Coil Or Braid Your Dock Lines?

[zeehag]

i coil mine but i also rarely go to docks. only fuel ones and i need to have easy access so i coil and leave on deck. out of way when at anchor and doesnt make such a mayhem of lines when needing to toss someone a line for fuel dock use. dirt washes off.

 

[Gary_H]

We used to do the same thing with our rapelling ropes so that we could tie off one end and then throw the rope bag out the window and the rope would deploy out of the bag without any knots or kinks.

 

[Rick Sylvester]

Around here,

we call that a 'SeaRay chain.'

 

[Sail123]

I showed it to my wife last night, and she did one, she called it crocheting.

 

[Big Windy]

Been coiling for years, works fine, not changiing now.

 

[Sail123]

Coiling, according to one web site on knots, is called a "Flemish Flake"

This web site is of the opinion, the Flemish Flake is not to be used for long term boat moorings at a dock.

People are funny. I never in a million years would have thought a coil was thought by some as temporary use only. Brother.

For you guys that do a coil all summer, Cease & Desist! lol

http://www.animatedknots.com/flemis...ge=LogoGrog.jpg&Website=www.animatedknots.com

 

[Joe]

Whatever..... just make it look neat. Of course, you'll notice in the animation that they start the coil from the outside...... impossible to do, in my mind.... it's much easier to start at middle and spin it out.... no kinks that way. Also......... it's much more practical with 3 strand that double braid... if you coil it right the circles coincide with the twist of the 3 strand.

 

[thinwater]

Please, neat, by all means.

Whatever..... just make it look neat.

I love walking the docks, looking at the generally inefficient, frequently silly, and sometimes dangerous tie-ups. The lack of chafing gear always jumps out at me, as do poor managment of tide, useless spring lines, and poor alignments in general. I dislike dockside piles of line as much as the next guy; a tripping hazard.

But nearly as funny are the boats with neatly flemished lines. I gather they have a lot of time on their hands.

I'm all for functional and workman-like rope work, but neat spirals make me laugh every single time.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Oh, the misuse of half hitches on dock cleats. Gee, how many turns around the cleat can they possibly make? Some folks just don't get tying off to a cleat, and keep building up line over line over line. Wonder how long it takes them to get the lines off the cleat?

And when they put their dock lines THROUGH the hole in the cleat on their boat...how do they figure to release it if they have to?

 

[caguy]

And when they put their dock lines THROUGH the hole in the cleat on their boat...how do they figure to release it if they have to?

That's why I always carry a knife.
Isn't that what the hole in the cleat is for?
Is there a better way of guaranteeing that the line will not come off accidentally?

BTW Merry Christmas

 

[Stu Jackson]

That's why I always carry a knife.
Isn't that what the hole in the cleat is for?
Is there a better way of guaranteeing that the line will not come off accidentally?

Why cut a perfectly good dockline?

No, that's NOT what the holes are for. (I used to think only motorboat skippers thought that, but I see it all too often on sailboats now, usually newer bigger ones.) In general, if your cleats are properly sized, the line you use shouldn't be able to fit through the hole. It means your line is too small.

Yes, there is an easy way to keep the lines on the cleat: http://www.c34.org/projects/projects-ron-hill.html Scroll down.

I haven't had a line come off one of my cleats even without the "keeper" that Ron describes.

Another way to do it is to have a slightly larger loop in the line and then turn it around the cleat once again. Sure keeps it on.

 

[caguy]

Thanks Stu, that's why I love this forum, learn something new with every visit.

 

[Sail123]

It all boils down to opinions, traditions, and the acceptance or rejection of alternate ways of doing things. I come to the sailing table with no traditions, some opinions, and an acceptance of any idea that shows merit, being at least pondered upon.

I keep a sail bag full of lines, all sort of extra this and that, just because it may be needed someday. Line locker is in my future. I did a braid chain to all of them. Man O Man is that much better! IMHO. I can see them in my minds eye hanging nice and neat in my Line Locker aboard the CM-30.

I wonder why a braid chain could not go back up the dock line and keep the extra off the docks completely?

 

[thinwater]

I'm not sure one size fits all....

No, that's NOT what the holes are for. (I used to think only motorboat skippers thought that, but I see it all too often on sailboats now, usually newer bigger ones.) In general, if your cleats are properly sized, the line you use shouldn't be able to fit through the hole. It means your line is too small.

Sorry, not true.

Whether the line fits through the hole is a matter of cleat design, not some rule of thumb. There are rules of thumb for line vs. cleat size.

A line fitted through the hole (cow hitch) will move less and thus chafe less. Chafe on the deck and dock are managed through chafing gear. Line should be sized for strength and shock absorption. I have had 2 boats go more than 15 years on dock lines, because I rig the lines to run fair and use quality chafing gear (the gear also lasted 15 years).

Throuble getting it loose? Silly. These are dock lines, not anchor lines. Never had a problem with that in 30 years, but I supose there are exposed slips where it could be a problem, as suggested. But that is only true for a very small portion of boats; assuming they are foolish is ill-informed and foolish.

I have seen lines that were simply looped either during a storm (extreem tides) or if a line broke (the remaining lines see different angles). Given that may eyes are spliced over size, some secondary mean of securing them is needed (if they are spliced the correct size, this is not true, but the chafe argument remains true).

_____________________

And this is just a forum and I'm just playin' with you. Merry Christmas!

 

[Sail123]

Someone give a good reason why the dock line should NOT be affixed to the boat the SAME WAY the dock line is affixed to the dock?

Dock

Boat​

Why is one traditionally done on the boat, and the other done on the dock, when both are the using the exact same thing?​

Why not use a cleat hitch on both ends of the same line?​

Last fall, I was on the docks, when a person untied the wrong dock line first, and the wind about yanked the stern off the boat, as it tried to leave the dock. The skipper did not have a knife as he was standing at the rudder, and he could not untie his end of the dock line. The boat was pulled back to the dock, but a great amount of damage was a split second away. That stuff burns deep into me, and I never want that happening to my boat.

 

[Joe]

I'll tell you why that is a common way of handling dock lines... because you only adjust one end. With the eye on boat, there is no problem with excess line that gets under foot. With the adjustment at the dockside the assistant can use the leverage of the line under cleat horn to control the boats movement and position.

If you tie up to vertical pilings, however, the eye loops over the piling and is adjusted form the boat side. Some sailors might find the need to double the line from the boat to the dock and back so they can use it to maneuver the boat and then retrieve the line after slipping it.

On my boat, I don't use the method in the picture for the eyesplice end, the line is too thick... I just loop it over the cleat. For my day sails, when I leave the lines on the dock, I just slip the eye off the cleat and take off.

 

[Stu Jackson]

I'll tell you why that is a common way of handling dock lines... because you only adjust one end.

On my boat, I don't use the method in the picture for the eyesplice end, the line is too thick... I just loop it over the cleat. For my day sails, when I leave the lines on the dock, I just slip the eye off the cleat and take off.

Yes, that was my point, too. So many people take their own dock lines with them for daysails. I've never understood that concept. Buy a few more lines to take with you elsewhere and leave your dock lines on your own dock. When you return, just flip the eye splice end over your own boat cleats and you're done, no measuring, no re-setting. And sticking the eye splice through the hole in the cleat won't work if you have your dock lines set up properly 'cuz there shouldn't be that much play in the lines.

 

[thinwater]

I've got to agree that for most folks, pre-set docklines...

Yes, that was my point, too. So many people take their own dock lines with them for daysails. I've never understood that concept. Buy a few more lines to take with you elsewhere and leave your dock lines on your own dock. When you return, just flip the eye splice end over your own boat cleats and you're done, no measuring, no re-setting. And sticking the eye splice through the hole in the cleat won't work if you have your dock lines set up properly 'cuz there shouldn't be that much play in the lines.

... are safer and easier. By re-tying each time, there is some much greater chance of misadjustment. A loop is impossible to screw-up, other than by ommision.

However, in areas of great tidal range (or were the level can vary while the owner is away due to storms) there will always be slack in the lines. If floating docks are used that is one thing, but they are rare on the Chesapeake. There is ALWAYS several feet of play in the lines in tidal areas with fixed piers. Spring lines limit the movement.

 

[zeehag]

i use regular lines--usually bout 3/4 inch 3 strand, and i do not dock as a regular thing--i use my anchor--- rode is all chain...... i seem many folks use docklines and keep 'em same same and that actually causes chafing.... be safe--inspect your docklines so you havent surprises.

 

[dkdoyle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXJpZUQc0jU

Last year I coiled but next year I am going to try braiding.

Hey Gary I gave this a shot and love it for storage in the locker. Thanks for posting