1984 O'Day 23... bottom construction under foxhole...

May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
Hi All-
I recently purchased a 1984 (I'm told, not sure how to verify) O'Day23 ... I'd like to add a depth sounding transducer in the bow (either a standalone depth-sounder or to plug into a to-be-bought GPS chartplotter...
The boat is in the water and I have neither the desire nor means to haul for this purpose, but would very much like the transducer mounted in the bow, not on the transom (no need to tell me I just passed shallow water as I have the centerboard for that)...
The units I'm looking at have in-hull transducers available that supposedly work fine through solid fiberglass, but not so much through wood cores... so they recommend cutting through to the outer-skin, which I don't see myself doing with the boat in the water...

Can anyone tell me for certain, I believe the deck is a balsa core, but what about the bottom?
Has anyone mounted these types of transducers to the inner skin who can report on performance? (ones I'm looking at are Hawkeye D10D or the Airmar ones for Garmin chartplotters)
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
While I never like the idea of a transom hung transducer (bass boat anyone?) on a sailboat, the notion of forward transducer location helping avoid grounding is a bit of a myth. All positions will indicate shoaling to give you plenty of notice on a sailboat. Then its all on you, regardless of transducer location. Time to start using your eyes, and not your gauges.
 
May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
Thanks for the response, Jackdaw... I certainly agree with you in as much as what you say boils down to having some basic seamanship skills instead of relying on instruments... nonetheless...

The sad fact is that half the waters I'll be sailing in basically one giant shoal, (Middle Bay on the south shore of Long Island) completely un-navigable at low tide, only sailable for about 2 hrs on either side of high tide... so until someone has sailed them a while and bounced the board a few times in unexpected places, any help is a bonus...

One thing I'm looking for out of this setup is purposely testing areas near marshes to gain quickly the local experience to know just how close I can come to the edge while staying out of trouble... normal charts in this area are useless for this purpose, as they're drawn at MLLW, and these waters just show as intertidal marshes... sure, I could just wait until the board bounces, but I've already had 2 of those out in the middle of the "bay" at full high tide... did I mention there's an entire island right in the middle that's submerged under only 1' at high tide?

Even that aside, I believe the proper placement for the transducer on my boat to be forward of the keel ... I'll give it some time, but if no one can definitively supply some info, I may buy a unit to run a test to see how well/not it works in that area before installing, on the assumption that I can return it and retreat/regroup for a better plan if performance is lackluster... (as an aside, it may just work ok because although a core would impede things, I'm not looking for a fish-finder picture going down 100'... 10' is likely plenty for my purposes)...
 
Oct 10, 2009
982
Catalina 27 Lake Monroe
I have one mounted inside the hull in a blob of plumbers putty and it works fine. Hull is solid, hand laid fiberglass. It's a little difficult to run a wire forward of the keel; I just mounted mine in the cavernous space beneath the cockpit.

Also, what is the hull ID number on the transom? That will help to figure out the year of the boat.
 
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Aug 28, 2015
190
Oday 28 St Joseph, MI
An inside the hull transducer must be mounted perpendicular to the horizontal plane. If it's attached directly to the hull in the bow it will be at such an angle that your depth readings will show greater depth than is actually there. You'll be aground before you know you've run out of water. I would bite the bullet, pull the boat and put in a thruhull transducer. You can consider a forward looking unit but it's easier to use a chart and stay out of the shallows.
 
May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
Thanks Indysailor, that's EXACTLY the information I was hoping to find...

So the deck is cored, but the bottom is solid? All over?

Someone else in another thread pointed me to the decoder-ring on the HINs... she seems to be December '84 (despite using the format from before August '84)... so now the only question on the model is if the PO was right that it's a "25th anniversary edition"... I've always assumed it isn't, because it doesn't have the badge that says so... any other distinguishing features I should be aware of? (A friend at my club pointed out what he thought were the features on another O'23-25th, but I think I've convinced myself they aren't necessarily indicative, just standard for the era.

Wing- As for hull angle, there are both DIY techniques and special adapters available to angle the transducer "plumb" despite having a deadrise angle. Similarly, ALL transducers are going to have something of a cone both on the transmit and receive end, giving a little bit of room for error there. Read my previous post for why I'm sailing almost full time IN the shallows, can't stay out, and why standard charts are useless in this area. With the tracking functions on some of the GPS units, I can use this transducer to create my own depth charts.
 

Pat

.
Jun 7, 2004
1,250
Oday 272LE Ninnescah Yacht Club, Wichita, Ks.
I'm almost certain O'day did not do cored hulls.....decks yes, hulls solid fiberglass.....there may be exceptions....Rudy at D & R
Enterprises in Ma. should be be able to verify the hull construction. Pat
 
Oct 10, 2009
982
Catalina 27 Lake Monroe
Deck is balsa cored fiberglass. May be plywood core under the mast step, as some have reported in DIY repairs. Hull is solid fiberglass, may have a plywood cored sandwich in the transom to add strength for hanging the motor.

Shoot your transducer right through the hull. I just made a mound with the plumbers putty to get it level.

Not sure what special dohookies you might have had on the 25th anniversary edition, other than maybe a teak toerail. The interior on the 23-2 evolved over the years, mostly with the addition of something resembling a real locker opposite the head and a nicer sliding galley sink on the starboard side. I've seen a bridge deck mounted traveler on some, and they always appear to be newer than mine. Opening forward ports also.
 
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Jan 22, 2007
268
Oday 23 Cedar Creek Marina Bayville NJ
I set mine in fiberglass resin right in the center of the hull under the V-berth. Make sure you are forward of the entire keel. I also lightly glassed in a 3'4" piece of plywood over the top to protect it. Their is no wood core in the hull other then the transom as previously posted. Mine has been there for over twelve years and only fails in rough waves when the bow comes out of the water.
 
May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
Thanks Indysailor... I have the teak toerail, there's a hanging locker opposite the head, not sure what you mean by "resembling a real locker" ... I've got the sliding galley sink on starboard, but again not sure what you mean by the "nicer" one... I don't have a traveler at all, but I do have opening ports forward and the tinted window in the forward hatch.

Scott... great information... thanks... do you have any regrets from the placement?
 
Jan 22, 2007
268
Oday 23 Cedar Creek Marina Bayville NJ
No regrets I would put it there again. I don't remember the exact procedure but you can place a ziplock bag full of sand over the transducer to test the location prior to mounting it. If it is not a direct surface to surface meeting however I don't remember how to overcome that for the test. Mabe others will chime in on that. I just remember using the bag of sand.
 
May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
I've read elsewhere that ziplock's full of water work... sanding the surface smooth first improves... etc etc... plenty of generic mounting procedures available for reading for those who search...
 
Jan 22, 2007
268
Oday 23 Cedar Creek Marina Bayville NJ
I am sure those methods would work as well. When I did mine it just proved to test and be prudent before I went through all the work of mounting, wiring etc.
 
May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
Absolutely... I didn't mean I was going to install without testing... just meant that there are several methods out there for testing that are well described
 
Jun 2, 2004
1,923
Oday Day Sailer Wareham, MA
Not sure what special dohookies you might have had on the 25th anniversary edition, other than maybe a teak toerail. The interior on the 23-2 evolved over the years, mostly with the addition of something resembling a real locker opposite the head and a nicer sliding galley sink on the starboard side. I've seen a bridge deck mounted traveler on some, and they always appear to be newer than mine. Opening forward ports also.
I think the big "features of the "25th Anniv. edition" was a little plaque/label designating the boat as a "25th Anniversary Edition" and some boats that year were light grey instead of off-white. There could have been some special options as well?
Pretty sure that the teak toe rails were standard 1977-85 on the 23-2. The "Nice sliding galley" probably means the version (1981-85) that I would describe as a clone of the one from the Catalina 22, it had a sink and space for the stove, also had bins to hold silverware (well ,they make me think of the silverware holders in a cafeteria line?) This galley unit rested on the starboard quarterberth base (part of cushion removed to allow it to slide out from under cockpit, when no In use it could be slid back under the cockpit and the cushion put In place. Original setup was a pair of shelves that slid out above the quarterberths (stove on one side, sink on other). The bridgedeck traveler was apparently an option all years as were the opening ports forward (both could have been previous owner upgrades also). The "real locker" opposite the head, I've never seen that, ever 23 that I've seen had a pseudo "hanging locker" there.
 

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May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
Great info Sunbird... thanks...
My sink looks closer to the second pic, though not the same, though I haven't actually had it slid out all the way yet... but there ARE the cafeteria style bins for holding silverware (or cell phones)...
Someone else's 23 at the club has the 25th Anniv Badge... and that's exactly why I've assumed mine is not, I don't have a badge that says it is... and the badges that are where that's supposed to be don't exactly look new...
 
Oct 10, 2009
982
Catalina 27 Lake Monroe
My 23 is a 1980. The space across from the head is open, with a teak plywood bulkhead fore and aft that is maybe about a foot high at the bottom. So, it's a hanging locker that drains to the bilge, but there is a good amount of wasted space. The newer configuration tops it with a small shelf and a plywood front. It's a more finished look. I also have a molded toe rail rather than teak.
 
May 23, 2016
217
O'Day 1984 23 Island Park, NY
So interesting... we (meaning someone other than me) should compile a list of the year to year changes... My '84 has the small shelf on top of the hanging locker, but the plywood front only come a foot (or maybe a half) up off the floor... there's the molded toe-rail, but it's topped with teak... doesn't look like PO mod, but who knows...
 
Jun 2, 2004
1,923
Oday Day Sailer Wareham, MA
I looked again at my old Brochures (1978, 1979, 1980, 1981, 1982), every picture of the 23 shows the molded toe-rails topped with teak, although only the 1981 and 1982 brochure CLEARLY list that as standard. However, 1978 and 1979 do not mention it as an option either, so my gut feeling is still that it was standard 1977-85. It is possible that a previous owner removed the teak and plugged the screw holes (although, I admit it would be hard to blend in every little plugged hole!)
AND..... I just did a little research through my extensive collection of O'DAY 23 pictures. It appears that around 1981 the hanging locker was changed to include a teak plywood enclosure of sorts and the shelf was raised and enlarged. A few owners appear to have added a pair of doors to cover that opening as well (although one pic I have may show a factory door). I also found a couple of better pics of the "better" galley, including one owner-added custom version (with microwave!).
 

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Jun 2, 2004
1,923
Oday Day Sailer Wareham, MA
More pictures.
As far as a listing of when various changes occurred, well..... it seems that O'DAY liked to make changes periodically, often mid-year. So, it may be hard to pin down when things exactly changed. Even introduction or discontinuation of various models were often done mid-year, despite the sales Department indicating otherwise.
I always thought that the DS II stopped at he end of 1985 and the DS III started in 1986, well.. the DSII did stop in 1985, but not at the end of the model year, the DS III was actually phased in during the 1985 model year.
The 1977 O'DAY 22 had a change of deck design sometime during the 1977 Model year, with the addition of a molded gas tank locker and now standard, flush-fitting forward hatch. (Earlier 22s had a forward hatch that was originally optional, and used a separate molding for the part attached to the deck.)
 

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