The strut on my 76 cat 27 had been repaired in the past (who knows when) and there had been some water intrusion into the fiberglass. I had it repaired and it luckily wasn't very deep or far. I also noticed while starting to take off the 10000 coats of bottom paint that the whole gelcoat below the waterline is covered with little tiny cracks, not blisters. The marine fiberglass repair guy said that I should have the whole bottom sanded down and new gelcoat applied. Obviously not worth for this old boat... So, my question is what to do??? keep applying more layers of bottom paint? Take the bottom paint off and then reapply new coat after coat to build it up again??? Or is there another way to take the bottom paint off to the gelcoat and the another kind of paint to apply so the new bottom coats won't eventually crack through... Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks!
fine gelcoat cracks all over below waterline :(
- Thread starter markus
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The key words here are....
'the fiberglass repair guy says'.... and such a deal he wouldn't make his mother, but for you; he'll recoat the whole bottom for 1/2 the value of the boat. I obviously don't know your fiberglass guy, he might a good honest businessman and is giving you his best advice. Then again, there are some unscupulous folks that think boaters are rich and like making money off concerned boat owners with horror stories. The fact is, gelcoat cracks are inevitable over time. If they are truly little hair line cracks I wouldn't sweat it. Sand it down to the gelcoat; throw a barrier coat on and paint the bottom. I'd bet your bottom will be fine for years. At least that's what I'd tell you not having actually seen the bottom myself. Post a picture. I'm guessing, not unlike myself, most folks around here are much better at looking at pictures, than reading anyway.
'the fiberglass repair guy says'.... and such a deal he wouldn't make his mother, but for you; he'll recoat the whole bottom for 1/2 the value of the boat. I obviously don't know your fiberglass guy, he might a good honest businessman and is giving you his best advice. Then again, there are some unscupulous folks that think boaters are rich and like making money off concerned boat owners with horror stories. The fact is, gelcoat cracks are inevitable over time. If they are truly little hair line cracks I wouldn't sweat it. Sand it down to the gelcoat; throw a barrier coat on and paint the bottom. I'd bet your bottom will be fine for years. At least that's what I'd tell you not having actually seen the bottom myself. Post a picture. I'm guessing, not unlike myself, most folks around here are much better at looking at pictures, than reading anyway.
Don't sweat it
Gelcoat has no structural or preventative purpose. It is solely for cosmetics to cover up the fiberglass matt that would otherwise show through. Boat owners want a smooth finish, not the checkerboard look of fiberglass matt. Unless you are getting blisters or the underlying fiberglass is cracking, then don't worry about the gelcoat. If you do decide to do something you could sand it all off and then apply a barrier coat, and you could do that yourself. I would just put on anti-fouling paint and go sailing.
Gelcoat has no structural or preventative purpose. It is solely for cosmetics to cover up the fiberglass matt that would otherwise show through. Boat owners want a smooth finish, not the checkerboard look of fiberglass matt. Unless you are getting blisters or the underlying fiberglass is cracking, then don't worry about the gelcoat. If you do decide to do something you could sand it all off and then apply a barrier coat, and you could do that yourself. I would just put on anti-fouling paint and go sailing.
I agree...
those are just stress cracks that happen when the boat is hauled/hoisted out of the water and sits in a cradle (for years on end)...check the stringers in the bilge...if they are cracked or breaking free from the hull structure, then, it might be a different story.
those are just stress cracks that happen when the boat is hauled/hoisted out of the water and sits in a cradle (for years on end)...check the stringers in the bilge...if they are cracked or breaking free from the hull structure, then, it might be a different story.
Bottom cracks
Hi markus most boats have some cracks in the bottom .I would check with MM and see if anty place is more wet then others if so i would grind the cracks let dry with some heat and epoxy coat .If its reads the same all over then it not a problem .You can just sand and epoxy coat prime and paint .I striped my boat a few weeks ago with scrapers it took 5 hours with lots of beer and six guys.Now im sand ing it down to smooth and removeing the paint in all the pock marks .sanding is much harder then scraping then im useing interlux 2000 and bottom paint Ps if you have no MM you can check your hull for dryness with clear plastic and duck tape.On a dry day wipe the hull with fiber glass cleaner then tape the plastic on the hull let the boat sit for a few days if the plastic has water vapor in it .It will need to be dryed at some point.My boat is bone dry but wile im cleaning the bottom im puting a new barrier coat on. John
Hi markus most boats have some cracks in the bottom .I would check with MM and see if anty place is more wet then others if so i would grind the cracks let dry with some heat and epoxy coat .If its reads the same all over then it not a problem .You can just sand and epoxy coat prime and paint .I striped my boat a few weeks ago with scrapers it took 5 hours with lots of beer and six guys.Now im sand ing it down to smooth and removeing the paint in all the pock marks .sanding is much harder then scraping then im useing interlux 2000 and bottom paint Ps if you have no MM you can check your hull for dryness with clear plastic and duck tape.On a dry day wipe the hull with fiber glass cleaner then tape the plastic on the hull let the boat sit for a few days if the plastic has water vapor in it .It will need to be dryed at some point.My boat is bone dry but wile im cleaning the bottom im puting a new barrier coat on. John
INTERESTING RESPONSES
Nice to discover these responses, confirms another response I got. I have an 18'6" kevlar canoe along the side of my house that I have kept under a tarp for several years. When the last windstorm took the cover off I went out to re-cover it and discovered the entire bottom covered with little spider vein cracks in the gelcoat. I asked the manufacturer about it at the boatshow and was told to not worry about leakage and just use an abrasive rubbing compound to help remove the cracks or even a super fine grit sanding then re-wax with a good polish & wax. The kevlar will not leak and the gelcoat is cosmetic. This may be ok for a canoe but I would cry if the same thing happened to my sailboat.
Nice to discover these responses, confirms another response I got. I have an 18'6" kevlar canoe along the side of my house that I have kept under a tarp for several years. When the last windstorm took the cover off I went out to re-cover it and discovered the entire bottom covered with little spider vein cracks in the gelcoat. I asked the manufacturer about it at the boatshow and was told to not worry about leakage and just use an abrasive rubbing compound to help remove the cracks or even a super fine grit sanding then re-wax with a good polish & wax. The kevlar will not leak and the gelcoat is cosmetic. This may be ok for a canoe but I would cry if the same thing happened to my sailboat.
Epoxy Barrier Coat..
Sand the bottom to the Gelcoat and sound it as best you can..I suspect you'll find no real damage.However..you do want to prvent water from migrating (as best you can) into the "Glass works so I'd use an Epoxy Barrier Coat (available at most Marine Stores) and do the job yourself..this is a more permanant and for sure cheaper solution to your problem. Good Luck>>> David
Sand the bottom to the Gelcoat and sound it as best you can..I suspect you'll find no real damage.However..you do want to prvent water from migrating (as best you can) into the "Glass works so I'd use an Epoxy Barrier Coat (available at most Marine Stores) and do the job yourself..this is a more permanant and for sure cheaper solution to your problem. Good Luck>>> David
In the old days
Back in the early 60's some fiberglass boats did not have gell coat below the water line, including my '64 Eastwind sloop. I owned this boat from '76 - '90 and never had a blister or any problem with the bottom. If the bottom is down to bare gellcoat I would consider squeeging a thin layer of west over the bottom to seal the cracks (let dry and then lightly sand), lay down a half dozen coats on Interlux 2000 (all on the same afternoon), then some bottom paint and go sailing and forget about it.
Back in the early 60's some fiberglass boats did not have gell coat below the water line, including my '64 Eastwind sloop. I owned this boat from '76 - '90 and never had a blister or any problem with the bottom. If the bottom is down to bare gellcoat I would consider squeeging a thin layer of west over the bottom to seal the cracks (let dry and then lightly sand), lay down a half dozen coats on Interlux 2000 (all on the same afternoon), then some bottom paint and go sailing and forget about it.
why not just bottom paint it one more time???
Thanks for all the replies!!! It makes me think that it is not as big of a deal as i thought. So, my question is, why not just paint a couple more layers of bottom shield on it this year and deal with it next year. Since I just got the boat last year, I don't think that this is a new issue with this boat, and it still floats just fine...
It would of course take a long time to take all the current layers off. I don't like the toxicity of bottom shield even with a mask and shield. The paintdust would fly all over the place and I am sure the horses, dog, cats would not like to indirectly ingest it either. Although the way the weather has been it would be perfect wetsanding season here... <P> I am not sure if I am going to keep the boat for long, or upgrade to a 30 some next year. We are putting in at Sandusky, Lake Erie, this year... and I hope to cruise around Erie this summer. A 30 some would be nicer for the family but also substantially more expensive, unless I find a tired one that I could haul back to the middle of Ohio and work on for the off season. I guess nothing wrong with looking at an old land-yacht the rest of the year.
Thanks for all the replies!!! It makes me think that it is not as big of a deal as i thought. So, my question is, why not just paint a couple more layers of bottom shield on it this year and deal with it next year. Since I just got the boat last year, I don't think that this is a new issue with this boat, and it still floats just fine...
It would of course take a long time to take all the current layers off. I don't like the toxicity of bottom shield even with a mask and shield. The paintdust would fly all over the place and I am sure the horses, dog, cats would not like to indirectly ingest it either. Although the way the weather has been it would be perfect wetsanding season here... <P> I am not sure if I am going to keep the boat for long, or upgrade to a 30 some next year. We are putting in at Sandusky, Lake Erie, this year... and I hope to cruise around Erie this summer. A 30 some would be nicer for the family but also substantially more expensive, unless I find a tired one that I could haul back to the middle of Ohio and work on for the off season. I guess nothing wrong with looking at an old land-yacht the rest of the year.
If it were my boat
I would do nothing - a new coat of bottom paint if she is going to be in for most of the summer. Worse case scenario: The boat sinks this spring and you lose whatever $ you put in. Best case: You have a lot of fun with the boat and sell it to move up and only lose $1000 on resale.
I would do nothing - a new coat of bottom paint if she is going to be in for most of the summer. Worse case scenario: The boat sinks this spring and you lose whatever $ you put in. Best case: You have a lot of fun with the boat and sell it to move up and only lose $1000 on resale.
paint dust
Markus, You mentioned not wanting to generate paint dust. The dust-collecting canister on my Porter-Cable random-orbit sander comes apart, and the sander end plugs into the hose on my Craftsman shop vac (with a little jury rigging) . Last summer, I got rid of most of my old bottom paint with various paint removers, and then finished the job with the sander-shop-vac arrangement. No dust. The vac is so powerful, that everything gets sucked up.
Markus, You mentioned not wanting to generate paint dust. The dust-collecting canister on my Porter-Cable random-orbit sander comes apart, and the sander end plugs into the hose on my Craftsman shop vac (with a little jury rigging) . Last summer, I got rid of most of my old bottom paint with various paint removers, and then finished the job with the sander-shop-vac arrangement. No dust. The vac is so powerful, that everything gets sucked up.
got starboard all scraped down...
I have scraped down the starboard side of the catalina 27... Nice workout! Let's wait to see how my rubber arms will hurt tomorrow. There were at least 4 different colors of stuff on it... and then who knows how many coats of each... it was pretty thick!!! It is now smooth with only a little primer and white gelcoat showing. There are a bunch of little cracks and actually I will have to do some gelcoat repair where some gelcoat splintered off. But after that I should be fine to put the epoxy barrier on it. My question is, how well will the epoxy barrier fill in the little cracks? Will the original cracks crack through the epoxy paint??? You probably have to put 4 to 5 layers on , but if it will crack through again... why not just sand it down and gelcoat the whole thing... not that I want to do it, but I have done a lot of drywall sanding and sculptiing with JC in my lifetime and it doesn't seem that hard to do. Just like autobody filler... any ideas, comments?
I have scraped down the starboard side of the catalina 27... Nice workout! Let's wait to see how my rubber arms will hurt tomorrow. There were at least 4 different colors of stuff on it... and then who knows how many coats of each... it was pretty thick!!! It is now smooth with only a little primer and white gelcoat showing. There are a bunch of little cracks and actually I will have to do some gelcoat repair where some gelcoat splintered off. But after that I should be fine to put the epoxy barrier on it. My question is, how well will the epoxy barrier fill in the little cracks? Will the original cracks crack through the epoxy paint??? You probably have to put 4 to 5 layers on , but if it will crack through again... why not just sand it down and gelcoat the whole thing... not that I want to do it, but I have done a lot of drywall sanding and sculptiing with JC in my lifetime and it doesn't seem that hard to do. Just like autobody filler...
any ideas, comments?
Markus, My '68 Islander has that spider web of
little cracks all over the bottom. I painted on four coats of epoxy barrier coat and two of anti fouling paint but they still show through. I don't believe that they are a problem. The boat had been on the hard for 14 years when I finally launched her in 1999 after the rebuild. A close inspection of the bottom this and every spring shows no changes. Nothing is growing, there are no chips in the underlying gelcoat. A tip for making complete coverage of you barrier coat easier. Tint each coat a different shade. Your local paint store will cheerfully give you some colorant. I like to steal some condiment cups and lids from a fast food place and have them fill those.
little cracks all over the bottom. I painted on four coats of epoxy barrier coat and two of anti fouling paint but they still show through. I don't believe that they are a problem. The boat had been on the hard for 14 years when I finally launched her in 1999 after the rebuild. A close inspection of the bottom this and every spring shows no changes. Nothing is growing, there are no chips in the underlying gelcoat. A tip for making complete coverage of you barrier coat easier. Tint each coat a different shade. Your local paint store will cheerfully give you some colorant. I like to steal some condiment cups and lids from a fast food place and have them fill those.
what if you skim gelcoat over the cracks?
what if I skimcoat a layer of gelcoat over it ... will it crack through? I bet it will... just like with old plaster, if you don't dig it out, it will crack again. Yeah, the different coloring for each layer will make it a lot easier, just like with body filler... you can find the low and high spots. i am thinking of doing it right and taking it down all the way to the fiberglass... but that is a lot more work... the question is how long before it will crack again, and the time to sand it all down, and I don't have a good spray gun that I could gelcoat spray it... hmmm, the consensus here is to barrier coat it and off I go sailing, and it is an old boat, after all...
what if I skimcoat a layer of gelcoat over it ... will it crack through? I bet it will... just like with old plaster, if you don't dig it out, it will crack again. Yeah, the different coloring for each layer will make it a lot easier, just like with body filler... you can find the low and high spots. i am thinking of doing it right and taking it down all the way to the fiberglass... but that is a lot more work... the question is how long before it will crack again, and the time to sand it all down, and I don't have a good spray gun that I could gelcoat spray it... hmmm, the consensus here is to barrier coat it and off I go sailing, and it is an old boat, after all...
Markus, here the key to your repair Below the H2O
line. There is NO wood in Catalina below the waterline unless there is a wood stringer fiberglassed in the area. I think these cracks happen to all boat when the are on the hard. I wouldn't worry about them. If you think there is a problem expoy paint the bottom with at least 5 coats. My guess it will crack again but if it helps you sleep more power to you. In other words I think you are ok and can leave it as is.
line. There is NO wood in Catalina below the waterline unless there is a wood stringer fiberglassed in the area. I think these cracks happen to all boat when the are on the hard. I wouldn't worry about them. If you think there is a problem expoy paint the bottom with at least 5 coats. My guess it will crack again but if it helps you sleep more power to you. In other words I think you are ok and can leave it as is.
Markus, There are a lot of people that
obcess about little things like thiry year old crazing in gelcoat. There are even some who get that way with five yeat old boats. That is why there are so many good used boats on the market. New on a boat is just as fleeting as new on a car. Perhaps you could cover the bottom with a very thin chopped strand mat and fair that. The cracks would not propogate through that skin. But I don't believe that it is going to prolong the life of the boat. I plan to keep Bietzpadlin for most of the rest of my life and then I will probably give it to someone.
obcess about little things like thiry year old crazing in gelcoat. There are even some who get that way with five yeat old boats. That is why there are so many good used boats on the market. New on a boat is just as fleeting as new on a car. Perhaps you could cover the bottom with a very thin chopped strand mat and fair that. The cracks would not propogate through that skin. But I don't believe that it is going to prolong the life of the boat. I plan to keep Bietzpadlin for most of the rest of my life and then I will probably give it to someone.
you are right... too obsessive
This hull has been sanded quite a few times before, because the gelcoat is down to about 1-2 millimeters in certain areas. I agree, not too obsess about it is the right way to go. Keep sailing have fun and enjoy a bev after a long day out... I will take a look at the interlux 2000 and see if that will build it up enough, we just want to keep the water out of the glass and there was no water dripping anywhere. That is a good sign, but she has been out of the water for 5 months and would probably have dried out now, anyway. The other choice would be the VC-tar2... because you can apply it down to 40 degrees. Which one to use? Here is the catch: the temps are going to fall again tonight and no more 80 degree weather for quite a while. So, i will have to wait again for it to get to 60 degrees minimum to use to 2000, to get the 4-5 layers built up, and they are putting in the docks at sandusky already, get it ready as fast as possible and go sailing? Any experience with the vc-tar2
This hull has been sanded quite a few times before, because the gelcoat is down to about 1-2 millimeters in certain areas. I agree, not too obsess about it is the right way to go. Keep sailing have fun and enjoy a bev after a long day out... I will take a look at the interlux 2000 and see if that will build it up enough, we just want to keep the water out of the glass and there was no water dripping anywhere. That is a good sign, but she has been out of the water for 5 months and would probably have dried out now, anyway. The other choice would be the VC-tar2... because you can apply it down to 40 degrees. Which one to use? Here is the catch: the temps are going to fall again tonight and no more 80 degree weather for quite a while. So, i will have to wait again for it to get to 60 degrees minimum to use to 2000, to get the 4-5 layers built up, and they are putting in the docks at sandusky already, get it ready as fast as possible and go sailing? Any experience with the vc-tar2
Never use VC ANYTHING!!!
this product is for racers only! It is a pain in the neck to be avoided. It does stick to anything! This is how it is made.
this product is for racers only! It is a pain in the neck to be avoided. It does stick to anything! This is how it is made.
Heres a test for you to do if you want to
Find the worst spider crack, get a drill with a bit about 1 inch in diameter and drill a hole thru the hull, next to the worse crack you can find. Now what do you see? Is the crack all the way through the fiberglass? Is the fiberglass about 1/4 to 1/2 inch thick? Now how deep does the crack go? Maybe it's just on the surface. Get my point/ The crazing you most likely are seeing is like the crazing on your grandmothers crock pot. Not to worry the vessel will be just fine . Lightly sand the bottom, paint and splash and go sailing. Oh yea!! this is important. Don't, under any circumstances, drill a hole in the bottom of your boat. Or, You could do option #2 hire a fiberglass specialist and have them redo the bottom of your boat. That way you can just sit back and sip wine while you throw thousands of dollars away. If you should choose number two. I have a friend who happens to specialize in glass work. Just kidding. Pictures go a long way towards a appropriate response Keep it up, Ctskip
Find the worst spider crack, get a drill with a bit about 1 inch in diameter and drill a hole thru the hull, next to the worse crack you can find. Now what do you see? Is the crack all the way through the fiberglass? Is the fiberglass about 1/4 to 1/2 inch thick? Now how deep does the crack go? Maybe it's just on the surface. Get my point/ The crazing you most likely are seeing is like the crazing on your grandmothers crock pot. Not to worry the vessel will be just fine . Lightly sand the bottom, paint and splash and go sailing. Oh yea!! this is important. Don't, under any circumstances, drill a hole in the bottom of your boat. Or, You could do option #2 hire a fiberglass specialist and have them redo the bottom of your boat. That way you can just sit back and sip wine while you throw thousands of dollars away. If you should choose number two. I have a friend who happens to specialize in glass work. Just kidding. Pictures go a long way towards a appropriate response Keep it up, Ctskip
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