Nice looking and fun looking boat... however I cringe when I think of what it costs every time you turn on the key.
Crossing the Gulf Stream
- Thread starter rgranger
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Nice looking and fun looking boat... however I cringe when I think of what it costs every time you turn on the key.
Yeah I agree but this is a trip they planned for and budgeted for. They had a a Cape Dory 20 something sailboat and were tired of being left behind on group cruises so bought the Cape Dory trawler. Not my cup of tea but I can understand their decision for going to the "DARK SIDE". It will be interesting to hear a report of their fuel expenses. They are still sailors at heart (cheap) and their report will be interesting.
The guys above and others...
...have made the trip a number of times in....
http://www.microcruising.com/pictures.htm
.... some pretty small boats. A number of Mac boats have made....
http://www.conchcruisers.net/
...the trip.
We will probably take a different tack and go across by ourselves unless we are in company of others that are prepared. You are trying to prepare yourself in a responsible manner and we would have no problem making the trip with you, but I've read about a number of people that have taken the group approach with their Mac's over there or to the Tortugas and just depended on others to bail them out if their outboard quit or their anchoring gear was not up to the demands and they drug into shore. If the weather goes to hell there is only so much another boat can do to help you.
We had never done any ocean stuff at all and went down the west coast of Florida and across Florida Bay to the Keys in the Mac with no problems. No major current like the stream, but still a long way with no support once you leave Everglades City and had no problems, but we did watch the weather very closely.
Just don't box yourselves in with a time schedule that has to be meet and start further south than where you mentioned and you should have a great trip and one to remember for a long time,
Sum
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r, I don't think I've ever seen or heard of the Gulf Stream at 10 knots. The average is 2 1/2 to 3 knots at the axis, or center, and as you enter and leave it the current is less. Depending on where you leave from, you will have to adjust accordingly but it won't be the same all the way across. I would recommend Bruce Van Sant's Gentleman's Guide To Passages South for great ideas on strategy for weather windows and crossings. We know Bruce well and when we follow his advice we always have a good trip. When we go against it, well, he's the first to say, "you shudda followed the book." I have said often when ask for advise, there are three words to sum it up. Wait, wait and wait. Good luck and have a great trip. We're heading over in January. Chuck
The max. speed for the gulf stream is 5.6 mph. I have never heard of it being 10mph. I could be wrong. Hope you have a great trip. Kevin
... right!
I think I have committed the sin of propagating bad info. I was reading a blog someplace where the writer was giving advice... but I have not seen that number since. It seems like 6 is the accepted high end on most of the sites I've found.
I have a few cruising guides in my Amazon cart waiting X-mas. So I'll have some more reading to do.
Right now I'm waiting on a mail order of some non-blushing epoxy so I can get back to work on restoring my Rhodes 22.
Thanks Sum: I appreciate the call out and I do hope I cross paths with you some day.
As I mentioned earlier in this post, it looks like we are planning a trip to the Keys for the holidays next year (Christmas of 2013), with an eye on possibly skipping over if conditions are right. But I'd be happy stomping around the keys if not... something I've only ever done by car.
The pics are nice too.... but dang....those Bolger boats are so UGLY! I'm a big fan of Sharpies and would really love to build one some day. I have a copy of Ted Brewer's Mystic Sharpie plans, and Reuel Parkers San Juan plans as well as Reuel's Sharpie book. I even have a set of Bolger's SA29 plans and though I admire the complete utility and function of his designs, I don't think I could fall in love with one of those boats. They seem soulless to me. Just a machine.
We drove them once in a rental car and I was severely disappointed. I could care less about going by car again, but on the water it is totally different. You would love it. We are really looking forward to returning and exploring more from the water side.
Hey you are on the inside of them looking out
. Only the other boaters near you need to look at them. I find them fascinating but don't think I'll be building one either, but not because of the looks.Sum
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Our Endeavour 37
Our MacGregor 26-S Pages
Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida
Mac-Venture Links
The Gulf stream....
From what I read and hear in this blog it seems to have become an over-scare: probably greatly exagerated by the Florida tourist industry to keep boaters from leaving Florida with some $$ still left to spend!
Having crossed the stream more than a dozen times in relatively small sailing vessels, most of what is discussed is over-kill: how many people get hurt every year crossing the Gulf Stream?
OK there is more or less a three knot current in the center and considerably less on either side. It usually takes about half a day to calm dowm after a moderate noreaster. Depending on where you are crossing and where you land it will take between ten and twenty hours. From Miami to Bimini it is ten to twelve hours and from Lake Worth to Freeport (Port Lucaya) about eighteen hours.
You should listen to the marine forecast and choose as comfortable a window as YOU need. Some people actually like a ten knot norther in the Stream: the only problem is you don't know when a forecasted ten will increase to an unconfortable and unforecasted twenty... Uncomfortable doesn't mean dangerous!
You will be in VHF contact all the way across... You will get forecasts and will be able to reach the USCG during the whole trip.... It's when you are in the Bahamas that reaching BASRA gets more complicated.
Safety equipment really needed... This is NOT an ocean crossing, you are NOT in cold (hypothermia) water this is NOT a pirate infested area. You need about the same safety equipment as you would on the Albermarle or the Chesapeake.
An inflatable dinghy lashed upside dowm on the foredeck (as a liferaft substitute) which you can use in the islands to get to shore... Use your main engine on the dinghy... Don't carry two outboards. Harnesses and tethers for noght-time are a must. Good PFD's and a personnal EPIRB would be my choice. Enough drinking water in two or four liter bottles for a week.
If for some reason you decide to have a spare rudder, it is only useful if you have tried and tested it (most plans don't work). On a Rhodes 22 you should be able to balance your sailplan and sail the boat without a rudder.
Have a good cruise... The avatar was taken in the sea of Eleuthera on a fantastic day.
Pierre
From what I read and hear in this blog it seems to have become an over-scare: probably greatly exagerated by the Florida tourist industry to keep boaters from leaving Florida with some $$ still left to spend!
Having crossed the stream more than a dozen times in relatively small sailing vessels, most of what is discussed is over-kill: how many people get hurt every year crossing the Gulf Stream?
OK there is more or less a three knot current in the center and considerably less on either side. It usually takes about half a day to calm dowm after a moderate noreaster. Depending on where you are crossing and where you land it will take between ten and twenty hours. From Miami to Bimini it is ten to twelve hours and from Lake Worth to Freeport (Port Lucaya) about eighteen hours.
You should listen to the marine forecast and choose as comfortable a window as YOU need. Some people actually like a ten knot norther in the Stream: the only problem is you don't know when a forecasted ten will increase to an unconfortable and unforecasted twenty... Uncomfortable doesn't mean dangerous!
You will be in VHF contact all the way across... You will get forecasts and will be able to reach the USCG during the whole trip.... It's when you are in the Bahamas that reaching BASRA gets more complicated.
Safety equipment really needed... This is NOT an ocean crossing, you are NOT in cold (hypothermia) water this is NOT a pirate infested area. You need about the same safety equipment as you would on the Albermarle or the Chesapeake.
An inflatable dinghy lashed upside dowm on the foredeck (as a liferaft substitute) which you can use in the islands to get to shore... Use your main engine on the dinghy... Don't carry two outboards. Harnesses and tethers for noght-time are a must. Good PFD's and a personnal EPIRB would be my choice. Enough drinking water in two or four liter bottles for a week.
If for some reason you decide to have a spare rudder, it is only useful if you have tried and tested it (most plans don't work). On a Rhodes 22 you should be able to balance your sailplan and sail the boat without a rudder.
Have a good cruise... The avatar was taken in the sea of Eleuthera on a fantastic day.
Pierre
The problem with crossing the Florida Straights to the Bahamas, is that several small boats per year are lost and never heard from again.
Palm Beach / Lake Worth to West End in a small boat should only be done in weather window of 48 hours of 'benign' conditions and absolutely NO north component wind nor NO from the North or NE swell running.
1. because weather forecasts can easily change and NOAA isnt 'that good' in forecasting weather for the Gulf Stream in the Florida Straights!!!!!
2. you need extra time to get to Great Sale Cay (or Mangrove Cay) in case if the pass/entrance into Old Bahama Bay / West End is untenable, rarely is it untenable but it does happen sometimes.
Its about 60-70 miles to West End, the *average* is about 4 kts. northward flow of the stream ... so need about 20° of south added to your magnetic course to account for proper 'set' to your course. Ive seen as high as 6+kts. on the axis of the stream in the FL STraights when there are large weather disturbances in the Gulf of Mex. 'pushing' water between Cuba and FL.
Winds from ANY north component can set the Gulf Stream to 'very nasty'. You only go on E or SE through westerly ... and hope that it stays from that direction.
Beware of NE trade winds (DEC — FEB) as they have a tendency to pump large swells 'around the corner' of the northern Abacos and the swells WILL change direction off the NE Abacos and will then be running North towards South 'against' the stream flow.
To check any crossing, before fully committing, you leave a Florida inlet and scan the eastern horizon with binoculars ... and if you see what appears to be 'elephants marching in line along the horizon', you do a 180 and wait until the 'stream lays down' ... in a day or two .... and no matter what NOAA is saying!
The best weather source info is NOT NOAA forecasts ... listen to Caribbean Weather (Chris Parker) on 4.045 mHz (Upper Side Band) starting at ~7:00 AM local time. www.caribwx.com/ ... no charge to 'listen'.
NOAA gets it WRONG too many times to be of any value for crossing the Gulf Stream.
The ONLY charts to use once in the Bahamas are "Explorer Charts" .... and/or a NEW Garmin chartplotter that is already loaded with updated "Explorer Charts".
Simplest and safest for a small boat is to wait for an approaching large HIGH pressure system from the west with 'light' winds, no N or NE swell running ... and simply motor across (adding 20°M or more to account for the 'set' for a boat that can maintain 6kts.
A simple VHF radio with a WELL TUNED antenna is all you really need to communicate. Its a plus to have a handheld as a backup ... and just about everyone uses VHF in the Bahamas instead of telephones.
DO NOT follow the GPS rhumbline between any FL inlet to West End.... you want to be heading 'more southerly' at the beginning of the leg in the less strong flow, more South-easterly (that extra 20°) in the middle of the stream .... and then make your 'corrections' nearer to West End. Remember that a 24ft. boat will 'max. out' at about 5kts ... and the Gulf stream can be up to 4 kts. or sometimes greater .... and you will be at least 20°M (or more) 'against' the Gulf Stream to arrive in the Abacos ... about 3kts or less 'over the bottom' especially early and midway in your crossing.
If you miss West End because of unusual stream velocity, head for "Memory Rock" then go direct across the Little Bahama Bank to Great Sale Cay (or if still benign conditions go to Mangrove Cay) .... about 24-36 hours West Palm to Great Sale.
If an EPIRB is too expensive, get a "SPOT" ... and set up your messages before you leave. www.findmespot.com/
With your waterline length you will be unable to keep up with the typical sized boats going east.
Leave WELL before dawn, use Ch13/16 and do TALK to the Big Commercial Ships in the stream so they KNOW exactly where you are .... unfortunately many dont speak English and will not answer; but try anyway. Many ships going to the Mediterranean will come close to the western Abaco shore ... so watch for ships ALL THE WAY ACROSS. IF they dont answer you, stay away far from them ... as probably no one is on the bridge, etc.!!!
If your not well experienced in open ocean sailing .... get your ocean experience long BEFORE you attempt to cross the Gulf Stream in the Florida Straights .... as if you miss the Abacos, ..... the next stop is Bermuda ..... or Ireland.
;-)
Palm Beach / Lake Worth to West End in a small boat should only be done in weather window of 48 hours of 'benign' conditions and absolutely NO north component wind nor NO from the North or NE swell running.
1. because weather forecasts can easily change and NOAA isnt 'that good' in forecasting weather for the Gulf Stream in the Florida Straights!!!!!
2. you need extra time to get to Great Sale Cay (or Mangrove Cay) in case if the pass/entrance into Old Bahama Bay / West End is untenable, rarely is it untenable but it does happen sometimes.
Its about 60-70 miles to West End, the *average* is about 4 kts. northward flow of the stream ... so need about 20° of south added to your magnetic course to account for proper 'set' to your course. Ive seen as high as 6+kts. on the axis of the stream in the FL STraights when there are large weather disturbances in the Gulf of Mex. 'pushing' water between Cuba and FL.
Winds from ANY north component can set the Gulf Stream to 'very nasty'. You only go on E or SE through westerly ... and hope that it stays from that direction.
Beware of NE trade winds (DEC — FEB) as they have a tendency to pump large swells 'around the corner' of the northern Abacos and the swells WILL change direction off the NE Abacos and will then be running North towards South 'against' the stream flow.
To check any crossing, before fully committing, you leave a Florida inlet and scan the eastern horizon with binoculars ... and if you see what appears to be 'elephants marching in line along the horizon', you do a 180 and wait until the 'stream lays down' ... in a day or two .... and no matter what NOAA is saying!
The best weather source info is NOT NOAA forecasts ... listen to Caribbean Weather (Chris Parker) on 4.045 mHz (Upper Side Band) starting at ~7:00 AM local time. www.caribwx.com/ ... no charge to 'listen'.
NOAA gets it WRONG too many times to be of any value for crossing the Gulf Stream.
The ONLY charts to use once in the Bahamas are "Explorer Charts" .... and/or a NEW Garmin chartplotter that is already loaded with updated "Explorer Charts".
Simplest and safest for a small boat is to wait for an approaching large HIGH pressure system from the west with 'light' winds, no N or NE swell running ... and simply motor across (adding 20°M or more to account for the 'set' for a boat that can maintain 6kts.
A simple VHF radio with a WELL TUNED antenna is all you really need to communicate. Its a plus to have a handheld as a backup ... and just about everyone uses VHF in the Bahamas instead of telephones.
DO NOT follow the GPS rhumbline between any FL inlet to West End.... you want to be heading 'more southerly' at the beginning of the leg in the less strong flow, more South-easterly (that extra 20°) in the middle of the stream .... and then make your 'corrections' nearer to West End. Remember that a 24ft. boat will 'max. out' at about 5kts ... and the Gulf stream can be up to 4 kts. or sometimes greater .... and you will be at least 20°M (or more) 'against' the Gulf Stream to arrive in the Abacos ... about 3kts or less 'over the bottom' especially early and midway in your crossing.
If you miss West End because of unusual stream velocity, head for "Memory Rock" then go direct across the Little Bahama Bank to Great Sale Cay (or if still benign conditions go to Mangrove Cay) .... about 24-36 hours West Palm to Great Sale.
If an EPIRB is too expensive, get a "SPOT" ... and set up your messages before you leave. www.findmespot.com/
With your waterline length you will be unable to keep up with the typical sized boats going east.
Leave WELL before dawn, use Ch13/16 and do TALK to the Big Commercial Ships in the stream so they KNOW exactly where you are .... unfortunately many dont speak English and will not answer; but try anyway. Many ships going to the Mediterranean will come close to the western Abaco shore ... so watch for ships ALL THE WAY ACROSS. IF they dont answer you, stay away far from them ... as probably no one is on the bridge, etc.!!!
If your not well experienced in open ocean sailing .... get your ocean experience long BEFORE you attempt to cross the Gulf Stream in the Florida Straights .... as if you miss the Abacos, ..... the next stop is Bermuda ..... or Ireland.
;-)
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