Hand cranking diesel

[qbee42]

Sabb

I have a Sabb Model G which we are able to hand start. As described by others, you throw the compression release lever to the open position, crank as fast as you can, then close the compression release lever. The Sabb does not have a glow plug, so that isn't an issue. We do have a 100A alternator on a big pully, and that creates belt drag even when unpowered. I have been able to start it with the alternator connected, but for a cold weather emergency start I would pull the belt, which can be done with one quick twist on a bolt.

Tom

 

[CHARLIE STAGE]

Sorry, to the low battery.

 

[moparv104x4]

I have an old Volvo MD7A in my 1981 Islander B30; it does not have glow plugs. It does have a large flywheel on the front of the engine and I can hand crank and start it without much trouble. Of course this is only a 13 HP engine.

 

[SailingHarry]

Do hook the jumper cables to the starter or to the dead/low batteries? Ed H

That's an interesting question. With Main's recent comment earlier (this thread, or maybe another?) about how an existing dead battery pulled down the reserve when put on "both," I was thinking about just what you asked. I think the answer is the "jump box" lead goes direct to the big wire on the starter. That way, you can turn the batteries to "off" and not draw down the jump box. This is yet another argument for running the alternator direct to the battery (you'd hate to fry your diodes while jumping your engine with the battery switch in "off").

Harry

 

[msmalter]

Dave. I have a Catalina 28 with the M25XPB, have looked at the diagrams on the Torreson site, and cannot find the decompression lever. Can you post a picture of it and its location relative to the other componenets?

Thanks
Mike S

Maine Sail

You mentioned in another thread being able to hand start a diesel on a boat if necessary. I agree and have been looking for a process to hand start a M25XP on an O'Day 35 and therefore have a decompression lever. There is a lot of room in front of the crankshaft pulley. What would be the approach.

Thanks
DaveM

 

[capta]

emergency diesel start

For those of us w/o a compression release, there is an old trick which can get you going again if your batteries are too low to crank a compressed diesel.
Take off the valve cover & put dimes between the exhaust valves & rocker arms. The engine should spin easily w/o compression, then pull out one dime @ a time, starting as a 1 cylinder then 2 cylinder, etc.
Of course it's messy (oil EVERYWHERE), but it should get you started.
I would check clearances on newer turbo engines, this trick has been around a very long time, but newer engines may not have the clearance between valves & pistons, I don't know. Works on Perkins 4-107/8, 4-236 & GM, older (pre-electronics) Cat & Cummings for sure. Dimes only, not quarters, nickles, etc.

 

[RobertLangdirect]

Does a John Deere Model D and 610 with Kerosene Count?

I have a tinker toy Yanmar 1GM. When decompressed I can spin it like a
top with my crank. When I release the decompression lever it stops dead.
Has anybody ever handstarted a diesel without am big flywheel?

I was going to say "yes" but then I see the "without a big flywheel." Dang!

 

[John Nantz]

Proper Hand Cranking Method to Avoid Health Problems

JVB was the only person so far to raise the question about health issues related to hand-cranking an internal combustion engine.

Hand cranking a gas engine can result in a broken wrist from a kickback. Same for diesel ?

Probably because everybody grew up with electric starter motors?

1. When hand cranking the proper way to hold the crank is with the thumb alongside all the fingers. Do NOT wrap the thumb around the handle - if it kicks back it can get broken or, as mentioned, a similar problem with the wrist.

2. The arm should never be straight for the same reason. Always have the elbow bent so if it kicks back the shoulder doesn't wind up with a problem too.

Kick starting a Harley, keep the knee bent or it can throw you over the handlebars.

I grew up with a sawmill that had a hand-crank start engine and also had a kick-start Harley Hog so you learn about these little things. The devil is in the details.

 

[zeehag]

myyanmar has a lever andmy perkins has none. myyanmar has a hand crank allowance, my oerkins does not..i am cruising my oerkins and had been trying to sell my yanmar--is a 2qm20h installed in an ericson 35. my perkins is a 4-108 installed in a formosa 41.

 

[Barnacle Bill]

Well, I have started a sailboat engine with a hand crank and I used the decompression release to do it. But it was a long time ago and I don't remember even what kind of boat or engine it was in or on. Much of the time, as someone else mentioned, you cannot get a full free 360 swing with a crank because the floor or something else is in the way. I also used to lift boats with an old Unit Crane that had a diesel engine and one time I lost battery power and so I then started it with the crank. Trouble is, it almost took off my arm too and it hurt so bad I don't think I talked for a week. That was two or three decades ago.

 

[Nelsonhow]

I used to start my 1GM with the Yanmar OEM hand crank all the time. The crank has a one way cam on th end so that it engages when you turned it clockwise but slipped when the engine kicked in. If it didn't slip when the engine kicked in you'd probably break your arm.

On the 1 GM I'd open the compression release and spin the engine and then flip the compression release. I could try 3 or for times and if it didn't start I'd be to pooped to continue and I 'd rest for a while.

On a 2 GM or 3 Gm I guess you could depress the 2 or 3 compression release leavers and a strong person might get it spinning. I'd then flip only one of the compression leavers and hopefully it would start on on cylinder. Once it start on one I'd flip the release on the 2nd and the 3rd cylinder. May not be great for the motor starting on on cylinder but I don't know any other way to do it.

If you don't have a crank handle that slips I'm sure you'll break your arm.

 

[rpwillia]

Decompression lever on an MX25?

Have done an RTFM and never seen a reference to one. Nothing either about hand cranking. Pretty sure the idea is not a good one. :naughty:

 

[Jim5569]

Works in theory, never tried

Maine Sail

You mentioned in another thread being able to hand start a diesel on a boat if necessary. I agree and have been looking for a process to hand start a M25XP on an O'Day 35 and therefore have a decompression lever. There is a lot of room in front of the crankshaft pulley. What would be the approach.

Thanks
DaveM

I have a 2GM in my S2 9.2 which has plenty of room in front of the engine. The compression realeases must be held open for each cylinder before you can get it up to speed to hand start the engine. Even at 15 HP, I think it would be very difficult and I have never tried it. I believe any engine larger than 8 -10 HP would be very difficult to hand start. I also rely (like many others) on a jumper battery, which I connect directly to the starter for a start with low batteries.

 

[jviss]

Since we are on the topic, ...

... I can comment, having given this a lot of thought. First, it's totally impractical, for most, since electricity is pretty commonly available, and 12V car starters are available everywhere, and cheap.

Having said that, starting an engine that uses a glow plug is a bit of a challenge.

I would design a system that had a hand-cranked dynamo to produce pre-heat power. I don't recall how much current mine draw, but, assuming a couple of Amps each, it shouldn't be impossible.

Then, I'd want a spring-motor or CO2 powered started. My father-in-law had a lawn mower with a spring motor starter, and it worked great. You would it up, and when you were ready to start, pushed a button that released the spring and spun the motor.

A more sophisticated design would use the spring motor in two stages, frist to spin the glow dynamo through a gear train, then fire the crank-turner.

I don't think I'd use the compression release, since I think the air flow would cool off the glow plugs.

 

[alexco38]

If you are going offshore have a look at this hand crank spring motor. Usually used for lifeboats or remote generator known as black start.

http://strongstarter.com/Light.html

 

[jviss]

If you are going offshore have a look at this hand crank spring motor. Usually used for lifeboats or remote generator known as black start.

http://strongstarter.com/Light.html

Excellent!

 

[Gary_H]

Ok, at the risk of sounding totally stupid.....could you sail fast enough to sort of pop the clutch like you used to do with your old truck? or would the prop not produce enough power to turn the engine over. Of course if you had that much wind why would you need the engine.......never mind..

 

[Cayennita]

I have two ways of starting my 3GMD, besides the normal way. 2 -12 volts batteries with only about 5 volts left can be rewired in series and give you enough juice to start the engine with the levers in decompress model.
I also have a Milwaukee 28volt right angle drill with the winch adapter and also fashioned another to bit to fit the engine. Basically the same system as used in Indy type cars. It will turn the engine over with no problem. You can recharge the 28 volt battery very fast with an inverter.

 

[kloudie1]

SO.. all ya need to do is :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-e4lNALU-8w&feature=related
(OK, I know these are gasoline but just saying...)

 

[alexco38]

I heard the old piston engine airplane used to have a cartridge that you fire into the cylinder to start the engine. Saw that in "The flight of the Pheonix". Not sure if that's real or not.