Rope Clutch or Spinlock PXR?

[LakeShark]

So I am contemplating adding a cleat / clutch to the cabin top on my Catalina 22 to free up the halyard winches for either a spinnaker, banjo sheeting, or whatever. Being that this is a small boat I am interested in hearing ideas on what is better. A cleat like the PXR is smaller which is nice however a traditional Rope clutch is normally what is used for the job. I use the boat for cruising and racing so I don’t want to shorten the handrails etc. I know there will be compromise but I’m trying to find the best balance in technology that will free up the winch while also allowing for the needed adjustments and things. Your thoughts or additional ideas?

 

[cb32863]

I wouldn't use a PXR for this. On cabin top or not, they always seem to be popped open at the most inopportune time. For halyard, I would go for a clutch.

 

[jssailem]

I like the spinlock cleats for your size boat.. Be sure that your lines will fit the cleats. The line on the winch looks of a size that would be easy to hold in your hand, but may be larger than is needed in the cleat or on the winch.

I saw @Hayden Watson using the spinlock cleat on his Catalina 30. They worked as advertised for his halyards.

You could position the spinlock cleats ahead of the winch then use the winch for all of your winching needs. You would do the same for the clutches.

 

[Hayden Watson]

I like the spinlock cleats for your size boat.. Be sure that your lines will fit the cleats. The line on the winch looks of a size that would be easy to hold in your hand, but may be larger than is needed in the cleat or on the winch.

I saw @Hayden Watson using the spinlock cleat on his Catalina 30. They worked as advertised for his halyards.

You could position the spinlock cleats ahead of the winch then use the winch for all of your winching needs. You would do the same for the clutches.

I need to make a bit of a correction to John's memory of race we did about 1½ years ago. I do have three PXR's on my C30 and absolutely love them BUT they are not on any halyard. I think that would be too great of a load for them. I used them for my whisker/spin pole mast mounted car control lines (up and down) and for my main sheet which is in a 4:1 arrangement. I also plan to get a couple of them to replace the cam cleats for my 4:1 traveler control line. They are fantastic for running lines that need to be adjusted often with a pull and forget simplicity. The release with a flick of the wrist and with much less force required than the cam cleat but do not have the tendency to not lock in which I have had with cams. I think they are a far superior cleat to a cam cleat and can be used any place a cam is used. I do not think that they are the best choice for a highly loaded static line like a halyard.
For a C22 like that of LakeShark is asking about, the large PXR would more than likely have plenty of strength. I still would probably not use one for the halyards though. the halyard is a "set it and forget it" type of line. Once it is set, you do not need to mess with it until ready to drop the sail. The PXR is too easy to release and you want the halyards to be secure. For a C22 I would suggest the Spinlock mini jammer which are about the same cost and stronger and more secure than the PXR

 

[Jacomo Sailor]

I used the PXR on mine when I did my lines aft project. I have two on each side just ahead of a winch. I was able to keep the teak handrails but did have to remove one loop (haven't missed it). I've had them installed for two seasons now and couldn't be happier. I have not had a single issue with them popping open unexpectedly, jamming or failing to release under load as a few people told me would happen. Never had any slippage either. A clutch may have superior holding power, but the smaller footprint and dramatic price difference were bigger factors in my decision. After two seasons of use and for the type of sailing I do, I honestly can't see where a clutch would have offered me any advantage over the PXR. Just my $.02 based on my experience, your mileage may vary.

 

[LakeShark]

@Jacomo Sailor that's great information. One thing I have been pondering though is do you have trouble with line overwraps on the winch or releasing the line to lower the sail just a bit for adjustments? I want to be able to lower an inch or so as I trim sails for a race if needed without cutting the whole thing loose if you know what I mean.

 

[Hayden Watson]

Here is a clutch for 1/4" through 7/16" that will open under load for under $70. As far as feeding the line through them, if you use the max sige it will take it can be a bit difficult. If your line is less than the max it is not a problem.

 

[TimFromLI]

I just bought 2 spinlock swivel PXRs to replace the Harken cam cleats on my traveler. I think the PXR s are best for lines that need to be adjusted often. For a halyard I'd go with a clutch.

 

[Joe]

My 2 cents... a clutch for the winched halyard. PXR for control lines such as vang and downhaul where winches are not regularly used. Except for the clutch, you can stagger the other type cleats when placing them side by side to save a little room.

 

[Apex]

for trailer sailing, and often having to re-thread, a clutch may not be ideal. An alternative is to have a mousing line attached to the end of the halyard, and push that through. Maybe a loop whipped on the end so a tool can be used to quickly pull it through??? My experience in pushing line through the clutch is not efficient

 

[LakeShark]

Thanks for all the input. I had also asked this on the racing forum but the post and all replies seem to be gone this morning. one recommendation beyond a clutch is a Jammer cleat linked below. It has me thinking as it may be easier to thread during setup and fit my needs a bit better on a small boat than a clutch. Has anyone tried this type of cleat or have any input? They seem to be better in price and while they cant be released underload its not really an issue on halyards as I can just take up the slack on the winch or pull (its not that big of a boat). Thoughts?

https://www.fisheriessupply.com/spinlock-mini-jammer-sua

Edit: just noticed that the replies have all been moved to this thread. Thanks to the moderators.

 

[Brian D]

I removed you duplicate post and moved all the replies to this thread. So you lost one posting but retained all threads (except duplicates). We at SBO frown upon multiple threads of the same subject in different forums. I figured you would get more replies from the C22 guys than the racing guys.

 

[Jacomo Sailor]

@Jacomo Sailor that's great information. One thing I have been pondering though is do you have trouble with line overwraps on the winch or releasing the line to lower the sail just a bit for adjustments? I want to be able to lower an inch or so as I trim sails for a race if needed without cutting the whole thing loose if you know what I mean.

No, I have not had any issue. The way mine is set up, I can either take the line off the winch and pull upward to unlock the spinlock (handy if I'm back at the tiller as you can snap the line up sharply from a few feet away), or I can keep the line on the winch, open the spinklock by pressing on it and then let the line slip on the winch as needed.

Here's a pic of my set up during installation.

 

[LakeShark]

@Jacomo Sailor that looks great and the picture is just what I needed. I had not thought about being able to snap it up from the tiller. That might be really handy for lowering the genoa when I’m single handed. Not yet sure what I’ll do but I do have the winter yet to consider it.

 

[Hayden Watson]

It is also very handy to have a down-haul for your genoa when single-handed with hanked on sails. I ran a 1/4" line from the cockpit through a block at the stem fitting and attached it to the head of the sail. I would hook the line into every 3-4 hank. Any more creates too much friction. If you need to drop in a hurry, pop the halyard and pull the sail head down to the deck. Then take up the slack on the sheet and the sail will stay flat along the side deck through a blow without getting into trouble.