Going to look at a "new" boat.

higgs · Feb 12, 2014

I would not be afraid of a worn cutlass bearing based on your assessment of your abilities. The job is not an expensive one if you do it yourself. You will probably need a puller for your prop. One good way to decide if it wiggles too much is to go around the yard and wiggle other boats props for comparison.

I suspect there are many boats sailing with 40 year old rigging. I know of several sailing out of my club that I don't think have been replaced. It certainly would be better to replace at least the upper shrouds, back and fore stays. To be sure.

I once decided to replace the rigging on a 32 footer I owned one piece each season. The boat was a bout 30 years old. I took forestay into the rigger at Palmer/Johnsons and he looked it over and wondered why I wanted to spend the money. If you know of a rigger perhaps you could have him look it over.

Stu Jackson · Feb 12, 2014

38 year old standing rigging? Gee, whatever made you think it should be replaced? It's like reefing: if you start to think you should...then do it. What's your entire rig worth to you?

Cutlass bearing - if it wiggles, replace it.

Both of these things would be sooo easy to do while to boat's out and the stick is, too.

Then, you do not have to do them later.

You seem to have read all the right things. Not sure why you're asking about these two things, since I've read all those resources and ALL of them are telling you to replace them now.

Good luck, nice boat.

Warren Milberg · Feb 12, 2014

Stu's advice is, as always, right on target. Anything that makes you wonder about is worth replacing beforehand. You never want to be out in a blow, look up at the rig, and wonder "is today the day it fails...?"
Also, I would take a hard look at the condition of: all thru hulls and all wiring. 38 yrs is pushing it for both. The big thing you have said nothing about is hull and propulsion system. Go over the entire hull with a moisture meter or a phenolic hammer. Even if the boat is on the hard, you'll want to rig up some sort of raw water cooling system to make sure the engine can be started and run up to full operating rpms and you can check for oil/water leaks. Unless you can do it yourself, I would recommend getting a pro to check over the engine and do a compression test. The rest of a survey can certainly be done by you using Casey's guidelines. These are nice boats -- good luck with it.

Jackdaw · Feb 12, 2014

Here is another way to look at it.

It's a 27 foot, 38 year old boat. Something of the magnitude of those two issues will occur every year for the rest of its useful life. You just have to ask your self if your are ready to play that game.

Sprega · Feb 12, 2014

Many older Cals had a mild steel welded beam under the glass work below the mast compression post. I believe the 27 was one of those models. You should research what you need to do to inspect it as I understand corrosion and rust can be a problem. The fact that it is a fresh water boat should be in your favor. They are good boats that sail well. Good luck

sdstef · Feb 12, 2014

I haven't seen that boat in person, but I have been contemplating that one for awhile. It looks clean in the pictures. 27 feet w/standing headroom, inboard engine, and ON A TRAILER, for under 10 k ... Even if the wire and fittings need replaced, I would think it is still a good deal as long as the hull is sound. Good Luck!

Chris Burti · Feb 12, 2014

The Cal 27 is a fast, stiff weatherly coastal cruiser. The hull, mast and rigging are seriously overbuilt as was typical of the period. Some of the more common issues were the steel beam mentioned in a prior post, tabbing delamination, deck core rot, and bulkhead rot at the chain plates. All structural issues and all repairable at a reasonable cost except if there is extensive deck core rot. The deck core is plywood and the deck hardware holes were not sealed by the factory. If that is remedied and the bedding is poorly maintained, the rot will migrate extensively. Rudder tube wear is also common and easily remedied with shimming using strips of milk jug plastic. The armature for the rudder is stainless and if there saltwater intrusion, they corrode, often there is accompanying delamination and these rudders often need replacing.

FWIW, the rigging was also overbuilt. I know of several with OEM rigging that are regularly inspected well maintained and frequently sailed in heavy weather. Our former 1973 T/2 is among them. I advise that you pay an experienced and well recommended rigger to inspect the rigging and dye check the swages.

There was a very active and well informed Cal owners group on sailnet, and I believe that they are still active.

higgs · Feb 12, 2014

There are those who have money and they will tell you you gotta replace everything. There are others who are willing to take some reasonable chances. If you got the money, replace the rigging. If not, inspect carefully.

centerline · Feb 13, 2014

there isnt a whole lot of information available on the "newer" cal boats, such as the mk II's and III's... here is a link to about the best site I have found that has the most information collected all in the same place.... if anyone knows of a better site, I would like to know about it

you have probably found that a google search just gives bits and pieces on the cals, and you have to get creative with your keywords to even get the little there is.

I think the mkII did not have the steel beam, but even if it does, not all of the beams became problematic, although the potential is always there.
in my research, I have found the cals were a very well built boat with bigger than necessary standing rigging, but even though its heavy rigging that doesnt mean it ages any less or better than the small stuff, but a lot depends on how it was sailed, if it was moored or if it was all kept on the trailer and in a barn most of its life... we dont know the answers to all the questions, but a very thorough inspection would be in order.
if any piece of it at all shows any wear, it more than likely means it was not kept in a barn most of its life and I would consider replacing it all....

DAVA390 · Feb 13, 2014

RK Larry, you mentioned trailer. It will probably be more than just tires, always something.
I paid $5 grand for a boat/trailer. Had to put tires,brakes,bearings in right away, $1,000.00Told the admiral: "look honey, we just increased the value of our boat by 20%"!!
She was not as amused as I hoped she would be...

Alan Gomes · Feb 13, 2014

Sprega said:
Many older Cals had a mild steel welded beam under the glass work below the mast compression post. I believe the 27 was one of those models. You should research what you need to do to inspect it as I understand corrosion and rust can be a problem. The fact that it is a fresh water boat should be in your favor. They are good boats that sail well. Good luck

Actually, I believe that the Cal 2-27 was *NOT* one of the boats that had the "dreaded steel beam." The Cal 2-27 was on my short list of boats before I bought this Ericson 26-2, and one that I inspected quite closely definitely did not have it.

centerline · Feb 13, 2014

Roadking Larry said:
Centerline - How are you liking your "new" Cal? .

im loving it....

but.. as long but simple as the list of items that need attention is, im finding for every two things i knock off the list, I get involved in other items that I just WANT to change for our own personal fit.... so the time slips away. BUT then its a boat... thats the way boat things go and I wouldnt have it any other way

in the past two weeks I have learned a lot more about the boat (obviously) and why the PO sold it... what I have learned only makes the deal I got seem sweeter.
an oil leak on the engine that we both thought was a side cover gasket leak (a PIA to change- tilt the engine to get the heat exchanger and manifold off) turned out to be oil coming out of the uncapped tach tube.... a 6 dollar cap solved the problem.

Im happy!

Scott T-Bird · Feb 13, 2014

We looked at a very nice Cal 2-27 in NJ when we were shopping for our boat in 2004. It was marked down to $8,500 and when we hesitated for a day, we lost it. For a boat of that vintage, it was in beautiful shape ... very solid throughout and by reputation an excellent boat to sail, if a bit heavy at about 7,000 lbs.

Features I didn't like about it were ... it has a sloping floor in the salon. The floor is actually the hull of the boat (to provide the advertised 6' headroom) and the bilge was very shallow. Complaints I've hear is that if the bilge isn't kept completely dry, you'll be stepping in water.

There was no aft quarter berth ... but it did have 2 large cockpit lockers! Atomic 4 gas engine instead of diesel is a negative to most purchasers. Tiller steering is a positive to many and a negative to many. Porta-potty instead of marine head was probably a positive ... she was a sweet smelling boat compared to our boat at the time.

I've been led to believe that people who own a Cal tend to take care of them ... maybe that's an inaccurate generalization, but that's what I've heard for what it's worth.

I'm guessing the features we found on the boat are similar to what you found.

Scott T-Bird · Feb 13, 2014

BTW, what Jackdaw said, I second (by experience). If you think you're NOT looking for a boat that will require a lot of replacement items and upgrade projects, look for a much newer boat.

Apex · Feb 15, 2014

G/L and congrats Larry