buy macgregor or not?

[Quebec1]

I own a 26M cause she can sail 10.9 knots with a lot of wind and wing on wing and motor at 18 mph and I can trailer her to Florida from Canada in 5 days, be in Cuba or the Bahamas 1 day later.

Also she has lots of room on the inside and with the full enclosure feels more like a 32 footer than a 26 footer & I can beach her on any sand dune and navigate thin waters on demand...yet still have a 5 foot dagger board ...which I break on a regular basis..but it only cost 200$ to replace and I can afford that.
She's a compromise that's for sure, I would prefer owning a Contessa 26
http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/12887,
but life is a bitch.

The Captain of the Zephyr


p.s. When I drink I forget about the blue water capacities of the Contessa and I sound like my current 26M is the best boat in the world.

 

[dlandersson]

Since I don't know your educational background, let me suggest that "Chicago" generally means "the Chicago metropolitan area".

Never looked for boat ramps north of the south side, but Whiting, Hammond, East Chicago, Porter, and Michigan City all have ramps that do not require passing under a bridge.

I suspect the north side has a similar number. Just as Wi-Fi doesn't magically stop at a wall, neither does Chicago sailing magically stop at the Chicago City limits.

Reviewing the stretch from Tower Road in Winnetka to Calumet Park at the far South Side of Chicago, there isn't much. This is about a 3-hour stretch by roadway. I imagine that the ramp at Tower Road is accessible to Winnetka residents only. There doesn't appear to be a ramp at Wilmette Harbor, Montrose Harbor, Belmont Harbor, Diversey Harbor is inaccessible to sailboats because of a bridge, or Monroe Harbor. Surpisingly (to me) there are 3 ramps at Burnham Harbor. This is right downtown (and technically the South Side) so this is probably the sole location of a ramp for the entire north shore that might be accessible all the way north to where? Waukegan?, the Wisconsin line?

Going south, there appears to be a ramp at Jackson Harbor, but if you launch a sailboat, you have to go under a bridge before you can step the mast. It also looks like there is a ramp at Calumet Park right on the Indiana border. So these are LOTS of choices for the South Side? Pretty slim if you ask me. Burnham would be a nice location, but how do you deal with loop traffic trailering a sailboat? Calumet is a fugly location if you ask me ...

It looks like there is ramp in Hammond, Indiana ... another fugly location ... and then Michigan City. What else is there except an industrial nightmare along the entire Indiana stretch?

That's what I mean by inaccessible for trailer sailing. A Chicagoan would have to travel a looonnnnggggg way out of the city to find an accessible place to launch the boat unless they thought Burnham Harbor was convenient or they could stand the smell closer to the Indiana border. (Not to be disrespectful of the industrial lakeshore).

I see dlandersson keeps his boat in a slip ... not exactly an endorsement for the accessibility of trailer sailing ...

 

[robertsapp]

Do ya think the posting was a troll (just to watch fireworks over the MacGregor debate?) ... that's what I'm thinking!

I just thought it was interesting, so I thought I'd share. I may have been right, judging by the amount of discussion it's generating. Now I'm working my way through the numerous links I found when I Googled on "MacGregor ocean crossing". There seem to be a lot of people out there who don't realize how dangerous and unseaworthy their boats are. God truly watches over fools and sailors.

 

[Jackdaw]

You must have been sailing on a different Lake Michigan than I was. :naughty:

He kinda does. Your typical Michigan city lake breeze blows out of the N-NW, and often aligns with the prevailing NW winds. On the SE side of the lake the lake breeze is out of the east, and can 'fight' with NW winds.

 

[Juice6576]

Trailer sailing Lake Michigana

Our previous boat was a Hunter 26. When we bought it, we lived in the Quad Cities and a water ballast trailerable was perfect. Here in Wisconsin, we found our 26 to be small for the big lake. Any water ballast boat is Category C, protected water. Lake Michigan can easily kick up and become too rough.We also found we spent most of our time in a slip, so the only advantage is you can haul and launch yourself. Be realistic in what you want to do with the boat. If you really want to trailer and travel,get a smalle boat that is easier to trailer, like a Potter 19 or a Sea Pearl. If you find yourself using a slip, get something that has a keel and at least a Cat B.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Well the poster may have been a troll, so we don't know much about her, or what they consider a reasonable distance to travel. While some might say that Lake Hopatcong is at the fringe of the NY metropolitan area, by no means do I say that Lake Hopatcong is New York in my signature line so I will assume that Chicago means Chicago and not another city, town or state in the metropolitan area. I just pointed out that there is no accessible ramp for the entire north side all the way up to Winnetka, which is significantly north of Chicago. Waukegan may be the first location a boater may find other than Indiana.

As a native to the north side, I know that there is nothing reasonable about traveling with a sailboat all the way down to Indiana but a south sider may not have a problem with it. I'm just pointing out that accessibility is extremely limited, and your choices in Indiana don't sound convenient or appealing ... just sayin'

It's not intended to be disrespectful ... I'm just commenting on the premiss of purchasing a sailboat that is designed for trailer sailing when trailer sailing options are so limited in that particular area. It seems to me that it would make far more sense to look at boats that are better suited to Lake Michigan, when it is likely that sailing from a slip or mooring is BY FAR the most convenient option.

Of course when costs are the over-riding issue, don't get a slip or a mooring and buy the cheapest trailer sailer that will provide a shiny facade, and nevermind the performance aspect of sailing.

 

[dlandersson]

Love the chart. Thankyouverymuch.

Note that Scott Liar was applying his experience within 100 meters of Navy Pier with the rest of the lake.

I've often thought that Green Bay might have superior sailing.

 

[MrBill_FLL]

^Wow, we agree.

if you can afford 10k in slip fees, why would you consider a mac?

macgregor builds trailersailors from the get go... easy to tow, fast to setup and break down.

and ok out on the water.

compromise all the way.

 

[dlandersson]

Scott,

I'm a little confused. You include the entire north side up to Wisconsin with Chicago, but not the south side?

As a "north sider" you know it's not reasonable to "travel with a sailboat all the way to Indiana" - you have got to be kidding me. Lot's of boats on the southern side do exactly that - note that many have slips on the south side.

Since you live in NY state and it's safe to assume that your memory "ain't what it used to be" I suggest that you confine yourself to NY sailing comments. :dance:

 

[Capt. Kermie]

How about Trailer Boating not Trailer Sailing

I'll go back to the premiss that MacGregor is primarily a trailer sailer. The problem with that is Chicago is not condusive to trailer sailing. Surprising as it may seem to people who are chiming in from all locations, I think there are extremely limited opportunities to use a trailer sailer anywhere near Chicago. If they intend to use the boat near home, they would probably need to launch the boat far away and then keep it on a slip or mooring in the city. If that is the case, what is the advantage of a trailer sailer? I don't think there are any ramps to use or any place to keep the boat on a trailer.

Of course I might be wrong, but I've lived in Chicago and sailed there ... I can't think of any place where trailer sailing would be convenient or even possible ... unless the intention is to travel to smaller lakes far away.

This sounds like bullcrap by any definition. I have never been to Chicago or for that matter anywhere back east, I live on the west coast at the 49th parallel and boat in the Pacific Ocean. Greater Vancouver to be precise. Even though I have never been to the Great Lakes I know that I can make a few assumptions and verify them with a bit of demographic research. For starters Chicago is no small town city, I would safely guess it is substantially larger and more populous than Vancouver. I can also prove with a bit of research that the largest segment of boats sold and used are in the range of 12' - 20' power boats - trailerables to be specific. With boating venues as vast as the Great Lakes one can easily imagine how many boats could be sold in such a prime geographic location. The dense population around the Great Lakes could easily support a huge ownership of trailerable boats in driveways and these owners quite likely have a wide choice of ramps to launch from. Do you even have a remote idea of just how many hobby fisherman there are in North America and how many are living around the Great Lakes? Small boat owners comprise the largest segment of of the boating industry bar none. They are launching somewhere or they would not own a boat. They fish, they waterski, wakeboard, pull tubes or just blast around but they do in fact exist and they do go boating. Let's not forget the paddlers here either (I have a canoe and a Kyack).There are no shortage of ramps available for them, it is just that you do not know about them, but they do. If one can launch a power boat there, then one can launch a MacGregor there too.

 

[kielboatsa]

a can in Chicago is about $35 to $50 a foot and a slip is $75 to $120 / foot. No where near $10,000.
http://www.chicagoharbors.info/2012 Harbor Fees.pdf

 

[dlandersson]

Ditto.

This sounds like bullcrap by any definition.

 

[kielboatsa]

removed what I said about Diversy harbor once I figured out it was not correct

 

[dlandersson]

If one is looking at an X or an M, one can sail (sorta) and one can "fish, waterski, wakeboard, pull tubes, pull up to a beach or just blast around" also. In fact, the X or M doesn't sail as well as a dedicated sailboat, but they do provide for lots of family activities. You "invest in what you value" - in my case, my family.

I believe Diversy harbor is the only one in the City that has a launch ramp for where you do not need to go under a low bridge to get to the lake.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Go ahead and jump ugly on me ...

I'm just pointing out the obvious ... Kermie, why don't you point out to me the ramps on Lake Michigan from the Wisconsin border all the way around to the Michigan border and then comment on the traffic patterns, the parking facilities and all other logistical issues that make trailer sailing easy and convenient in this area. I just listed all the ramps for a very broad stetch of lake front and I think by anybody's definition, it would be considered very limiting. Why don't you point out the ramps that I missed ... you can use google maps for your research, it zooms in sufficiently to find them. Did you know that almost 90% of the lakefront in Chicago is controlled by the City, and access is limited? Don't look to the northern suburbs for access because it virtually doesn't exist for boaters.

dlandersson pointed out a handful of locations in Indiana but if you look at google maps, you will see that marinas are relatively small and limited. There ARE vast tracts of heavily industrialized properties in Indiana. Yes, I am saying that Michigan City is a long way to trailer a boat from Chicago, depending upon where a person may be located in Chicago. I also note that he points out that he knows many from Chicago who keep their boat in marinas around that stretch of the lake. That is exactly my point ... they keep their boats there, they don't trailer them there so much. But, really, we don't know the posters tolerance for difficulty, I'm just registering my opinion.

I do know that the shoreline from Michigan City all the way north around the eastern shoreline of the lake is nothing short of spectacular. The eastern shore has all the benefits of warmer water, finer sand beaches and beautiful dunes that the western shoreline misses out on. If I lived in Chicago, I could easily see the attraction of keeping my boat in a slip or mooring anywhere from Michigan City to Holland. I would happily drive in my car from the north side, through the industrial heartland of northwest Indiana, to Michigan City, Indiana or beyond to get to my sailboat.

Would I keep a sailboat in Calumet, Hammond, Gary or Whiting if I lived in Chicago and had access to a slip or mooring in Chicago? No way .... Would I drive through those areas trailering a sailboat every weekend to launch it in one of those spectacular areas beyond the Indiana Dunes? No freaking way! That's way too much effort.

 

[Sail123]

Interesting thread. Pretty sure the OP was a troll looking to sturrr the pottt.

Still, the responses were interesting. My Mac 25 (when the Mac's were strictly sailboats) hit the slip yesterday. Miserable, cold, rain. Still a day on a sailboat, any day, is better than a day in the business. I knew two days after I purchased my Mac it was a stepping stone to a different boat. I almost purchased an X. Boy O boy, am I glad I sat that out. For me, I think time under sail, is better than time under power, for myself, on my lake. If I needed to get quickly to another location, maybe a power sailor would be a good choice. A kicker is all the engine I need. For times I want a power boat, I have a 150 HP power boat. 19 feet of fire on the lake is fun when that is what you want. I prefer the sounds of sailing.

Saturday when I wanted to put the boat in the water, we discovered the three 1/4 bolts holding the mast base plate in, had nothing under the fiberglass except nuts. Nothing!!! Seriously? Under the mast? What was MacGregor thinking? The fibreglass was not holding (who would expect it to?) and the bolts were pulling through the thin fiberglass. A trip to the hardware store for stronger hardware, and R&R of several things in the cabin, and the repair was 10,000 times better than new.

I love my Mac because it gets me out on the water, but I will also love the day I sell it, and there ain't no turning back (I hope)

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Ha! ... dlandersson must think .....

a can in Chicago is about $35 to $50 a foot and a slip is $75 to $120 / foot. No where near $10,000.
http://www.chicagoharbors.info/2012 Harbor Fees.pdf

that everybody owns a 50' to 80' sailboat and keeps it at a slip at Belmont Harbor.

Now we see where the BS begins and ends!

 

[dlandersson]

Scott,

My aunt/godmother from 82nd NYC once visited me in Ft Harrison, IN for the summer. She was quite surprised to find that there were no longer any Indians or Buffalo around Indianapolis. She was pretty sure that the US west of NYC was still wilderness.

You are right about the beaches and the scenery. You obviously have no clue re" the "vast industrial area" - yes there are factories (just like Chicago) but you pretty much have to go looking for them. I80/94 (E/W) along the south side has a speed limit of 70 mph after you pass I65 (N/S). Travel time to Michigan city is approx. 24 minutes. There is the marina, stunning beaches, a park, a children's zoo and an outlet mall (not a good thing-wife likes to shop) all within walking distance of each other. There's a casino too, for the occasional MIL.

Whiting, Hammond, East Chicago are closer, have nice beaches and Casinos. Their marinas are "limited" in that they don't have 1,000+ slips, but that's about it.

If you live on the north side, I would agree that trailering to the south side every weekend may or may not be feasible - but the original poster did not indicate where they live. I really don't see much difference with the person/family who drives 2 hours each weekend to their summer cottage in Wisconsin.

 

[dlandersson]

Dunno about that...mostly familiar with Dusable harbor - not much different from the Indiana marinas (including Macgregors).

that everybody owns a 50' to 80' sailboat and keeps it at a slip at Belmont Harbor.

Now we see where the BS begins and ends!

 

[Scott T-Bird]

I've driven that stretch of roadway enough to know how vast the industrial area is ... of course it does include the south side of Chicago as well. There really is no reason to minimize it ... it is what it is ... I don't think you have to do much more than drive the Skyway and I90-94 to "find" it. It's pretty obvious.

Actually, I think you can get to nicer areas in Michigan much faster than you can get to the scenic areas of Wisconsin, even from the north side. The difference in shoreline between the west shore and the east shore is pretty dramatic as well. I don't think there is anything appealing about the west shoreline until you get as far away as Door County and that because of the scenery. Water is frigid, shoreline is gravelly, there are no dunes ... But the east shoreline is fantastic! Beaches along the entire coastline are among the finest I have seen anywhere! I think the ports that you can sail to are far more interesting as well.

But you have to realize that driving around the south end of the lake is a pretty major drawback. There are few uglier areas in the country to drive thru, and I'm speaking from a lot of experience on the NJ Turnpike!