Fuel system and motor mounts

[yelkenli]

1985 Catalina 27, Universal M18.

My engine died due to lack of fuel (my assessment). I put in biocide the prior week (and once before about 1.5 years ago), and either that loosened some crud or maybe it was just time. I have had flawless engine operation for the 2+ years of ownership. The prior owner let the boat sit idle for 5 or more years. The 15 or 20 gallon tank is 1/2 full if the gauge is correct. I bought new filters at end of last year but 'deferred the maintenance'.

My second concern is the condition of the engine mounts. See pics below. I have lots of vibration at high throttle and believe I did not align the engine well enough. One reason on the alignment is the fuel tank is so close to the aft starboard mount, I get maybe only 5 degrees of throw on a wrench.


I will replace the fuel filters in all cases. I am on the fence regarding the mounts and worried tank crud will re-clog the filters.
Possible solutions are:

1. Remove then restore the tank. Easier cleaning. Maybe add access port. Provides room for engine alignment.

2. Replace the tank with smaller. Same as above. Boat is on lake. 5 gallon tank gives well over 15 hours of run time. leaving and returning to slip takes minutes. Smaller tank, less fuel, less breathing and condensation, less bio growth

3. Leave the tank, and dump in some Sea Foam (recommended by my nautically knowledgeable nephew who has worked on every engine out there). Shift the tank an inch or two away from the motor mount to accommodate replacement. I will have to cut a fiberglass lip that is meant to keep the tank from moving. Can restore that after.

4. Dump in some sea foam. Ignore the engine mounts

It is quite possible the filter replacement will solve the issue. But I cannot see in the tank. I might be able to borescope it.

This is an old C27, so there is no room anywhere, and options 1 and 2 might be too much effort.

Thoughts are appreciated.

forward mounts

Aft port mount

Tank

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

We'll defer to you to research the manufacturer of those engine mounts and see what they say regarding replacement. Without anything else to guage by, I would suspect it's based on the current thickness of the rubber pad.

 

[dlochner]

To peer into the tank, remove the fuel level sender. There are 5 bolts securing it and a nitrile gasket. You won't see the whole bottom, but a good portion of it. That can help guide your decision.

Other wise, continue using a biocide, BioBor JF is probably the most effective as rated by Practical Sailor several years ago. Look for sales on fuel filters and keep a couple of spares.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

If I understand, your “deferred maintenance” was to buy but not install new filters. and after running a while, you have engine problems. I am confused.

If I infer correctly, you could have some clogged injectors. Or clogged filter.

 

[jssailem]

Just above the tank serial number near the fuel valve, there appears to be a fuel gauge. It is secured with bolts/screws that appear to be removable with a 6-sided socket. This might give you access to look inside the tank.

Applying Occam's Razor to the question of why the engine died, fuel starvation is a logical conclusion. The easiest fix for this symptom would be to replace the fuel filter. Note, there may be more than one filter between the tank and the engine injectors. Additionally, there may be a screen on the bottom of the intake tube for the fuel line that is clogged

If alignment is the issue, then new mounts may or may not resolve anything. I would look to properly align the engine before replacing the mounts.

I think you are on the right path.
.

 

[marcham]

Engine mounts only last about 1000 hrs, then require replacement. They are likely due.

As for the engine quitting, there can be many causes.

When was the exhaust elbow last cleaned out?

When was the primary and secondary fuel filters last replaced? On most engines with clean fuel, they should be replaced at every 300 hrs or annually.

Biocide and lubricity enhancer should be added to EVERY fill up (before adding fuel).

Over time, crud and water builds up in the bottom of the tank. Swell and waves can shake this up and cause it to go up into the fuel intake tube (which sits about 1" off the bottom of the tank). Most marine diesel tanks need a good cleathing every 10 years, more often if bad fuel is added or the boat goes unused for long periods (burning less than 1-2 fuel tank per year). Most sailboats do not have a bottom drain for the diesel tank, so you need a system to "power wash" the inside of the tank with diesel and suck out / polish the crud. Most of the time, the polished fuel can be put back in the tank (it's expensive to dispose of fuel).

To help diagnose, please remove both fuel filters and cut them open so we can see what we are dealing with. A diesel needs air, clean fuel and compression to run.

You'll need to bleed the injectors after replacing the filters, it won't start with the smallest air bubble in the lines.

When was the last oil change? valve check?

When was the engine output shaft last aligned with the prop drive shaft?

 

[yelkenli]

Biocide and lubricity enhancer should be added to EVERY fill up (before adding fuel).

This is an issue for my type of sailing - lake sailing. The next fill up is years from now. I do not motor long/far enough to burn much fuel and the tank is large. Let's say 10 gallons at 1/2 tank, 0.4 gph is 25 hours of run time. Out of the marina and back is probably 20 minutes, gives maybe 75 sails. I would be lucky to sail every other weekend a year. And as you can see, I am not that lucky.

I would bet the previous owners never cleaned the tank. Old boat. Old tank with old crud. Old mounts.

 

[dlochner]

This is an issue for my type of sailing - lake sailing. The next fill up is years from now. I do not motor long/far enough to burn much fuel and the tank is large. Let's say 10 gallons at 1/2 tank, 0.4 gph is 25 hours of run time. Out of the marina and back is probably 20 minutes, gives maybe 75 sails. I would be lucky to sail every other weekend a year. And as you can see, I am not that lucky.

I would bet the previous owners never cleaned the tank. Old boat. Old tank with old crud. Old mounts.

What biocide are you using? They are all not equally effective.

Diesel Biocides Take On Contaminated Boat Fuel - Practical Sailor

Since 1974, Practical Sailor’s independent testing has taken the guesswork out of boat and gear buying.

www.practical-sailor.com

 

[yelkenli]

Just above the tank serial number near the fuel valve, there appears to be a fuel gauge. It is secured with bolts/screws that appear to be removable with a 6-sided socket. This might give you access to look inside the tank.

To peer into the tank, remove the fuel level sender. There are 5 bolts securing it and a nitrile gasket.

Does the nitrile gasket need to be replaced? Cut one out of a nitril glove? or where to get replacement?

 

[dlochner]

If the gasket is in good shape, reuse it. If it is deteriorated, then make a new one from an oil resistant gasket material, usually based on nitrile. An auto parts store probably has the material.

 

[Michael Davis]

Engine mounts only last about 1000 hrs, then require replacement

A lot of manufacturers recommend every 5 years which works out to about 1000 hrs for me. Not sure mine were ever changed before I got the boat but I did change them. Engine is just over 7000 hrs. Having said that about mounts I have never changed one on a car in 65 years of driving .
I have cleaned my fuel tank a couple of times by sucking all the fuel out using a West Marine oil change vacuum pump and running it though an off line filter system. If the end of the suction tube is set to the low point of your tank you should get most of the crud.
Diesel fuel grows stuff…a biocide is really necessary.
I change fuel filters about every second year ( about 400 hrs)
If you plan on having the alignment checked do it after you change the mounts.
High RPM vibration may be a cutless bearing ( another thing to check)