What grade VHF Antenna Coaxial Cable was used in 2000 Hunter 340

[sailcapt340]

Finally going to replace and move my VHF Radio from the pedestal to the navigation station inside the boat and use a remote mic at the pedestal. I put this project off because I didn’t need to, but now my VHF is done (actually the cable to the mic is done). Haven’t chosen the new radio yet so my options are open.
Has hard as I tried this morning, I could not find any markings on the cable that I can see.
My plan is to ”T” or use a switch into the connection inside the boat at the base of the mast. Run a new cable to the navigation station and mount the radio there. And use a remote mic at the pedestal.
I want to keep the existing cable and power intact should I, or someone, choose to put the radio back in the pedestal.
So I am looking to identify the Coaxial Cable installed in 2000. Can I use a better rated cable today and not loose signal strength to older cable if I “T” into the line? Not sure I can fit a switch into the area at the base of the mast inside the boat above the dinette table.
My run to the navigation station from the base of the mast is about 18 feet, given the twists and turns needed.
Thank you for the help.

 

[dlochner]

First, you shouldn't T into the line because if there are 2 radios on the antenna, 2 VHFs or an AIS and VHF or FM when one broadcasts the full power of the broadcast will go directly to the other radio and fry it. Antenna inputs in the milliwatt range and a 25 watt signal will over whelm it. If you want to have more than one radio on the antenna you will need a suitable splitter.

Yes, you can use a low loss cable and attach it to the existing cable with a male cable connector. It will be better to replace the whole cable from antenna to the radio, however as long as the impedance matches it will work. I found replacing the mast cable with a better cable improved the VHF reception even though the in boat section was the original coax.

https://www.dxengineering.com/parts/dxe-536-4

Easy VHF Terminations - Marine How To

If You Don't Know How to Solder..... If you really don't know how to solder a VHF PL259 connector there are other options as you'll see below. This one is laughable, except that when this owner needed his VHF it was no joke or laughing matter that it failed to transmit. The previous owner or...

marinehowto.com

 

[sailcapt340]

If I have this right, the Remote Mic would be considered as a second radio. Thus causing the issue you describe.
I was thinking I would only have one radio inside the cabin and just leave the wiring at the pedestal. But if the Remote Mic is a second radio, I see the problem.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

If I have this right, the Remote Mic would be considered as a second radio. Thus causing the issue you describe.
I was thinking I would only have one radio inside the cabin and just leave the wiring at the pedestal. But if the Remote Mic is a second radio, I see the problem.

Don’t confuse power through the transmission line coax with a remote mic connection.

 

[dlochner]

If I have this right, the Remote Mic would be considered as a second radio. Thus causing the issue you describe.
I was thinking I would only have one radio inside the cabin and just leave the wiring at the pedestal. But if the Remote Mic is a second radio, I see the problem.

Remote mics are either hardwired, or use Blue Tooth or Wifi. They are in a sense separate radios, but they are not separate VHFs.

 

[sailcapt340]

I understand, still need a new VHF, just revamp my plan and lessen my work.
Fortunately, there are removable Mic‘s , in new radios. That would eliminate the UV degradation on the cord.

 

[dlochner]

I understand, still need a new VHF, just revamp my plan and lessen my work.
Fortunately, there are removable Mic‘s , in new radios. That would eliminate the UV degradation on the cord.

Correct, unless you have a pedestal cover that you always use. Then you could leave it attached.

 

[sailcapt340]

Thank you all for the guidance. Greatly appreciated.

 

[jssailem]

I try to sail using the concept.
Keep It Simple Sailor.

• Radio - with a mic at radio
• Remote mic for the cockpit with attached wire. Provided by Radio manufacture
• Antenna wire. LMR400. purchased from a Ham Radio Store due to the lowest signal loss and the best pricing (Ham Radio Outlet shows it online at $1.64/ft). I ran the wire from the radio to the mast antenna. Self-installed the DIY terminations. You can get wires with preinstalled terminations, but fishing the wire through the mast is more difficult.
• VHF Antena

The Antenna wire runs from the radio to the top of the mast. The Remote Mic uses its own wire and runs from the cockpit to the radio. This is not an antenna wire. The remote mic has all the functions of the radio in your hand. Your radio of choice has a mic at the radio. This helps when there is a storm raging over the cockpit, and you need to be able to be heard and hear what is being said.

 

[LloydB]

Just curious has your VHF radio at the NAV station stopped working? Or has your remote cockpit microphone quit working and what range of radio transmissions do you plan on normally using.

 

[sailcapt340]

My radio is a Raymarine Ray52. Long been discontinued. The mic cable has just dry rotted, cracked and exposed the internal wires. If you touch the cable your fingers turns black. But it all still works, just anything that comes in contact with the mic cable turns black. Its toast.
It’s not a remote mic, it’s the whole radio and mic in the pedestal.
A remote mic is my choice to go to, with the radio itself in the cabin.
I could just disconnect the antenna wire in the base of the mast leading to the pedestal now and leave it in place, along with the power cord as well. Connect a new cable to the connection at the base of the mast and reroute it to the navigation station inside the boat. Run a new power supply wire from breaker. Giving me a radio in the boat.
A remote mic at the pedestal would be a real challenge, but doable.
I’ve been in that wiring harness for a GPS antenna and throttle cables before and it’s not easy. Adding more wire to it, getting out of it and routing wire through the aft cabin wall, head and closet finally ending up at the navigation station is no small job.

 

[dlochner]

A remote mic at the pedestal would be a real challenge, but doable.
I’ve been in that wiring harness for a GPS antenna and throttle cables before and it’s not easy. Adding more wire to it, getting out of it and routing wire through the aft cabin wall, head and closet finally ending up at the navigation station is no small job.

Get a VHF with a wireless remote. Use the existing power wire for the radio for the wireless remote charger.

 

[jssailem]

Thoughts about how to approach this challenge.

The mic cable has just dry rotted, cracked and exposed the internal wires. If you touch the cable your fingers turns black.​

I know this experience. All of my Raymarine cables have the same "feature". Raymarine cheaps out on their rubber products.

A remote mic is my choice to go to, with the radio itself in the cabin.​

Yes, this is the path I took and find very functional. I am using Standard Horizon Radio and a remote mic at my boat helm.

I could just disconnect the antenna wire in the base of the mast leading to the pedestal now.​

Yes. This leaves a 'mast to antenna' wire which can be used for your new radio.

Connect a new cable to the connection at the base of the mast and reroute it to the navigation station inside the boat Run a new power supply wire from breaker. Giving me a radio in the boat.. YES YES YES.​

leave wires in place, along with the power cord as well to the pedestal.​

Kind of but not really. You want to route the Remote Mic wire to the pedestal. Check the radio provider you plan to use. The Standard Horizon Remote Mic came with wire and fixtures (a plug in connection). You use the old antenna and or power cord WIRE to pull the new Mic wire through to the pedestal. My Mic wire was smaller than the typical antenna wire. Attach the ends together and use the old antenna wire as the messenger wire to pull the new Mic wire to the pedestal. At the pedetal you install the plug fitting for the Remote Mic. At the radio end you attach the wire to the radio. As I recall the Mic wire has one end bare (to be attached to the pedestal plug fixture) and the other had a plug for the radio.

A remote mic at the pedestal would be a real challenge,​

Not at all. The remote mic (once installed) can be removed from the pedestal by unplugging it. You can store the mic in the cabin and only expose it to the elements when you need a Mic at the Helm.

​

I’ve been in that wiring harness for a GPS antenna and throttle cables before and it’s not easy. Adding more wire to it, getting out of it and routing wire through the aft cabin wall, head and closet finally ending up at the navigation station is no small job.​

This last bit gave me a smile. The frustration you share is why technicians want to get paid the big bucks.

Select a radio then examine the remote system. I like Icom and Standard Horizon for their common designed radios. Garmin purchased the Cortex system and now sells it under the Garmin brand (at a premium). That is a novel new RADIO concept.

 

[Davidasailor26]

Get a VHF with a wireless remote. Use the existing power wire for the radio for the wireless remote charger.

We have a Simrad VHF at the nav station with a wireless remote. The remote does everything the radio can. I’ve had to replace its battery a couple times in 10 years, but with the most recent one we can go for a full day sail and still have over 50% battery left after 9 hours.

 

[Tally Ho]

I have the B&G V50 radio set with the H50 remote. I installed the charging cradle in the cockpit, where I use the radio when sailing. This keeps the battery charged while in use. When I dock the boat, I put the handheld down below. It can also be charged from a usb cable if necessary.

I haven’t needed to replace my battery yet, somewhere around 7 years old.

Greg

 

[sailcapt340]

Great advice and direction from all. Thank you.
While we have such warm and mild weather here in RI, I plan to start opening up the wire harness in the hardest to access areas (3 last count) and get a messenger wire in there.
Before I freeze my fingers off trying to do it later. Then at least I’ll have it ready.
If I get a WIFI model the wires can stay there for any other “great” ideas I come up with.
Thank you all again, I’m glad I could put a smile (John) on some faces as well.

 

[LloydB]

Seeing how electronics has become sophisticated enough to answer a doorbell camera with your cell phone probably would be better to decide what radio you're going to buy and use before you try to figure out which wires to hook up to it. For example if your remote mic can be charged with a wireless charger you would never be required to expose the electronics in it to saltwater even if you kept it at the helm.( since you already have power near the helm anyway)

 

[marcham]

The transmission line is most likely RG8X. As mentioned above, a "switch" is a very bad option in this case, as it could lead to destroying a radio in the future. Couplers and antenna switches inject losses. At VHF frequencies, this is a big deal. Best to have a signal continuous run from the antenna to the radio.

1) Is the existing coax in good condition? The boat is 25 years old. If any water got into the connector at the antenna, it might need replacing.

2) To minimize re-wiring, i'd suggest putting the new radio at the helm and the remote mic at the nav station.

3) Option B would be pulling a new coax from the mast head to the nav station, and leaving the existing coax in place for future use (tape and mark both ends).

4) What are you AIS plans? separate antenna or one with a duplexer? Where would it be installed? If you use a duplexer, the AIS would have to be very close to the VHF.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

. Couplers and antenna switches inject losses. At VHF frequencies, this is a big deal.

For clarity,
1. the term “coupler” is a misnomer. If you are referring to a splitter, it can have a small, usually insignificant insertion loss but the far greater problem with splitters is their propensity for failure. Not a good thing when you really need a radio to work, and

2. Switches have almost no insertion loss if of decent quality using decent quality, properly soldered coax connectors. Numerous tests have borne this out. And any good quality switch provides sufficient isolation to protect the stand-by radio.

 

[marcham]

For clarity,
1. the term “coupler” is a misnomer. If you are referring to a splitter, it can have a small, usually insignificant insertion loss but the far greater problem with splitters is their propensity for failure. Not a good thing when you really need a radio to work, and

2. Switches have almost no insertion loss if of decent quality using decent quality, properly soldered coax connectors. Numerous tests have borne this out. And any good quality switch provides sufficient isolation to protect the stand-by radio.

Agreed in principle, but in practice the losses add up. Having a switch or coupler (coaxial connector) below the mast should only introduce 0.2 db (plus the 2 extra PL-259). However in practice, on a boat, most connectors are compression fit and not soldered like a PL259 would be in a ham shack. These can lead to water ingress (at the antenna) or poor connections (at the mast). Thus more connectors likely increase the chances of transmission line problems over time. Given the choice, I'd take a single coax from the top of the mast to the radio, with a small loop below the mast. If one day the mast needs to be taken down, then a splice connector could be added.