Leak source found in removable deck panel

[sailcapt340]

Today, on my 2000 Hunter 340, while I was finishing up routing my remote Mic Cable into my pedestal I found a source of a water leak into my aft stateroom headliner. I Didn’t even know I had a water leak in the headliner until I removed a small access panel to see if I could grab the Mic cable (that didn’t work). So were not talking about a lot of water coming in, right now.
But the leak is coming from one of the 2 screws that hold the removable deck access panel covering the steering linkage. They’re 2 inch long screws that I can see in the headliner access area. They hold in tight when screwed down, have some caulking around the hole, but one of them is leaking. I do put some flexible caulking on the threads of the screws when I put them back in, but I think the hole is widening.
So the question I have is…..has anyone else had this leak source? Is there some sort of silicone sleeve I can insert into the holes and then screw the screws into that to seal the holes up?
I have pictures that I hope get the point across.
Thank you for your help.

 

[dLj]

A couple things come to mind. First, if the hole is opening up, then putting in a sealant is only a temporary fix. Might be good enough though, you have to decide.

Fixing that can be less than straight forward - sometimes simple, but it's a boat, probably not....

You can put in larger diameter screws, but sometimes then there other complications like head too big, sticks up, that sort of thing. You can fill the hole with structural epoxy and then redrill for the size screw you have. Require oversizing the hole to be filled. Or you can change the fastening system. Go to thru bolts with a fender washer on the underside.

It depends upon the constraints which works better.

dj

 

[BigEasy]

Might be a good application for butyl tape. Wrap threads near top of bolt as well as underside of tapered head.

 

[sailcapt340]

dj,
I thought larger screws but, like you state, they would be proud of the floor and create a real concern on bare feet. Through bolts would mean reaching into a small access area every time I remove the panel to grease the steering ball joints. My hands show the results of reaching into the small area today, the shards of hard dripped fiberglass show no mercy.
I may have to go with your plan of filling with epoxy and re-drilling. Yet another “small” job. For what is right now a couple of paper towels worth of water but you know will grow into a flood.
Thank you for you incite.

 

[dLj]

dj,
I thought larger screws but, like you state, they would be proud of the floor and create a real concern on bare feet. Through bolts would mean reaching into a small access area every time I remove the panel to grease the steering ball joints. My hands show the results of reaching into the small area today, the shards of hard dripped fiberglass show no mercy.
I may have to go with your plan of filling with epoxy and re-drilling. Yet another “small” job. For what is right now a couple of paper towels worth of water but you know will grow into a flood.
Thank you for you incite.

If there is the space and desire on your side, I've found these "adhesive nuts" to be pretty cool.

McMaster-Carr

McMaster-Carr is the complete source for your plant with over 595,000 products. 98% of products ordered ship from stock and deliver same or next day.

www.mcmaster.com

It would take a lot of work on first installation, but if you want a really solid fix, it can be done this way, These nuts get adhered on the underside and then you use a bolt from the top side. It can take some research to find all the right bits and the initial work is non-trivial. But it makes a very nice long term solution. Then these are the fender washer also...

then on the top side, something like this might work.

McMaster-Carr

McMaster-Carr is the complete source for your plant with over 595,000 products. 98% of products ordered ship from stock and deliver same or next day.

www.mcmaster.com

dj

p.s. then as BigEasy says, seal the top with butyl

 

[jssailem]

the shards of hard dripped fiberglass show no mercy.

Your boat is not the only one that has inflicted pain on an unsuspecting owner. I have cut and sanded such offending protrusions, smoothing the surface to save my hands for better experiences.

I remember helping to fit some stanchions on a boat that tried to make mincemeat of my hand as I fitted the nut and then tried to tighten it.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

They’re 2 inch long screws that I can see in the headliner access area.

I'm afraid someone went overboard with the screws. Those screws on my deck access panel are closer to 1" flat head screws.

If it were my problem, I would remove the screws from all holes (I have four) and if you find any other potential leaks, clean them out with a drill bit and then fill with wetted fiberglass shorts to renew the base for the screws. Measure the depth of engagement for the screws and make sure you are not going to penetrate through to the underside again.

When you install the screws after a cleaning job under there, install the screws only finger tight at best to avoid stripping the holes again.

 

[sailcapt340]

dj, great idea, but I couldn’t get my hand in the access area far enough in to where the holes are now. I tried to get a picture of inside there but really, it‘s only as wide as the thickness of your hand.

I'm afraid someone went overboard with the screws. Those screws on my deck access panel are closer to 1" flat head screws.



Oh Boy are you right on that one!
We bought the boat new in January 2000 so I have to blame the guy at Hunter who had the screw gun in his hand that day. Mine are flat head as well and there are only 4 same as you. 2 on the deck and 2 on the step through edge ( they 2” long as well)

I think I’m going to have to fill the holes, drill and tap them for new screws.

 

[sailcapt340]

I managed to get a camera into the area and got a picture of the screws. Also the area they are hidden behind. What were they thinking! I always thought those 2 screws were solidly locked into a thick cross member, I guess not. So if you have leak you really can’t find in this aft stateroom, it’s worth a look.
I plan to fill the holes, drill and tap for new screws. And go with what Ralph has suggested, maybe 1” or 1 1/4” at best. That’s really all that is needed to hold the deck panel down solid.

 

[MFD]

My Hunter41DS is built the same, with the 2" screws.
As others have mentioned, a quick fix with butyl or something for now, but ultimately you will want to epoxy in some nuts underneath.
Another thing to consider when you fix this up is a thin 1/8" or similar EPDM rubber trim all along where the bottom edge of that plate compresses onto the fiberglass. On my boat there were some high pressure points that over the years actually caused some fracturing of the deck fiberglass underneath - the port/aft quarter had a hard point that was particularly bad.

It's really annoying that they cheaped-out so much on how this plate is attached. People are standing on it all the time underway, lots of walking traffic with or without armloads of groceries, etc.

EDIT: Also I have not dealt with fixing up the screws yet. It's on my calendar, regularly deferred - "crab step bolts". I finally got around to glueing in the rubber strip around it to stop it from causing more damage last spring after hearing the occasional weird squeaking/cracking sound getting more noticeable the last couple years.

 

[sailcapt340]

a quick fix with butyl or something for now

I did do a “quick fix” with some silicone I had handy, just to stop any rain water from entering right now. Not the most ideal of solutions but doable. I like your idea of the trim edging under the panel. I get a squeaking noise occasionally but no damage like you are describing.
I know this is a lot to ask, given these panels are long, wide, heavy and not to mention awkward to handle. Yet alone put them some place when they are lifted out. Mine is about 5’ x 1.5’, yours has to be much bigger. But could you show us a photo of what you use as a cushioning edge. No rush on this, I understand the work involved and appreciate it if possible. Thank you.
I am surprised you have 2 inch screws as well. Thought I was the only one.

 

[jssailem]

Back out the screws, Wrap with bed-it butyl tape. Screw it into place. Your project will be fixed until you get around to repairing it.

 

[MFD]

<SNIP>
Mine is about 5’ x 1.5’, yours has to be much bigger. But could you show us a photo of what you use as a cushioning edge. No rush on this, I understand the work involved and appreciate it if possible. Thank you.
I am surprised you have 2 inch screws as well. Thought I was the only one.

Mine is about the same size, haven't measured.
I am going to pull it up in a month or so for general inspection - I might even finally get around to replacing those screws with something better...
Anyway - I will take some pictures then.