Edson steering, Catalina 250: conduit blocking rudder

[sebastko]

Hello all,
This is my first post here, so glad to be joining this awesome community

I'm having an issue with the Edson steering system on my new-to-me 1996 Catalina 250. I'm planning to call Edson's customer service, which I read good things about, but I thought it would be easier to explain the issue with the photos, hence trying this forum first...

Here's how the steering cable looked like just a few months ago (photo taken from a survey) - as you can see the surveyor warned about the nut being a bit loose, which I of course ignored at the time as something minor to look into later.....

Fast forward to now - a few nights on a mooring buoy in some winds and waves, and the thing broke, exposing the steering cable inside:

When you try to turn the rudder to the port side (if I remember correctly), the conduit collides with the other conduit, blocking the rudder. I thought it's just a matter of putting it all together and tightening the nuts, but that doesn't seem to work -- even if I tighten the nut a lot, the conduit seems to be slipping out very easily and then it starts colliding again...

At this point I'm not even sure if the loose nut that the surveyor was talking about was the core problem, or maybe something has broken in that conduit? I can see a little bit of thread at the end of this conduit, but it doesn't look super even to me -- it looks like it may have broken?

Steering data sheet for Catalina 250 on Edson's website points to this:
CATALINA 22 & 25 (S-728) D.pdf (edsonmarine.com)
...and it lists parts like "PULL/PULL CONDUIT ASSEMBLY":
Edson Marine: 6 foot length - 3/4" Pull/Pull Conduit for 3/16" and 1/4" Wire Rope (797-6)
...but I do not see any parts like that in my system... Also, the data sheet seems to be showing 2 cables (one on each side of the boat), while I seem to have just one (on the starboard side). Has Catalina done some shortcuts?

I'd appreciate your advice on the following questions:
* Is this conduit likely broken? Or just needs to be fitted properly and the nut needs to be tightened correctly?
* If the conduit is broken... I guess I could live without that conduit, right? Not exactly sure though how to remove it..... the vertical pin (highlighted with red below) doesn't have enough "clearance" above it to be removed... I guess I'll work on the blue nut next?

Overall, if you have any thoughts or advice, I'd very much appreciate your help!
Thanks,
Sebastian

 

[Ward H]

Sebastian, Welcome the Forum!!

Looking closely at your photo I think what you are seeing is wear marks where the conduit is broken, not threads. It's broken and must be replaced.
The data sheet you have linked is for a pull/pull system. You have a single cable system so it is a push/pull system. Without the outer conduit the internal cable will likely flex when trying to push the rudder. Not good.

Definitely call Edson. Their service is top notch like you've heard.
Also call Catalina Yachts customer service.

When I had a steering issue on my 93 C30 I called both. They both asked for photos to see exactly what the issue was. Both were extremely helpful on how to make the repairs needed.

If the conduit is broken... I guess I could live without that conduit, right?

Most likely not and most likely your insurance wouldn't either. For your own safety make the phone calls and fix it properly. I'm sure your boat is not the first to have this problem.

 

[sebastko]

Thank you very much, Ward! Just to give an update on the thread, in case anyone else finds themselves in this situation:

* Yes, I have the older push/pull system, no longer manufactured or supported by Edson. Their customer service is indeed very nice and helpful, but unfortunately in this case their only advice is to upgrade to a newer pull/pull system. They offer an upgrade kit for $900 and detailed (although text-only) instructions... I haven't decided yet whether to do it, as I was considering switching the boat to a tiller anyway... also, it sounds like a longer project, perhaps for the winter?

* The reason I couldn't unhook the brass thing (highlighted in red on my last photo) was because I still had a rudder installed. Take off the rudder first (there's just one pin that can be taken off by hand) and then it's easy to unhook the steering system (so now at least I have a well-functioning emergency tiller).

I do have some follow-up questions...

1. After unhooking the steering system and attaching the emergency tiller to the rudder... is this basically how a Catalina 250 (or a C22/C25) in a tiller version would work? Or are there some additional mechanisms to make tiller more efficient (in case of strong winds etc.), or to have an ability to block it (the ability to block the steering wheel in place is the main thing I'll miss now!)

2. I'm wondering if the conduit broke just because it was its time, or because I did something wrong when mooring the boat on a buoy. What's the recommended way to leave the rudder and the steering systems when left to the elements on an anchor or a mooring buoy? Should I block the steering wheel or not? Should leave the kick-up rudder up or down?

3. Any other ideas how to fix the conduit? Even after unhooking the system from the rudder, I still don't know how to get rid of the conduit (to leave the steering cable exposed). If anyone has experience with it, please let me know

 

[chrbrown]

I have a similar push-pull on my 96 C250. It was also loose like yours with the rubber bushing broken. I'm curios. How did you solve your problem?

 

[jssailem]

Welcome to the SBO Forum @chrbrown.

Congrats on your choice of Catalina.
Steering issues need to be corrected. They do not self-correct. One of the best parts of our forum is the ability to post pictures of your problem. It engages many of the members who have seen these types of problems. Being a Catalina owner, looking at the problem as a Catalina owner is normal. In reality, the company Edison built the steering system that Catalina used on your boat. It was installed on many boats like yours.

@Ward H said, "When I had a steering issue on my 93 C30, I called both. They both asked for photos to see exactly what the issue was." I encourage you to take pictures of your problem and post them here. It will speed up the process of getting you to a solution.

Again welcome.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

I use to install the push pull Edson system on the hunter 26 but after two failures, I went with the standard wheel system. If you have a Hunter 260 owner with wheels steering, look at that and take some photos. It has been a long time since I introduced the Catalina 250 as a dealer.

Wheel steering has it advantages.

If you do call Catalina’s plant is in Largo, Florida. Ask for Skip.

 

[chrbrown]

Thanks both for the replies. I'm emailing with Edson to see what they suggest. They don't have parts left for this system. Mine did not break like the original post. I'm curious Dave, what problems did you find with the units you installed?

Here's how I attempted to fix mine in the mean time...