Chicken Jibe

[Don Guillette]

There's the controlled jibe and the chicken jibe, plus a couple of others. My advise to beginners is to use the controlled jibe in light to medium air. In strong winds or gusty conditions my suggestions to beginners is to use the "chicken jibe" because it's a safer method. When they have confidence in jibing they can use either in strong or gusty conditions. Notice I didn't attach a value to what constitutes medium or strong winds -- what those values are to some folks is not what they are for others.

What jibing method do you guys prefer??

 

[Warren Milberg]

If I am sailing with an able, experienced, crew member or two, I will go for the controlled jibe regardless of wind conditions. If I am alone, or without experienced crew, I'll do my own controlled jibe in winds up to around 10 kts (where I can steer with one hand and walk the boom over to the other side of the boat/wind with the other hand). If the wind is above 10 kts and I'm alone, it will be the "chicken jibe" every time.

 

[Stu Jackson]

I find the chicken jibe to be much more dangerous than a jibe in heavy winds, i.e., an afternoon in the dreaded San Francisco Bay SLOT of 20-30 knot TRUE wind.

That's because at those wind speeds and boat speeds, the waves are built up and turning broadside to them creates way more havoc than a controlled jibe. The apparent wind increase when you go around is ASTOUNDING. And can be quite scary.

I sail singlehand most of the time in those conditions, and I can do a controlled jibe quite easily. I am NOT a "slave behind the wheel" and my autopilot can't deal with those conditions, so I am always in front of wheel, controlling the mainsheet and traveler control lines, and the wheel - sometimes I put a small amount of friction on the wheel with the brake, but not always. Once the main is over, I deal with the jib. Forget the jib until you have the main done - sail the jibe like you didn't have a jib!

Gentlemen, for me it is a safety issue, and I would never do a chicken jibe in high winds.

 

[kappykaplan]

Always controlled jibe for me, whether with or without crew, no matter the wind conditions.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

When I'm alone and jibing in a stronger wind, I have a technique that seems to work pretty well. When preparing to jibe, I turn from the broad reach to downwind, at the same time centering the traveler and sheeting in the mainsheet. It's almost like luffing by the way the sail becomes depowered as the leech is nearly pointed directly into the wind. Anyway it really depowers the sail while still keeping the wind on the old windward side. When I'm ready to cross over, I guide the boom over with my hand as I steer to a run on the other side while the sail is depowered. Then I reverse the process by letting the mainsheet out and letting the traveler out as I adjust to the new course. At all points, I don't feel that I am in danger of backwinding the main.

I've found that it works fine when I'm reaching at up to 7 knots in a 15 to 20 knot blow, because the apparent wind is reduced significantly. My experience is based on insignificant wave conditions and I never feel like I reach the point where a jibe can happen violently when I'm not prepared. With a following sea, I would probably not feel nearly as secure.

I'm not exactly sure how, but I seem to manage the headsail without any complications. It is a little bit of a juggling act, to manage the sheets for 2 sails, the traveler lines and the helm (I'm always standing behind the helm for the maneuver), but the sequencing seems to fall into place as long as I make that slight hesitation in the turn to depower the mainsail before crossing over.

 

[topcat0399]

I've never used a chicken jibe (yet). I always haul the main in and let it out smoothly as the stern crosses the wind. If the wind is that high with the associated waves I try and avoid a broach.

Don:

I recall seeing some good posting by you from about 10 years ago that described a chicken jibe as "wearing". From my youth studies of square rigged sailing ships I always understood that "wearing" was more about not being able to tack heading upwind so the ship was wore around downwind (performing a jibe) and headed up again to the new tack.

What am I missing here??

 

[Warren Milberg]

I've often wondered, but never tried it: dropping the main while sailing dead downwind in a blow. In theory, it ought to work if you centered the main and dropped it just at it began to luff. Timing would be crucial. Have any of you ever tried it?

 

[Joe]

I never chicken jibe. On my 27 footer, when preparing for the jibe, I sheet in the main but leave the traveler down. Once I start the turn I grab the mainsheet bundle and pull the boom over by hand and let it ease down the track to its new position.

You can easily control the swing of the boom on the traveler by holding the mainsheet tackle in your hand. In higher winds, above 20 kts say, controlling the boom with the traveler control line is more comfortable.

The key to making the jibe is controlling your helm and getting the boom over as quickly as possible either by hand or using the new windward traveler control line. As soon as I start the turn I want a little slack on the jib sheet... then I grab the mainsheet and pull the boom in as I turn... as soon as it starts to go over I keep holding it to prevent it from slamming .... then let it go and put my attention on the jib. If you've slacked the jib correctly, it will be on the other side already, so you simply set the new sheet position, then release the old sheet.

Jibing requires a completely different headsail technique than tacking... this is where a lot of beginners make their mistakes. When tacking, the old sheet is thrown off the winch completely to allow the new side to be sheeted in close. On a jibe the sheets are already extended... so you just need to release the old sheet enough for the sail to clear over to the new side... if you throw it off the winch before the new side is set the sail will flap and shutter and possibly wrap around the forestay,

 

[dziedzicmj]

I had to look-up what a chicken gybe is. Never had used it. I do, on occasion, make a decision if i want to gybe or tack in a given situation, but i never thought of going a full 360 to avoid a gybe.

My safe technique is to sail from the broad reach to full running, switch to wing-on-wing (the genoa goes to the new tack), then ever so slowly move through the wind. You should be able to sail with wind at just over 180 degrees. Sheet in the main to the centre line and give a little bit push with the rudder (wheel or tiller). Let go (controllably) of the main sheets and you are set.

This is how I was taught years ago. So far, it worked. Granted, I don't do much sailing, at least lately, in big waves. For me, it worked up to about 30-35 kt.

Btw. I don't believe you can safely move the boom tackle with your hand in anything better than about 10 kt. This is what the line is for (and the sailing gloves).

 

[Stu Jackson]

I recall seeing some good posting by you from about 10 years ago that described a chicken jibe as "wearing". From my youth studies of square rigged sailing ships I always understood that "wearing" was more about not being able to tack heading upwind so the ship was wore around downwind (performing a jibe) and headed up again to the new tack.

What am I missing here??

Not missing anything. Good point. I had a friend with a heavy, full keeled 27 foot wooden schooner here on SF Bay. He HAD to do this to turn.

 

[Stu Jackson]

I've often wondered, but never tried it: dropping the main while sailing dead downwind in a blow. In theory, it ought to work if you centered the main and dropped it just at it began to luff. Timing would be crucial. Have any of you ever tried it?

Too dangerous if you had to do it. Had a friend who complained to me once that he had trouble dousing his main off Point Conception here on the California coast in high winds, couldn't even get his engine to turn the boat into the wind. I asked him why he had it up in the first place! Either a small amount of main up going downwind in the ocean in heavy weather, or none at all. Unless the winds came up so suddenly, in which case, heave to and deal with the issue before the waves build. Lotsa issues involved in dropping a main, even when hove to - I tried it in 7 foot seas at 7 seconds, and it was NO fun.

 

[Stu Jackson]

I had to look-up what a chicken gybe is. Never had used it. I do, on occasion, make a decision if i want to gybe or tack in a given situation, but i never thought of going a full 360 to avoid a gybe.

It's more like 270, dz.

Kinda like driving in LA: can't make a left, do three rights.

 

[Don Guillette]

topcat0339: You made me think back to when I started the sail trim forum. It was sometime in late 1999 or early 2000. Time sure does fly. It was about the time sailboatowners.com was starting their business. I couldn't find a company that would handle my products. They all told me to call back when I had a track record -- how am I suppose to to establish a track record when no one will carry my products!! One of my calls was to Bly Berkin I was expecting another NO but Sailboatowners.com was just starting and we hit it off so she gave me a chance. To sweeten the deal I suggested starting a forum. She asked me what's that. I told her I didn't know but I'd think of something!! I've never met Phil or Bly, but I'd like to some day. We started doing business the old fashion way -- no contract, our word was our bond and that's the way it's always been. I wish all my business relationships were that way.

Anyway, sorry to digress. You're correct and I had forgotten. Wearing is the term for square rigged ships.

Good comments so far and various opinions. Remember we're talking about beginners. I think there is nothing more scary for a beginner than to have that boom come screaming from one side of the boat to the other in a controlled jibe but that's just my opinion.

 

[topcat0399]

Not missing anything. Good point. I had a friend with a heavy, full keeled 27 foot wooden schooner here on SF Bay. He HAD to do this to turn.

So as I understand it a chicken jib and wearing around are essentially opposite maneuvers.

I have often had to wear around after blowing a tack either intentionally because the wind was too high and I didn't have the speed or unintentionally because the boat fell off so fast that it wore around around whether I wanted to or not.

I will give chicken jibes a try this spring just to see how it goes.

 

[Sprega]

Had the opportunity to deliver a Q boat back in the 70s. Had a good crew on board. Jibing that huge mainsail was quite an expearance. Even at that, we never considered doing a chicken jib. Also, I believe that "wearing" is what many square riggers did to tack, not jibe. I could be mistaken on that however.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Remember we're talking about beginners. I think there is nothing more scary for a beginner than to have that boom come screaming from one side of the boat to the other in a controlled jibe but that's just my opinion.

Don, nice story. Good relationships are to be treasured.

If this is happening to beginners, then they are doing it wrong. Even Sailing for Dummies got it right. Pull the mainsheet to centerline. The timing and speed are dependent on conditions. Scott's description was pretty good. In a controlled jibe on my boat, that boom is, well, controlled.

 

[Joe]

So as I understand it a chicken jib and wearing around are essentially opposite maneuvers.

I have often had to wear around after blowing a tack either intentionally because the wind was too high and I didn't have the speed or unintentionally because the boat fell off so fast that it wore around around whether I wanted to or not.

I will give chicken jibes a try this spring just to see how it goes.

Since it is unlikely the term "chicken jibe" was used in the Royal Navy..... the term "wear ship" is essentially .. taking the longer way. When you jibe because tacking is too difficult...common with square riggers... you lost a lot of gained ground....

The same is true in a fore and aft rig where you may choose to head upwind and tack rather than risk a difficult jibe.... you lose a lot of gained distance.... so.... if you think of "wearing" in the context of going the opposite way and losing some ground to facilitate a safer turn then it may make sense.

 

[Sprega]

Well put, Joe. Thanks

 

[topcat0399]

Since it is unlikely the term "chicken jibe" was used in the Royal Navy..... the term "wear ship" is essentially .. taking the longer way. When you jibe because tacking is too difficult...common with square riggers... you lost a lot of gained ground....

The same is true in a fore and aft rig where you may choose to head upwind and tack rather than risk a difficult jibe.... you lose a lot of gained distance.... so.... if you think of "wearing" in the context of going the opposite way and losing some ground to facilitate a safer turn then it may make sense.

Makes perfect sense - thank you.

What I am not sure about is in situations where a chicken jibe might be appropriate the sea state is such that I would probably be more fearful of a serious broach. Currently I opt for the jibe. Jackdaw has said that in heavy seas that a chicken jibe might be the best the course but I haven't brought myself to try it yet. The biggest waves I've been out in so far have been about 8 feet with a 6 second period. Exhilarating on a 25 foot Venture to say the least. I want to get the experience to eventually handle the bigger stuff on bigger waters.

 

[Scott B]

I've often wondered, but never tried it: dropping the main while sailing dead downwind in a blow. In theory, it ought to work if you centered the main and dropped it just at it began to luff. Timing would be crucial. Have any of you ever tried it?

Yep, ddw and running out of sea room. Centred the traveller, winched in the main VERY fast, and furled the main as soon as the pressure was off. Cleaned out shorts.