Boat shopping and boarded a 1980 Hunter 33. The deck flexed considerably when I stepped just forward of the wheel. Is this what I initially thought, a soft deck core, or is this "flex," as the broker said, a common trait for these boats due to the design, which was set up for both a tiller and wheel? He said all of them do it, and demonstrated by wiggling the pedestal about.
Deck flex ahead of helm in cockpit H33
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I've got a 1980 Hunter 36. When I first inspected it prior to purchase five years ago, same cockpit floor "attribute" as your experience . The core around the pedestal had been penetrated with water. If the 33 is the same as the 36 (I'm pretty sure that it is), the core material is plywood. When I cut off the top skin (after removing the pedestal and pedestal guard) I found that the plywood had delaminated between the layers, but the wood itself was in fine condition and still firmly bonded to the top and bottom skins. If I were to do it again, I wouldn't have removed the top skin. Instead drill many holes through the top frp layer into the plywood, inject/flush with acetone to "dry out" the moisture, then inject/flush with liquid epoxy thinned a bit. Find some way to vibrate the floor to promote flow of the epoxy into the delaminiated plywood. Fill/fair the holes. Cosmeticially paint. Done.
As to your broker's explanation .... might be wise to view everything that he says skeptically. The cockpit floor should not be soft and the pedestal shouldn't flex back-and-forth. Mine no longer does after the fix. I very much doubt that Hunter offered a soft sole and rocking pedestal as a new boat option.
As to your broker's explanation .... might be wise to view everything that he says skeptically. The cockpit floor should not be soft and the pedestal shouldn't flex back-and-forth. Mine no longer does after the fix. I very much doubt that Hunter offered a soft sole and rocking pedestal as a new boat option.
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on my 1980 33 the plywood core was way beyond injecting epoxy, the core resembled mud in some places. the diesel fill in the center of the sole was the main culprit. maybe only the 1980 model had it there...i replaced the sole with "coosa" a fiberglass reinforced closed cell foam core and raised the pedestal mount to prevent future leaks. The diesel deck fill will be moved to the side deck but the efficiency of the little yanmar hasn't made it much of a priority......
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oh and the aft extension of the "pedestal platform" will be to prevent water from sitting around a plate to cover the rudder head for emergency steering
I don't think they are all like this, just the ones that have core rot.
Be sure that you know what you are getting into before you make an offer. Redbeards idea of raising the pedestal is a great idea. Hunter did this on the HC37.
Be sure that you know what you are getting into before you make an offer. Redbeards idea of raising the pedestal is a great idea. Hunter did this on the HC37.
i hope my post didn't discourage you, i totally agree with Ed. It was a big job but it was in no way a "deal breaker". 30 year old boats are all gonna have issues with hardware mounted to the deck with cracked original sealant. look over everything carefully but don't write it off just for this
I'm going to look at other boats before I return to it, so we'll see. Sorry to come in here and talk about only the negative... I saw some things about the design I love as well, and the positives would be a whole lot more fun to explore with you.
Maybe I'll see you folks again, thanks for being a great resource.
Greg
Maybe I'll see you folks again, thanks for being a great resource.
Greg
The 33 is a terrific boat. The one I owned was a 79 and needed a new cockpit sole. There is NO way it should be flexing, nor should the pedestal be moving around. If a broker tried that one on me I would be going for another agent.
The diesel fill was a problem for water infiltration on mine but it also allowed water into the tank as well. Not good. The other issue with pedestal leakage is it can degrade the steering pulleys beneath through rusting.
The diesel fill was a problem for water infiltration on mine but it also allowed water into the tank as well. Not good. The other issue with pedestal leakage is it can degrade the steering pulleys beneath through rusting.
The broker is full of crap. The deck is flexy because it is bad. Steering pedestals do not wobble around. Repairable, but bad. He however is not salvagable. Walk away from him and the boat unless you are committed to the repair project.
Redbeard-- nice work.
Redbeard, I'm impressed with your thorough and beautiful work. I like to think that's how I'd have done it had I encountered the same thing. The softness of the core under and around a wobbly steering pedestal, given the amount of working back and forth that a pedestal endures, is sort of inevitable.
At Cherubini, my cousin Dave started us all on the idea of molded-in or epoxied-on bolsters, or risers, under everything that goes on the deck-- cleats, chainplates, padeyes, especially stanchion bases. If ever you can keep water from pooling around a through-bolted fitting, take all measures to do so.
This is most particularly important given the very poor quality of most cast stainless these days, all of it much more prone to crevice-crack corrosion (in anaerobic areas) than the old stuff ever was.
Redbeard, I'm impressed with your thorough and beautiful work. I like to think that's how I'd have done it had I encountered the same thing. The softness of the core under and around a wobbly steering pedestal, given the amount of working back and forth that a pedestal endures, is sort of inevitable.
At Cherubini, my cousin Dave started us all on the idea of molded-in or epoxied-on bolsters, or risers, under everything that goes on the deck-- cleats, chainplates, padeyes, especially stanchion bases. If ever you can keep water from pooling around a through-bolted fitting, take all measures to do so.
This is most particularly important given the very poor quality of most cast stainless these days, all of it much more prone to crevice-crack corrosion (in anaerobic areas) than the old stuff ever was.
Thanks John, Thats a huge compliment considering how much experience you have in fiberglass work. I have been a fairly skilled carpenter for years but only since getting the boat 2 years ago have I began learning the "in's and out's" of GRP construction. Pretty amazing stuff really, other than grinding I have found it a lot of fun to work with. I too have adopted the idea that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. I have included some pictures of my project to raise the chainplate covers to achieve the same outcome.
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Deck and cockpit bolsters.
Redbeard, that looks exactly like what we do at the shop. Even your shapes are similar to ours. I'm sure somewhere on the Cherubini Yachts web pages you might see some of Dave's photos.
I am in the (slow) process of making these for the stanchion bases. Two bolts go through the toerail flange and two through the deck; between them has to be a race for water to slide through so the inboard bolts will go through narrow bolsters. But be careful-- on one boat (still in the shop) they popped right off, and had to be redone, due to improper surface prep, which is the most vital stage. Use nothing less than laminating epoxy (I prefer Gougeons') and you should be all right.
Recently I have developed the process of installing backing plates and deck bolsters with a thin ring of 5200 about the perimeter and then, when it's sure to be kicked-off, drilling a hole down from the top and filling the inside of that 5200 ring with epoxy. This makes a really solid block of your little pad, ensures against water intrusion (and flex), and ensures permanent adhesion as well. My cleats, stanchion bases, mast step and foredeck hardware are all being done like this. (I did not do the seacock bases like this, but I could have). This is really the right way to reseat the steering pedestal, given that the new base pad is big enough and the backing plate under the cockpit sole is equally strong. Remember to drill or redrill your mounting holes after filling the void(s) with epoxy. And bed the pedestal with 5200.
I was gratified to see that my new cockpit drains will go through solid 'glass and not through core; I was worried about that at first. Having no pedestal I don't have the problem you wheel-steering people have; but it is true that a solid cockpit floor is both structurally and psychologically an asset. The recoring job is not at all hard (given a rectangular cockpit you might just fit in a piece of plywood and 'glass over it-- using epoxy) and it gives you the chance to strengthen the pedestal, which to my mind ought to be as stiff and as strong as a spar... because in some ways that's really what it is.
Redbeard, that looks exactly like what we do at the shop. Even your shapes are similar to ours. I'm sure somewhere on the Cherubini Yachts web pages you might see some of Dave's photos.
I am in the (slow) process of making these for the stanchion bases. Two bolts go through the toerail flange and two through the deck; between them has to be a race for water to slide through so the inboard bolts will go through narrow bolsters. But be careful-- on one boat (still in the shop) they popped right off, and had to be redone, due to improper surface prep, which is the most vital stage. Use nothing less than laminating epoxy (I prefer Gougeons') and you should be all right.
Recently I have developed the process of installing backing plates and deck bolsters with a thin ring of 5200 about the perimeter and then, when it's sure to be kicked-off, drilling a hole down from the top and filling the inside of that 5200 ring with epoxy. This makes a really solid block of your little pad, ensures against water intrusion (and flex), and ensures permanent adhesion as well. My cleats, stanchion bases, mast step and foredeck hardware are all being done like this. (I did not do the seacock bases like this, but I could have). This is really the right way to reseat the steering pedestal, given that the new base pad is big enough and the backing plate under the cockpit sole is equally strong. Remember to drill or redrill your mounting holes after filling the void(s) with epoxy. And bed the pedestal with 5200.
I was gratified to see that my new cockpit drains will go through solid 'glass and not through core; I was worried about that at first. Having no pedestal I don't have the problem you wheel-steering people have; but it is true that a solid cockpit floor is both structurally and psychologically an asset. The recoring job is not at all hard (given a rectangular cockpit you might just fit in a piece of plywood and 'glass over it-- using epoxy) and it gives you the chance to strengthen the pedestal, which to my mind ought to be as stiff and as strong as a spar... because in some ways that's really what it is.
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