Insurance Premiums

Jan 11, 2014
11,430
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
My premium with boat US jumped up 33% in one year. Never had a claim and I boat in California. I shopped around with several other companies but many won't insure you if you live aboard. I'm not a insurance expert but wouldn't a boat catastrophy such as sinking at the dock or burning down if it was unattended ?
The insurance risk to the boat is not the value of the boat. The risk is liability and in particular personal injury liability. Presumably if you live aboard you will have more people on board, more frequently. That increases the chance of someone getting hurt. Even a simple injury, say a broken leg by a guest could easily cost more in medical expenses, lost wages, etc than the insured value of the boat.
 
Jan 11, 2014
11,430
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
Besides BoatUS, how many of the other insurance companies include $800,000 coverage for cleaning up a diesel spill should your boat be involved in a wreck and/or sink? Probably none of them.
My BoatUS policy oil spill liability is almost $1 million. Cleaning up diesel and oil isn't cheap.

It doesn't take a sinking or wreck to cause an oil spill. Last year a fuel line on my boat failed and was siphoning fuel into the bilge. Fortunately the bilge pump failed and the 7 or 8 gallons of diesel stayed in the bilge. Had the bilge pump worked, it would have discharged the diesel overboard and I would have had a big mess to clean up!
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
6,748
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
Sorry for the tangent, but I can't resist. I don't mean to down-play the environmental issue, but the truth is, of all of the kinds of oil that one can spill into a waterway, diesel fuel is perhaps the most benign. This, from NOAA:
Diesel fuel is most often a light, refined petroleum product. Small diesel spills will usually evaporate and disperse naturally within a day or less. This is particularly true for typical spills from a fishing vessel (500-5,000 gallons), even in cold water. Thus, seldom is there any oil on the surface for responders to recover.
and this:

Diesel oil is readily and completely degraded by naturally occurring microbes, under time frames of one to two months.
read more here:
https://response.restoration.noaa.g...oil-spills/resources/small-diesel-spills.html

Add in maybe 4 quarts of lubricating oil, 1/2 quart ATF, a gallon or two of anti-freeze, and that'sif EVERYTHING leaks out - and we're still talking small potatoes.

So, the "bill" for cleaning up say, 15 to 30 gallons of diesel fuel from a sailboat wreck will likely be: zero. The fine may be non-zero, not sure if there necessarily is one, or how much it is.

If your sailboat sinks and folks start putting out oil booms and spraying dispersant on the water, they are over-reacting, and spending your money needlessly.
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
6,748
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
7 or 8 gallons of diesel stayed in the bilge. Had the bilge pump worked, it would have discharged the diesel overboard and I would have had a big mess to clean up!
NOAA calls 500 to 5,000 gallons a small oil spill. 7 or 8 gallons is nothing, will clean up by itself in a day or two.
 
Jan 11, 2014
11,430
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
NOAA calls 500 to 5,000 gallons a small oil spill. 7 or 8 gallons is nothing, will clean up by itself in a day or two.
You might want to tell that to the USCG. There was a boat in my marina leaking a very small amount of diesel, but enough to put a sheen on the water. The USCG came looking for the boat and the boat owner.

My dock neighbor is a retired Dept of Environmental Conservation officer. If he sees a sheen on the water, he's out looking for the leaking boat and will report it to the DEC.

At least in this part of the world, Lake Ontario, most marinas will not fuel your boat. They had the hose to you, so if you spill fuel it's on you, not them.
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
6,748
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
Yes, and I think they are over-reacting, and pursuing and prosecuting boaters in an unnecessarily harsh way, while when municipalities "accidentally" dump millions of gallons of sewage into the bay or river, everyone yawns.

Only a very few drops of fuel will create a big sheen. It is not an environmental problem, at all. By the way, I've read that a couple of drops of Dawn liquid will dissipate the sheen very quickly.

I don't spill; I never fill my tank all the way - I fill it "almost" full, but never up into the fill pipe or out the vent. I do this by calculating how much fuel I need and putting in that much. If I really need it full, I calculate, let it settle, check the gauge, add a half or full gallon, settle, check, repeat.

I check the bilge. I don't pump an oily bilge, I use oil absorbing cloths to clean it up.

But at the end of the day, boaters are not ruining the rivers and bays with fuel spills.
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
6,748
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
My dock neighbor is a retired Dept of Environmental Conservation officer. If he sees a sheen on the water, he's out looking for the leaking boat and will report it to the DEC.
Way to be a good neighbor! :) Does he pick up dog poo, too, and run DNA tests on it? :)
 

SG

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Feb 11, 2017
1,670
J/Boat J/160 Annapolis
The "Dawn" (or other dishwashing soap) is a no-no. It' drops the materials on the surface and sends them down into the water, toward the bottom. In the air, they dissipate better -- enen if it's unattractive and gets on waterlines, pilings, etc. If they sink, they're more harmful to the environment.
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
6,748
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
We're still talking about a nit here, an insignificant amount of a very light oil that dissipates naturally very quickly, and of which any amount that sinks is readily and completely degraded by naturally occurring microbes.

As I said, I think the enforcement of these regs against boaters is a huge waste of taxpayer's money, and unnecessarily harsh.

If recreational boaters were spilling bunker oil, that would be an entirely different story.
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
6,748
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
Back on the topic, our old policy had us covered for $939,800 for pollution; the new policy has no number. We have a question on that in to the agent. In the meantime, if, heaven forbid, something happened, we have an umbrella policy.
 
Jun 28, 2005
440
Hunter H33 2004 Mumford Cove,CT & Block Island
Can anyone join? I looked, and retired business officer dues are only $50.
Yes anyone can join but you have the wrong NBOA, the right one is the" National Boat Owners Association the nation's #1 Boating Association in the United States. Provides Boat and Yacht Insurance, boat financing, safety products, boat towing, and more."
 
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Jan 11, 2014
11,430
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
As I said, I think the enforcement of these regs against boaters is a huge waste of taxpayer's money, and unnecessarily harsh.
You might not think so if the oil was being spilled into your drinking water. Do use a favor, don't visit the Great Lakes.
 
Jun 28, 2005
440
Hunter H33 2004 Mumford Cove,CT & Block Island
Doesn't take long for a thread to be hijacked, question was on boat insurance, take environmental issues etc. to another thread/forum. It is rude to hijack, manners please. Pardon my hijack.
 
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jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
6,748
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
You might not think so if the oil was being spilled into your drinking water. Do use a favor, don't visit the Great Lakes.
Puh-lease, commercial ships routinely spill thousands of gallons of fuel oil and other petroleum products into the Great Lakes; it's a matter of degree. Yachtsmen spill what amounts to a gnat on the ass of a giant elephant. I'm not saying it's good, I'm saying the enforcement is out of proportion to the harm or risk.

Oh, news flash for ya - fish piss in those lakes. Just sayin'.