@jon hansen All I am suggesting is nothing more than what (I hope) most of us believe and do as we leave the dock. To enjoy the freedom of the sea (or big MF lake), to be responsible for ourselves and our actions, to avoid making things worse or more dangerous to the other guy, and to stand ready to help others in need. Why can't we do this after we get off the boat?
It was not that long ago we needed to carry one of these if we wished to leave the country and return.
Excellent point but we require individual actions "for the benefit of the group" in daily life all the time and thus restrict the ability of an individual to take advantage of benefits allowed to the group because of their individual action. Take for example drinking alcohol. I see a lot of paralles in this example. One may chose to drink as much as they want. They may damage their liver or become an alcholic and we allow that because it is an impact on the individual and his immediate family for the most part (not entirely but that is where the most impact is felt). However, when that individual action impacts the group, like driving while intoxicated, we remove that individual's ability to participate in the benefits afforded others (driving).
The local hospitals require this for the flu. All employees who have a flu vaccine get an sticker for their IDs, those that don't get vaccinated wear a mask.
Your underlying assumption is that the vaccine is effective against ALL future mutations of this virus. My concern is mostly with the ability of the virus to linger in the population for an extended period of time, therefore allowing the opportunity for mutation. At some percentage of population not vaccinated the virus will continue to infect in sufficient numbers to remain "viable" and provides the opporunity for mutation. If that occurs and that "unvaccinated" person with the mutated virus sits next to me or has infected an otherwise vaccinated person who sits next to me I may very well get it. Bummer, just when I thought it was safe to go outside.i'm vaccinated now, the non vaccinated person poses no threat, he can now sit next to me and i do not care. the drunk on the highway does pose a threat.
lots to ponder. .... or not, i'm rarely in a crowd. have not showered in a year, people keep their distance naturally
That is only half of the equation. There are 2 sides of freedom, the freedom to do and the freedom from. It is a difficult balance to maintain and it is not always equal in the short term. That is why we need to (and did) pass several relief bills. That is why FEMA and the rest of us are sending financial support to Texas even though the powers that be there made bonehead decisions about deregulation of the power grid.
I may be inferring incorrectly from the above but if you suggesting society shouldn't deny basic rights to people who choose not to be vaccinated, I think that is back-asswards. In my view, those who choose to put themselves in that position to remain unvaccinated pose a risk to others by their commission and should be willing to accept whatever constraints society puts on them.
Just a tweek, not a monkey wrench. Either a vaccination OR a antibody test demonstrating some assumed level of immunity would be fine. In fact, to free up vaccines for those who really needed it early in the vaccine campaign IMHO they should have also immediatly ramped up antibody testing. If you have the antibodies then give the vaccine to somebody else and if you want one later when the supply is flush, then give it to those who have had it. But that didn't happen. The problem with relying on exposure for future protection is (as you have said) it is your immune system that does the work and your individual response to an exposure may not have given immunity. Just my 2 Cents.
How does that metaphor apply to people who make their own choice to get/not get vaccinated?
I agree with that! We still don't really know how many cases of Covid we had among the population since we don't test asymptomatic people as protocol. My Sister in Law had Covid and never knew it. She found out when she went to donate blood and was tested for the antibody. There could be millions of such cases.