Do you like Pocket Yachts

dlochner · Nov 20, 2022

Scott T-Bird said:
No, I don't think so. A pocket yacht doesn't have to suitable for blue water. Actually, I think I'll refine my definition ... a pocket yacht doesn't have standing headroom anywhere inside the cabin.

Scott, you completely missed the point or maybe you just reinforced the point.

The point of my comment was simply there is no clear definition of what a pocket yacht is nor is there a clear definition of what a blue water yacht is. When some naive, unsuspecting soul asks a question like, "What's the best blue water sailboat?" it invariably descends into a debate, no argument with heated retorts, on the subject. That question does not appear on SBO all that often but it does over on Cruisers Forum. Find out for yourself, sail on over to CF and pose the question. Then sail on over to Cruiser's Anarchy and do the same.

rgranger · Nov 20, 2022

dlochner said:
Find out for yourself, sail on over to CF and pose the question. Then sail on over to Cruiser's Anarchy and do the same.

Ooooh... you gots a mean streak.

Crazy Dave Condon · Nov 20, 2022

Is a 1/160 th scale sailboat be called a pocket sailor?

stickinthemud57 · Nov 20, 2022

No. Polly Pocket Sailor.

Leeward Rail · Nov 22, 2022

Is that what these are for?

Leeward Rail · Nov 22, 2022

JBP-PA said:
Pocket cruisers, tiny homes, and van campers have always held a certain appeal.

mostly for people who cant afford anything else.

so maybe a.pocket yacht is any sailboat that you can afford, but is smaller than you would prefer. :beer:

rgranger · Nov 22, 2022

Leeward Rail said:
mostly for people who cant afford anything else.

That is a perspective.... and maybe true if you keep your boat in a slip.

I've also heard the adage that the smaller the boat, the more often you go sailing. I had a Mac 22 that I could set up and launch in about 30 min. My H26 was a half day job. I kept my H26 in a slip. The Mac I trailered all over the place.

Edit: Maybe the definition should be.... large enough to have what you need, small enough to handle easily.

JBP-PA · Nov 22, 2022

Leeward Rail said:
mostly for people who cant afford anything else.

Maybe for some, but certainly not everyone. I could afford a bigger boat, but then I think about the hassle of keeping it in a yard over the winter where I can't access it, relying on someone else to launch and retrieve it, waiting on others to do repairs, and I think "no, I'm much happier doing it myself". I understand that some people don't like doing things themselves and would rather have someone else to do their work, but I think there are also a lot of us who do like the freedom of being independent and self-reliant regardless of ability to pay.

thinwater · Nov 22, 2022

Leeward Rail said:
mostly for people who cant afford anything else.

so maybe a.pocket yacht is any sailboat that you can afford, but is smaller than you would prefer.

My last boat was a cruising cat. I had it for 14 years, until my daughter graduated from college and we were no longer family cruising. After a few more years, I realized it did not fill my new needs (fun day sailing), so I down-sized to something smaller, sportier, and more fun. I cannot think of a boat that would better suit me at this time than my F-boat. Any such a boat would be about the same size--quick and easy for one person to manage. Size means nothing to me, as long as there is a head and a place to stash my seabag.

I may move back to a cruising cat someday. But do NOT assume that size of the boat relates to the size of the purse. Think Alerion 28 or Morris 29.

stickinthemud57 · Nov 22, 2022

The last several posts bear out an observation I have made, namely, that any boat design is a set of compromises. In the case of a pocket yacht, it seems to me that it is a compromise between an expensive boat that is typically kept in a slip (with all the attendant expenses) and a less expensive boat that can be easily trailered and parked at home (or in a dry storage area near a marina), and has a cabin that can be slept in.

So, to say that it is for those who can't afford more, I would say that may be partially true. I think more accurately it may be that the value judgement made by the purchaser points them to a boat that may be less expensive up front, but does not come with the limitations and costs associated with a fixed-keel slip-kept boat. Put another way, maybe they could afford all that, they just chose to spend their money on something else - bigger house, newer car, $4,000 guitar, college education for the kids, etc.

This boils down to a "less is more" proposition. The pocket yacht embraces the notion that one can enjoy the key aspects of a cabin-equipped boat (fun of sailing, ability to shelter/sleep in the cabin) without buying into the marina lifestyle with its costs and limitations.

rgranger · Nov 22, 2022

stickinthemud57 said:
The last several posts bear out an observation I have made, namely, that any boat design is a set of compromises. In the case of a pocket yacht, it seems to me that it is a compromise between an expensive boat that is typically kept in a slip (with all the attendant expenses) and a less expensive boat that can be easily trailered and parked at home (or in a dry storage area near a marina), and has a cabin that can be slept in.

So, to say that it is for those who can't afford more, I would say that may be partially true. I think more accurately it may be that the value judgement made by the purchaser points them to a boat that may be less expensive up front, but does not come with the limitations and costs associated with a fixed-keel slip-kept boat. Put another way, maybe they could afford all that, they just chose to spend their money on something else - bigger house, newer car, $4,000 guitar, college education for the kids, etc.

This boils down to a "less is more" proposition. The pocket yacht embraces the notion that one can enjoy the key aspects of a cabin-equipped boat (fun of sailing, ability to shelter/sleep in the cabin) without buying into the marina lifestyle with its costs and limitations.

Well said! :beer:

rgranger · Nov 23, 2022

jssailem said:
When we talk about Pocket Yachts, there are the every day variety and then there is the Townsend-Tern. I find this boat well designed, and just an elegant boat for the discerning sailor.

Townsend Tern - The Ingenious Cat-Ketch Coastal Cruiser - OffCenterHarbor.com

The Townsend Tern is a handy little ketch you can trailer to your favorite waters and go off-grid for many weeks at a time.

www.offcenterharbor.com

That is a sexy little boat. I'm also enamored with the Nor'sea 27. Not sure everyone would consider it a pocket cruiser but it is trailerable.

27 Nor'Sea ULA 1983 Marina Del Rey | Denison Yacht Sales

WOW ! This is a classic well built yacht Maintained to high standards Built in the Tradition of a traditional sailors perspective Classic Paraffin Oil Lamp Running Lights She has Sailed ...

www.denisonyachtsales.com

And one of my other favorite pocket cruisers is the Rhodes 22'

Rhodes 22 - Practical Sailor

Since 1974, Practical Sailor’s independent testing has taken the guesswork out of boat and gear buying.

www.practical-sailor.com

thinwater · Nov 23, 2022

stickinthemud57 said:
... So, to say that it is for those who can't afford more, I would say that may be partially true. I think more accurately it may be that the value judgement made by the purchaser points them to a boat that may be less expensive up front, but does not come with the limitations and costs associated with a fixed-keel slip-kept boat. Put another way, maybe they could afford all that, they just chose to spend their money on something else - bigger house, newer car, $4,000 guitar, college education for the kids, etc....

Still missing a part of the point.

I ride a bicycle because I like riding a bicycle more than driving a car or an RV. It is more fun. I don't ride a bike to the grocery store because I need to. I have money I'll never spend. And that is how I chose a boat. And I don't favor "forever boats." I will change boats when my mood changes, either up or down in size as it strikes me. I seem to do that about every 10-12 years. You could set a clock by it.

dlochner · Nov 23, 2022

thinwater said:
Still missing a part of the point.

I ride a bicycle because I like riding a bicycle more than driving a car or an RV. It is more fun. I don't ride a bike to the grocery store because I need to. I have money I'll never spend. And that is how I chose a boat. And I don't favor "forever boats." I will change boats when my mood changes, either up or down in size as it strikes me. I seem to do that about every 10-12 years. You could set a clock by it.

A boat is nothing more than a vehicle or tool to obtain something or do a job. We buy the boats that will serve our purposes and are (almost) affordable. Our purposes are as individual as we are and change over time. It doesn't matter what name the marketing people give it, nor does it matter what the internet sages say it is or isn't, it only matters that it is your boat, for now.

Qorgyle · Nov 23, 2022

dlochner said:
We buy the boats that will serve our purposes and are (almost) affordable. Our purposes are as individual as we are and change over time.

Yep. I looked at quite a few boats and we almost went with a Catalina 30 for just a little bit more than what we wanted to spend, but ultimately I decided it was just too much of a boat at that time. While we'd love that space and the amenities, I had to be realistic about the amount of time I could dedicate to maintenance and education (boat plumbing, inboard engine "plumbing", diesel EVERYthing, more complex electrics and electronics just for starters) on a boat that size. Went with a 25 instead and so far (knock on teak) nothing has stumped me yet (except one leak somewhere in the stern which is proving very hard to track down

).

Thanks for posting the above pocket yachts. Some lovely boats I haven't seen before - the Tern, the Seaward, the Ula, etc. Food for thought, although with a family of 4 "pocketing" is slightly larger.

rgranger · Nov 23, 2022

thinwater said:
You could set a clock by it.

I must have a more severe case! I’ve never kept a boat more than 5 years. :beer:

Roland5048 · Nov 23, 2022

rgranger said:
I must have a more severe case! I’ve never kept a boat more than 5 years.

Going on 26 years with Fraulein II. Longest relationship I've ever had. :beer:

rgranger · Nov 23, 2022

So… this has been a fun thread for the winter doldrums… I thought I’d take a tangent and list the pocket cruisers boats I’ve had. All but two of these were a near complete restoration

In chronological order
Macgregor 21
Coronado 23
Macgregor 21
Coronado 25
Macgregor 22
Rhodes 22 (Still have this one .. restoration in progress)
Balboa 26
Hunter 26

At the moment my only “sea worthy” sailboat is a Hobie 16 and a wind surfer board

I’m looking into something in the 16 to 19’ range for weekening

Do you like Pocket Yachts

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John

.

.

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John

.

.

.

.

.