bad fuel?

RAD · Dec 27, 2012

I would polish the fuel and if you can get the tank out then do it and start fresh....the last thing you need is an algae bloom in the fuel system and for future fill ups I always use a busy truck stop so I know the fuel is fresh and when traveling I try and stop at a busy place.
when I changed my tank out I took what fuel was in there and put it down the oil burner fuel tank so it got good use

catsailor · Dec 27, 2012

a. Examine the sediment. If it is gritty or just mushy, it is rust. Not too serious. If it is slimy, like snot (sorry, no better descriptor) then it is biomass.

b. Biobor is good for 50 % of the bugs, just like some antibiotics are for gram possitive and some are for gram negative. Consider switching to an contrasting biocide for the other 50%. FPPF Kill-Em would be a good contrasting treatment. Testing of some others is described on the link below. Practical Sailor has a more extensive write-up.
http://sail-delmarva.blogspot.com/p/diesel-biocides.html

Chris Patterson · Dec 27, 2012

Buy carburetor dip cleaner, comes in gallon cans at NAPA or whatever. Let it sit in the tank for about 24 hours, and it'll look like the day it was made. I do this all the time, and I promise you, there are few if any other things will eat this scrunge out.

You can do the same thing for your boat tank, but it's best to take it out so you can swish it around, and hose it out very well. Yes, a common garden hose, with some dish detergent or whatever. Let it dry. It will be gorgeous.

You can get the most of it out with a shop vac, (the water and soap).

Or, you can do like the very first time I ever tried this. After asking around the yard, I tried everything I could get my hands on. Acetone, paint thinner, B12, soaps, you name it. Every one of them had the same effect as peeing on the gelcoat.

And all of this for about 20 bucks.

And throw your fuel away. Dispose, whatever. It's contaminated, and not worth fooling with.

higgs · Dec 27, 2012

I would take a sample to someone who really knows about diesel engines and see what they say.

Steve Dion · Dec 27, 2012

Don't waste your money on fuel polishing. Remove the fuel from the tank and dispose of it. Maybe the fire department will take it off your hands.

Clean out the tank the best you can and refill with clean fuel. The Biobor may kill the bugs, but it does not get rid of the water/crud in the fuel.

I think you will find that fuel polishing will cost $250-400.

As for your jerry can, you can wash it out and let it dry. You can also check to see if it is rusty inside.

RichH · Dec 27, 2012

Whoa, Hang on here.

Most diesel fuel, especially thats been stored for a long time or if the 'depot' that you bought it from had a recent delivery, will/can have 'crud' in it .... or the delivery source that you bought your fuel has a broken 'filter' in its delivery system - quite common. Thats what Racor, etc. filters and filters with 'sumps' are for, to remove the debris that is generated/grows in the storage tanks.

Draw off some of the fuel in the tank
1. take some of the fuel, put it into clean glass container/cup - abut 4 oz. (~120ml.)
2. hold it up in front of STRONG white light, between your eyeballs and the light.
3. If you can discern a 'haze' or 'worse' in the fuel when look through the fuel towards the bright white light, then the fuel is contaminated and should be replaced with fresh ... dont worry about a wee bit of 'solid' crud in the bottom of the container that you hold.
4. if the fuel is 'dark' (to 'black') in color - denotes a severe fungal, etc. infection ('kerosene fungus' aka: Cladosporium Resinae, etc.) ... if so, you should or need to consider to thoroughly clean out your tank.
5. SMELL the fuel in the container (and the jerry can), if it smells like 'bacon' or french fries ... it's probably 'reclaim' or so-called bio-diesel 'mixture' ... and a LOT of 'illicit shenanigance' can accompany so-called 'bio-diesel'.

If the 'crud' in your jerry can is 'soft' (easily squished by your fingers) and/or 'deformable' ... probably a fungus .... simply add more biobor, etc. to your tank to help mitigate the growth.
The newer 'enzymatic' microorganism control fuel additives are quite efficient in keeping the bio-burden to acceptable levels in fuel tanks.
If the fuel in the boats filters is 'dark' - consider to clean out the tank.
If the fuel in the boats filter sump has a LOT of 'hard' particles - clean the tank, and change where you buy your fuel.
If the fuel in the boats filter sump has a LOT of water - change the o-ring/gasket on your deck fill ....

if water in the tank or filter sump is more than occasional problem, keep only the amount of fuel in the tank that you NEED (plus some reserve);
dont always 'top off' with fuel;
when long term storing the boat, drain/empty the tank.
Recirculation polishing will NOT 'clean' a tank, recirculation polishing is to keep a clean tank clean (as long as possible).

hope this helps. *<

)))

SailMaster · Dec 28, 2012

This leads into another question:

What is the proper method for "Polishing Fuel"?

In the past I have simply employed an electric fuel pump and pumped all old fuel out of our tanks thru the normal racor filter into fuel cans. Then change the filter element.

Is there a more intense filtering method?

RichH · Dec 28, 2012

Recirculation polishing is 'best' accomplished through the use of 'low efficiency' capture (beta ratio @ ~40) using large surface area or 'depth type' filters at approx. 5-10 x the micronic µM rating than the 'target' residual µM desired and filtered at 'high turnover' rates (gallons, etc. per minute).
See http://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/564/filter-beta-ratios for 'brief' discussion of beta ratio values.

Simple speak: you want the cheapest 'depth type' (rather than a 'surface capture' filter such as a comparatively expensive 'racor' type filter), rated at about 5-10µM 'nominal' rating (80-90% efficiency @ µM 'rating'), and filter the entire contents of the tank MANY MANY MANY times .... filtering at a relative high flow rate over and over and over and over again until the fuel loses it 'haze' (see 'test' in previous post). Recirc. Filters are 'selected' by choosing the lowest "differential pressure performance vs. flow rate (Gallons per minute per psid).

How 'recirculation polishing' works is that for any filter material there are many capture sites available that are much SMALLER (µM) than the filters arbitrary 'rating'. A large µM rated filter will have less 'resistance to flow' (∆P) than a smaller µM rated filter and will have more 'flow capacity (GPM vs. ∆P) enabling a LOT of fluid volume to be 'filtered' repetitively (over and over and over again). The more times the fluid is 'filtered', the better the 'chance' of capturing VERY small particles (even 'submicronic' sizes) using a relatively large µM rated filter. High 'turnover rate' (gallons, etc. per minute) or the gross amount of fluid re-filtered is the KEY in recirculation polishing.
The 'haze' you see in diesel fuel can be caused by particles as low as 0,5µM. You should use a 5-10µM recirculation filter to remove the 0,5µM particles. If you 'single pass' filter to remove such you will need TEN TIMES the filter surface area (TEN TIMES the amount) of 0,5µM filters than when using a single 5µM 'low flow' filter. Plus, once a recirculation filter begins to 'load' with particles, the 'dirt' already captured will aid in capturing 'smaller and smaller and smaller' sized 'dirt'.
High 'turnover rate' is the KEY in recirculation polishing ... (has something to do with "the Newtonian laws of exponential decay").

Note: there is not enough 'flow capacity' in a typical small boat 'fuel distribution system' because of the SMALL tubing diameter and small flow 'racor type' filters. For a 50-100 gallon boat tank to 'recirculate polish' you need approx 1/2" diameter piping and at least a 24hr. DAY to 'filter' .... and you need to monitor the filter with a pressure gage to know WHEN to change. The typical 'industrial' 10" x 2.5" dia 'depth'. filter will only have about 30-50 grams of dirt capacity.

Note: recirculation filtration will NOT 'clean' a tank, to remove the 'gunk' stuck onto the walls of a fuel tank, you should mechanically 'scrub' the walls. Recirculation polishing is to keep a clean tank clean (longer).

If you intend to construct an onboard fuel polishing system, PM me and I will reply with a concept drawing with list of common components. Do NOT use the fuel 'return line' for recirculation polishing ... not enough 'flow' in it to be effective. An onboard recirc. polishing system should be able to 'filter' at about 3 gallons per MINUTE per 100 gallon tank.

*<

)))

Warren Milberg · Dec 28, 2012

I always tend toward the simplest solutions. How many gallons of fuel would you imagine the "average" sailboat carries? Maybe 20 gals? My guess that is high. My boat, for example, holds 11.5 gal when totally full and my average is probably somewhere between 5-8 gals at anyone time. So... if you have $50 worth of fuel in your tank that is suspect, get rid of all of it. It will much cheaper and probably better than "polishing" it. To me, "polishing" fuel is like polishing a turd: in the end, you have a nice shiny turd. The problem with biocides is that while they may kill the little beasts, they do not get rid of the bodies. If you religiously keep water out of your fuel you won't have anything growing in it. If you really need to keep the suspect jerry can, you can prolly clean it by throwing in some pea gravel and soapy water, shake it violently, then dump it out. Rinse the can with clearn water and let it dry out upside down with the top off. Change your Racor, and secondary filter, put in a few gallons of really clean fuel with no water in it (use a West or BaHa water separating/crud funnel or similar every time you put fuel in your boat, no matter what the source), and start up your engine and run it to see what happens. Most likely, all will then be well.

RichH · Dec 28, 2012

Warren Milberg said:
I always tend toward the simplest solutions. How many gallons of fuel would you imagine the "average" sailboat carries? Maybe 20 gals? My guess that is high. My boat, for example, holds 11.5 gal when totally full and my average is probably somewhere between 5-8 gals at anyone time. So... if you have $50 worth of fuel in your tank that is suspect, get rid of all of it. It will much cheaper and probably better than "polishing" it. To me, "polishing" fuel is like polishing a turd: in the end, you have a nice shiny turd. If you really need to keep the suspect jerry can, you can prolly clean it by throwing in some pea gravel and soapy water, shake it violently, then dump it out. Rinse the can with clearn water and let it dry out with the top off. Change your Racor, and secondary filter, put in a few gallons of really clean fuel with no water in it (use a West water separating/crud funnel or similar), and start up your engine and run it to see what happens. Most likely, all will then be well.

The BEST and most economical 'solution' when you have a small tank.

zeehag · Dec 28, 2012

i always filter fuel between jerry jugs and tank...if i dont have a baja filter, i use a sock or a t shirt, clean. is a dedicated filter after first use.

zeehag · Dec 28, 2012

John R said:
Here are two photos of the remains from the bottom of the (plastic) jerry can. Some of the crud in the bottom definitely looks like and feels like sand. As for the red colored layer -- maybe that's the remains from diesel bought at a marine? Or maybe algae?

the red goo is algae. biocide is effective .... have fun!

zeehag · Dec 28, 2012

i was told to use bolts in the bottom of the dry can, shake.
i was advised to use clorox in the can, shake and rinse.
either or both will work.
use bio-bor regularly.
smooth sailing!

Steve Dion · Dec 28, 2012

John: Why don't you purchase fuel from the fuel dock in Emeryville. They must turn a lot of fuel there with the fishing boats & the two marinas.

If you every think you want to build a fuel polishing system that you would leave on the boat, you may want to look at some of the trawler sites. There are some detailed ones out there.

You may also want to consider getting a Baja Filter if you want to continue using the jerry cans too.

Getting your current tank cleaned out may resolve your problem for ever. Good luck!

bad fuel?

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