Getting on the track - questions about my tracks and jib cars

[zinahewitt]

Hi All,
I have a Dufour 34 1975.
I had a few questions if you have time.
I have attached a photo.

There is one track which I use to adjust the jib sheet car to change the sail shape.
What would you use the "second" track for ?
The sailboat came with the Jib Sheet Lead Block but there is also a slider car like the one in the picture.
What do you use the slider car for ? do you just attach a block to it and use it like the the Jib Sheet lead block ?

Different topic
The Dufour doesn't have a mid ship cleat.
I was thinking of using a Mid Rail Cleat like the one in the picture.
The main reason is to do a stern spring line turn when backing out of my slip
as my slip is not the best for a left handed prop.
Also for the stern bridle docking.
I am afraid though the side force might damage the track.
Anyone use those ?


Thanks

 

[dlochner]

The inboard track will allow for closer sheeting angles, which allow the boat to point higher. The outboard tracks are better for off the wind sailing as it allows for a wider sheeting angle. I have both inboard and outboard tracks and rarely use the outboard tracks. When I do use them I plan on sailing off the wind for hours.

I have the Schaefer track cleats on the out board tracks. Never have had an issue with them.

 

[jssailem]

What would you use the "second" track for ?
The sailboat came with the Jib Sheet Lead Block but there is also a slider car like the one in the picture.
What do you use the slider car for ? do you just attach a block to it and use it like the the Jib Sheet lead block ?

2 Tracks. WHY?
The boat was built and designed in 1975.

Of the boat shows a sail plan different sails over the foredeck. In that time frame, such sails were typically hank on sails. To trim a small sail you need to run the sheets to blocks at different locations along the rail. Having multiple tracks were a normal rig set up. It would appear that the previous owners of your boat wanted to have enough track to accomplish this. Note when you have a lead that runs to a block that may be at or before the mast, you still need to have a way to maintain a fair lead to the winches most often located in the cockpit. A second block positioned further back along the rail which improves the lead to the cockpit was a natural selection.

The slide car you identify is of the design to allow quick application of a snatch block. Positioning the snatch block would be determined based on the angle needed to optimize the use of the sheet on winch for trimming the sails.

The application of furlers has altered the presumed need to have a locker of different hank on sails. While this may be true, the need to have control lines run to properly trim the sail still remains.

There is often a desire use zero friction rings and tweekers to optimize the sail trim. Your 2 tracks can provide a way to attach these devices to the boat.

 

[Joe]

Well, I'm unsure why JS seems to emphasize the "hank on" sails for race boats in the 80's. That 's not the reason for two tracks, twin forestays maybe by certainly not double tracks. If you check out sail boat racing from that era you'll see they used double grooved foils just like today... The track question, however, basically two functions. The first is to determine the optimal tack angle for the particular sail and conditions in which it's being used. If you draw a straight line from the bow stem back to the jib car, and then compare that line to the centerline of the boat, the angle where the lines intersect at the bow is called the tack angle. For the smaller upwind sails, 'working jibs, sometimes called blades which are 90-120%... you'll see tack angles of 7 to 9 %. The inside track will most often be angularly placed on the deck to maintain this optimal angle even as the lead block is moved fore and aft for trim purposes. I have seen race boats with 3 or 4 pairs of tracks on the foredeck... covering everthing it seems. The boat designer has a lot to do with this tack angle... and sailmakers will consider it when building a new sail for a particular boat. The outside track is more often used for the larger upwind sails, 125+ even up to 180%,,, this "genoa track" not only opens the tack angle to say 11-16 deg more conducive to reaching, but it allows the crew to trim the sail hard with less interference from the spreaders and other rigging. The big sail needs a full crew to handle it, sometime needing a little help to get it across, but the same sheets used for the different sails, unless there's an special reason.

Geez... got me going on that one. I love to watch the OLD AC races... all the sail changes... real teamwork. Today.... I love the tech... but it just doesn't have the excitement... 10-15 crew ... Skippers driving, tacticians looking through their hand held compasses, grinders grinding, trimmers trimming, bowmen climbing like monkeys, rail meat...... it was so cool to watch and try to understand. Oh well.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

The photo and illustrations that you show appear to show 2 tracks and both are shown on the outer rail, so that doesn't really point to an inner track and an outer track arrangement. It appears to me that the forward tracks on both sides would be used with a small storm jib where the leads would need to be much closer to the bow.

My boat has tracks for a storm jib, but the tracks have never been used. It's funny, my Starwind had the tracks on the outer rail and I wished I had inner tracks. My Catalina 320 has inner tracks and I wish I also had tracks on the rail (as Catalina 34 does have). I use the midship cleats on my tracks. You will be happy to make this addition and I think it is very unlikely that a side force would cause any damage. I would rather have those cleats on an outer rail. Just about everybody mounts those cleats on a track, just as they are designed! You can use the slider cars for snatch blocks as John says. There are probably other uses as well.

 

[Joe]

I have a short inside track that the prev owner installed. I have found rigging a barber hauler is a wonderful way to manage the tack angle, as opposed to re routing or changing sheets. I use the inside track's sliding car and block to route the barber hauler line back to a halyard winch or cleat. A regular block on the end of the line can be used to attach to the sheet, a better option if you have the money, is a snatch block. Otherwise, you can leave the barber hauler line attached to the sheet and sail as usual since it will slide through the block easily. Some guys are using the low friction rings...but I prefer a block.

I experimented with different set ups over the years so there's really no exactly correct way to set it up. The purpose drives the set up. All you're trying to do is bring in the clew of the sail....or out... On my Nacra beach cat, the barber hauler is and OUT haul, whereas on the Cat 27 it's ;an IN haul.
The beach cat almost always sails with it's apparent wind forward of 90deg, so the permanently fixed leads are inboard. When you have the need to open the slot for down wind sailing, the barber hauler pulls the clew or the small headsail out to the end of the cross beam.

 

[zinahewitt]

The photo and illustrations that you show appear to show 2 tracks and both are shown on the outer rail, so that doesn't really point to an inner track and an outer track arrangement. It appears to me that the forward tracks on both sides would be used with a small storm jib where the leads would need to be much closer to the bow.

My boat has tracks for a storm jib, but the tracks have never been used. It's funny, my Starwind had the tracks on the outer rail and I wished I had inner tracks. My Catalina 320 has inner tracks and I wish I also had tracks on the rail (as Catalina 34 does have). I use the midship cleats on my tracks. You will be happy to make this addition and I think it is very unlikely that a side force would cause any damage. I would rather have those cleats on an outer rail. Just about everybody mounts those cleats on a track, just as they are designed! You can use the slider cars for snatch blocks as John says. There are probably other uses as well. View attachment 217967

Thanks,
I see you have a track cheek block?? that you use to move your jib block without needing to tack ??
Does that work well ?

 

[zinahewitt]

I have a short inside track that the prev owner installed. I have found rigging a barber hauler is a wonderful way to manage the tack angle, as opposed to re routing or changing sheets. I use the inside track's sliding car and block to route the barber hauler line back to a halyard winch or cleat. A regular block on the end of the line can be used to attach to the sheet, a better option if you have the money, is a snatch block. Otherwise, you can leave the barber hauler line attached to the sheet and sail as usual since it will slide through the block easily. Some guys are using the low friction rings...but I prefer a block.

I experimented with different set ups over the years so there's really no exactly correct way to set it up. The purpose drives the set up. All you're trying to do is bring in the clew of the sail....or out... On my Nacra beach cat, the barber hauler is and OUT haul, whereas on the Cat 27 it's ;an IN haul.
The beach cat almost always sails with it's apparent wind forward of 90deg, so the permanently fixed leads are inboard. When you have the need to open the slot for down wind sailing, the barber hauler pulls the clew or the small headsail out to the end of the cross beam.

This is above my pay grade at this stage of my life .

 

[Ward H]

Thanks,
I see you have a track cheek block?? that you use to move your jib block without needing to tack ??
Does that work well ?

When @Scott T-Bird sees this I’m sure he’ll say yes. I saw it in action when I crewed with him.

I installed the same setup on my C30 after reading @Joe S comments about using it on his boat and recommending it.
Its availability from Garhauer. “EZ Glide Block System” if I recall correctly.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Thanks,
I see you have a track cheek block?? that you use to move your jib block without needing to tack ??
Does that work well ?

I was happy to see it installed when I purchased the boat. This Garhauer kit allows you to adjust the lead position to adjust twist in the genoa while the sheet is under load. If you are racing your boat, it would be considered indispensable. If you are not racing, it's not necessary, but you'll still be very happy to have that sail control. It is far better than pin-stop controls for sure. It is similar to line controls for your traveller versus pin-stop controls.