heel enough to be meaningful to anyone in the cockpit.
Anyone disagree?
Mike

 

[ffaubert]

Hey Sum,

Sorry to hear about the injury.

I wish you a speedy recovery though, and I think I speak for everybody when I say that we won't mind having you around here a bit more while you're healing (not the traveler kind).

Best of health,

Frank

 

[ffaubert]

Let me see if I can draw some fire here: I don't think that any traveler implementation will decrease heel enough to be meaningful to anyone in the cockpit.
Anyone disagree?
Mike

I'm a new guy as well but I just see a traveler as a way to flatten the main sail, which should make the boat heel even more.

The only ways that I know of to counteract heel is to reduce sail area or decrease the sail's angle of attack to the wind by bringing the sail more parallel to the direction of the apparent wind. That could be accomplished by loosening the main sheet or pointing higher into the wind.

Like I said, I'm a new guy to this so if I'm wrong, please help with my education. I'm always willing to learn.

Frank