We just had a survey done ( $700.00 yard and survey fees ) on what we thought was a pretty good condition Catalina 27. Turns out that the owner neglected (on purpose I'm sure) to tell us that the boat had not had a bottom job of any kind for a period of at least 5 years until this past October which is probably what made the bottom look like a blister infestation. Estamation cost of repair for the entire hull ONLY is $3,500.00 to $5,000.00 depending on what they find during blister examination. Had I have known that the boat had been that neglected for that long, I would have never bothered to take it out of the water. I would have walked away. With the bottom job and other things that need to be repaired, cost of fixing just the important stuff, example...3 shrouds, 2 keel bolts, rusted backing plate to the steering pedastal, ETC...Estimate total costs of necessary repair is reaching about 7,000 dollars... we have decided to walk away from it. I realize that this is probably a dumb question, but do you ever have any recourse for something like this??...other than walking away? Is there any way of telling what your getting into hull wise before you pull it out of the water? Thanks guys...new to this. I guess it's the lying of the owner that makes me want to sue. By the way....the boat lies in Sarasota, Fl.
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LaDonna Bubak - Planet Catalina
Walk away
Forget about suing. View this as a learning experience. Now you have a whole new set of questions to ask a boat owner when looking to buy. When was the last haulout? Did you haul it every year? What's the condition of the bottom? Etc. It might be worth your while in the future to hire a diver first to check it out before hauling out. But quite honestly, I'm rather surprised by the figures you've quoted. $700 for a haulout & survey??? That seems pretty steep to me. And $5000 to fix some blisters??? Man, the bottom must just be one big blister! Have you thought about doing it yourself? When I bought my boat, she had about a zillion blisters (that's why I got the deal I did) which I fixed myself for just a few hundred bucks. Not a fun job but not really that difficult. BTW, if you've paid for that survey yourself, DO NOT give it to the owner of the vessel if you decide not to buy. They should pay you at least half the cost if they want the survey to sell it in the future. Good luck in your search! LaDonna
Forget about suing. View this as a learning experience. Now you have a whole new set of questions to ask a boat owner when looking to buy. When was the last haulout? Did you haul it every year? What's the condition of the bottom? Etc. It might be worth your while in the future to hire a diver first to check it out before hauling out. But quite honestly, I'm rather surprised by the figures you've quoted. $700 for a haulout & survey??? That seems pretty steep to me. And $5000 to fix some blisters??? Man, the bottom must just be one big blister! Have you thought about doing it yourself? When I bought my boat, she had about a zillion blisters (that's why I got the deal I did) which I fixed myself for just a few hundred bucks. Not a fun job but not really that difficult. BTW, if you've paid for that survey yourself, DO NOT give it to the owner of the vessel if you decide not to buy. They should pay you at least half the cost if they want the survey to sell it in the future. Good luck in your search! LaDonna
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John Mavrovich
You paid a lot.
I agree with Ladonna. Your $700 cost seems excessive. You should consider shopping for a better price for the next survey/haulout. Now after taking a deep breath, think about this boat again. Did you like the boat otherwise? Consider using this survey as a negotiating tool and see if the seller will pay the cost of the blister repair. He may be willing as other buyers will walk away also. Good luck.
I agree with Ladonna. Your $700 cost seems excessive. You should consider shopping for a better price for the next survey/haulout. Now after taking a deep breath, think about this boat again. Did you like the boat otherwise? Consider using this survey as a negotiating tool and see if the seller will pay the cost of the blister repair. He may be willing as other buyers will walk away also. Good luck.
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Bob Carlton
Repair invoices
Most careful owners keep all repair and maintenence receipts. Ask to see them prior to haul-out/ survey. If the owner doesn't have any receipts, that may tell you something about how the owner has cared for the boat.
Most careful owners keep all repair and maintenence receipts. Ask to see them prior to haul-out/ survey. If the owner doesn't have any receipts, that may tell you something about how the owner has cared for the boat.
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Clive
Outboards versus inboards
I've looked at a number of Catalina 27s from the mid 70s around here. Almost all seem to have propane stove and gas outboards. I've sailed quite a sailboats- but never one with an outboard. The idea of keeping fuel out of the people compartment is appealing. There must be a downside to having an outboard rather than an inboard. What is it? I'd be grateful for expert opinion on this.......
I've looked at a number of Catalina 27s from the mid 70s around here. Almost all seem to have propane stove and gas outboards. I've sailed quite a sailboats- but never one with an outboard. The idea of keeping fuel out of the people compartment is appealing. There must be a downside to having an outboard rather than an inboard. What is it? I'd be grateful for expert opinion on this.......
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Gary Jensen
yard fees????
How did a yard arrive at the $700 fee. In your writing you specified that it was a separate fee from the survey. What was the breakdown?? they hauled it and they put it back in the water. The boat is only 27 feet. How did the bill get so high???Were there other tasks done by the yard? Even with a pressure wash its more than double of costs that I v seen. What area are you in? East or West Coast?
How did a yard arrive at the $700 fee. In your writing you specified that it was a separate fee from the survey. What was the breakdown?? they hauled it and they put it back in the water. The boat is only 27 feet. How did the bill get so high???Were there other tasks done by the yard? Even with a pressure wash its more than double of costs that I v seen. What area are you in? East or West Coast?
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Dan Ryder
LaDonna's right, as usual
I spent several thousand dollars looking for my new boat. I think my surveyor's kid has now transferred from a JC to Harvard based on my contributions to his personal wealth. But it was money well spent. I too got jacked around, but my jacking was by the broker who claimed not to know anything, let alone have any receipts or other records. The one thing I had was a reputable and certified surveyor. It took us 4 boats at a cost of roughly 5% of the boat I finally bought, but I look at that as 95% not wasted. If I'd had a diver on the first boat, I wouldn't have hauled out. If I'd had a diver on boats 2 & 3, they wouldn't have seen anything noteworthy. Boat 2 failed on engine and transmission troubles and boat 3 on severe (but invisible) water intrusion in the deckhouse and foredeck. Your haulout sounds pretty darned expensive – I'm guessing the owner got a pressure-washing at your expense - and there is the possiblity that the yard screwed up your bill, charging you for work done on another boat or some such error. I'd ask 'em to recalculate. And next time, ask what it's going to cost before the boat is in the sling.
I spent several thousand dollars looking for my new boat. I think my surveyor's kid has now transferred from a JC to Harvard based on my contributions to his personal wealth. But it was money well spent. I too got jacked around, but my jacking was by the broker who claimed not to know anything, let alone have any receipts or other records. The one thing I had was a reputable and certified surveyor. It took us 4 boats at a cost of roughly 5% of the boat I finally bought, but I look at that as 95% not wasted. If I'd had a diver on the first boat, I wouldn't have hauled out. If I'd had a diver on boats 2 & 3, they wouldn't have seen anything noteworthy. Boat 2 failed on engine and transmission troubles and boat 3 on severe (but invisible) water intrusion in the deckhouse and foredeck. Your haulout sounds pretty darned expensive – I'm guessing the owner got a pressure-washing at your expense - and there is the possiblity that the yard screwed up your bill, charging you for work done on another boat or some such error. I'd ask 'em to recalculate. And next time, ask what it's going to cost before the boat is in the sling.
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Clarity
It seems to me that the Surveyor should have advised you to ask certain questions. Any thoughts on this?
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Gordon S.
Survey Cost
John, Just to clarify costs, I bought an 88 C27 last Spring through a reputable broker in the NY area. The boat was displayed on the blocks. The surveyor I chose charged $500. This was for 2 visits. The first was a hull survey done on the hardstand and verified the hull/rigging OK. The second was after launching and checked out the engine, transmission, electrics, and electronics. There was a written formal report required. Unfortunately he never sent me a formal report on the second part but everything was OK. The written hull portion of the survey was enough to get me the insurance on the boat. (Survey required by the insurance company and insurance by my marina.) I did not have to haul out but $200 for a haul and block would not be unreasonable for our greater NY boating area. I guess my message is to shop for boats when they are in storage so you can form your own opinion of condition before going the surveyor route. Good Luck.
John, Just to clarify costs, I bought an 88 C27 last Spring through a reputable broker in the NY area. The boat was displayed on the blocks. The surveyor I chose charged $500. This was for 2 visits. The first was a hull survey done on the hardstand and verified the hull/rigging OK. The second was after launching and checked out the engine, transmission, electrics, and electronics. There was a written formal report required. Unfortunately he never sent me a formal report on the second part but everything was OK. The written hull portion of the survey was enough to get me the insurance on the boat. (Survey required by the insurance company and insurance by my marina.) I did not have to haul out but $200 for a haul and block would not be unreasonable for our greater NY boating area. I guess my message is to shop for boats when they are in storage so you can form your own opinion of condition before going the surveyor route. Good Luck.
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