Blasphemy by Winch Over-haul

[CloudDiver]

BTW.... I can't tell the size from the pics but they look big. A good restoration on those and I'd bet someone on a classic yacht would pay a pretty penny for a matched pair of bronze self trailers in restored condition. Although you'd have a tough time finding any replacement gears or bearings, Lewmar springs and pawls work perfectly.

 

[SFS]

You might be surprised at what the follow-on company has in stock regarding parts. They were really helpful when I was dealing with my Barlows.

Sales@huttonwinches.com

 

[pateco]

BTW.... I can't tell the size from the pics but they look big. A good restoration on those and I'd bet someone on a classic yacht would pay a pretty penny for a matched pair of bronze self trailers in restored condition. Although you'd have a tough time finding any replacement gears or bearings, Lewmar springs and pawls work perfectly.

I just measured them, and the bases are 8" across. I need to check if they will fit my boat (1983 H31) they may be a little too big. If they wont fit I will restore/refurbish to sell, and use that money to buy self tailers that do fit. They seem to work perfectly and spin easy. I will probably just clean them and repack the bearings. If I am going to use them myself, I am going to buff/polish them up. But if I need to sell them do you think it would be better to polish, or leave patina?

 

[SFS]

Given the pictures early in the thread, I'd polish them, but that's just me.

When you open them up, you'll find that working on winches is not at all hard. Go slow, take pictures at each stage, so that if you do happen to forget how something goes back, you can check the picture. As others have said, there generally is only one way it can go back together. I would do one at a time, so that if you do have a problem, you can use the other one for reference.

I would make a note somehow of which side of a given part is "up". I had a gear that had a wear pattern on one side that was not noticeable until I cleaned the part. It took me a few minutes to decide which side was up (it would have fitted back in place with either side up). I emailed Hutton to confirm my suspicion. That was the only non-routine thing I encountered rehabbing 4 older Barlows (well, except for dropping a bearing overboard).

 

[Jackdaw]

BTW.... I can't tell the size from the pics but they look big.

Barlow 25s are indeed big. Two speed and about 30 lbs each, the size of a current Lewmar 44.

That is one of the first self tailing winches.... IIRC the wiper and the top of tailer are fixed, making the whole deal a lot less efficient at holding. Later designs with floating wipers are much better. But nice find!

 

[pateco]

Barlow 25s are indeed big. Two speed and about 30 lbs each, the size of a current Lewmar 44.

That is one of the first self tailing winches.... IIRC the wiper and the top of tailer are fixed, making the whole deal a lot less efficient at holding. Later designs with floating wipers are much better. But nice find!

Jackdaw,

These are 28s not 25s and they weigh a lot. I cant even find pictures of them online, let alone specs or manuals. Someone on Ebay has a pair of Chrome ones listed, but no real specs
2 SELF TAILING Barlow Sailboat Winches 28 2 Speed

 

[SFS]

@pateco - Chip, they will likely have a manual, or at least an exploded parts diagram, at Hutton. I'm telling you, they did not abandon the Barlow/Barient legacy. The guy in sales is named Alan. He's really helpful, but remember there is about 13 hours time difference.

Edit: Here's a manual:
http://l-36.com/winches_pages.php?winch=bar28_stw.htm

There are three other manuals available for 28s on this page, but they appear not to be 2-speed ST models:

http://l-36.com/winches.php

And an article that may be applicable:
http://l-36.com/winches_pages.php?winch=how.html

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

Looks great. .I have Bronze Barlow 16's on my 1961 Meridian. Wipe it down with lemon oil. Won't give it a total patina, ,but makes it look less "shiny"

 

[hewebb]

Beautiful - great find
I just bought two used Barient 21ST winches. I took them apart to service before mounting and one pawl spring is missing-appears that I am not the first to take it apart. It is the spring for the small pawl. I contacted Hutton and they do not have it available. Anyone know if the kit at West Marine will have the small pawl spring, or where I can find one. West Marine tech advisor answer was not clear.

 

[jssailem]

Hutton folks are a great source. If not in stock they can make a part. Sometimes a bit spendy. on SFS .

Get the right Spirolux snap ring to secure the gears to the main shaft from Smalley.com.
The pawl springs in the Lewmar kit work. The Lewmar pawls fit my Barient ST23's.

 

[Brian S]

Funny how perspectives change. When I was younger, I wanted bronze to look new and shiny, but it's impossible to keep it that way on a boat, unless you polish it incessantly. Granddad tried to spray clear coat of various types sometimes, or varnish right over, but it never lasted long.

Now, I look at the brown patina on bronze, and I rather like it.

As for the OP's purpose with that winch, I think fully cleaned and restored to working order, and for the intended indoor purpose, polished as it is, it looks very nice. And I fully appreciate the work to get it to that place.

 

[GGordonWoody]

my butcher-block Rigger's bench

What's that for?

 

[pateco]

Crap, I measured the boat over the weekend. The bases on these winches are 8" and I only have 7" of deck width to mount on so it looks like I will be restoring them to sell, and using the money to buy some self-tailers that actually fit my boat.

 

[NotCook]

A service wasn't enough, this needed a full over-haul.

Nicely done.

 

[Jackdaw]

Crap, I measured the boat over the weekend. The bases on these winches are 8" and I only have 7" of deck width to mount on so it looks like I will be restoring them to sell, and using the money to buy some self-tailers that actually fit my boat.

You'll be much happier. That is a old old design, one of the first cracks at making a ST winch. They didn't work well, and you would need to use HUGE sheet to get them to even work at all. Get what you can for them.

 

[pateco]

So I got time Wednesday to pull them apart and service them.

Gears and bearings were in great shape, just needed cleaning

They went back together very easy. I did them one at a time so that I had a reference for reassembly.

They turned out nice.

I think they would polish up wonderfully, but I will leave that decision to the next owner. Putting them up in the SBO Classifieds.


FOR SALE: Pair of Bronze 2 speed Barlow 28 Self Tailing Winches

 

[CloudDiver]

Finally put the subject bronze winch into service; Pictured below is my "Rigger's Bench" or "Belay Bench" (haven't decided what name I like better... Anyway, I needed a place to do my splicing and rope work so I found this butcher block countertop on CL, but you can also buy them new from LumberLiquidators for around $150. I added some adjustable length chrome legs I got from Ikea that screw on the bottom... I have a bunch of steel uni-strut that I was going to use to build a much more robust and bomb-proof frame but I have too many projects going on at once. These legs are a good temporary solution and I need to get my rigging done for the boat.
Some features;
- The winch is used to for a number of rigging tasks where heavy pulling is required, like setting a spliced eye. Also, I'll be using it to pre-stretch dyneema standing rigging with a load cell to measure tension. The line on the winch is a 15 ft length of 3/8 Amsteel 2 with a dyneema chafe cover to do the work.
- The orange blocks you see at each end of the table are rock-climbing rescue pulleys rated for 20 KN each. When I have long lines to pull I can string up to about 50 ft through these and tension with the winch. I will make a set of Belay Pins from 1/2" stainless round bar with hardwood handles epoxied onto them. A series of 1/2" holes will be drilled at the ends of the table allowing me to drop in a belay pin where ever I need to set a pulley or just need a hard attachment point. I can pretty much drill a 1/2" hole anywhere on the table where I want to be able to set a Belay Pin.
- the butcher block knife holder I got off Amazon and filled most of the slots with epoxy. I left the bottom two small knife slots for ceramic knives and the scissors slot for my kevlar shears. In the filled slots I drill the appropriate sized holes for my splicing fids. I've only done the small sizes, still need to drill the top row for the big sizes.
- The clamp on swing-arm lamp is temporary, robbed from my computer desk... I'm on the hunt for the same type lamp that has the big magnifying glass in it.

 

[AaronD]

... below is my "Rigger's Bench" or "Belay Bench" ...

Nice work, @CloudDiver! I was pretty envious of this setup yesterday as I tried to milk Sta Set cover over a length of Amsteel. I found myself tying a line around the kitchen island (the handiest anchor guaranteed not to move under tension) and snaking it throughout the house to pull. On the flip side, my method provides endless entertainment for the cat!

 

[GGordonWoody]

The winch is used to for a number of rigging tasks where heavy pulling is required, like setting a spliced eye. Also, I'll be using it to pre-stretch dyneema standing rigging with a load cell to measure tension. The line on the winch is a 15 ft length of 3/8 Amsteel 2 with a dyneema chafe cover to do the work.

Sheesh @CloudDiver, you're the most productive son-of-a-sailor in these forums. Very nice indeed, but you're making the rest of us look bad. If the cops ever bust down your door, you'll have to explain the innocuous intent of all that Medieval hardware - ha! I'm looking at it and I still don't understand how to use it. Do you think you could post a video of it in action??

 

[bawlmer]

I don't know what is cooler. The rigging bench or the fact that you have a room for it. That is an awesome setup. You could make some excellent soft shackles on that bench when you're not doing real rigging.