Keel Retention 322

Jul 15, 2014
73
Oday 322 Freeport, Bahamas
Tanq,

I admire your enthusiasm but I don't see the leap of logic you attempt here.

The underbuilt sump areas in some but not all of these boats would amount to a few bucks of resin, cloth, and time. Beyond the money guys, designers, managers, builders, and QA people would have to be complicit in weakening the single most important part of the entire hull of SOME of the boats. If someone would have died of a result it would be manslaughter. Is that really what you are saying?

I think Hanlon's razor fits better here.
Jackdaw,
I agree that Hanlon's Razor may be the answer especially if you had production staff changes.

Hanlon's Razor "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity" or Occam's Razor "among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected" certainly suit most situations.
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Jackdaw,
I agree that Hanlon's Razor may be the answer especially if you had production staff changes.

Hanlon's Razor "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity" or Occam's Razor "among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected" certainly suit most situations.
I think so.

But I also am pretty sure the Money Guys didn't kill O'day.

Like many of the builders that got big due to the sailing boom of the 60s and 70s, O'day had a fairly loose (by today's standards) engineering and QA oversight process. That was somewhat OK, because the men and woman that built the boats had been there from the start. Things could be a little bit 'loose' because the market was booming. People learned, did there jobs, got paid. Because new orders came in. Then it stopped.

Why? Not because of leveraged buyouts. Because the big year over year growth in sailing JUST STOPPED.

Look at this slide from my buddy Nick Hayes, who wrote Saving Sailing. Look at the Blue line, the number of sailors in the USA. As that number grows, people have to by new boats. It's the only way to get one. Once it flattens (or drops), it's now cheaper to buy a used boat unless there is good reason not to.



Things got tight, and crazy. People left. People got let go. New people came in. Things that were done from memory now didn't happen as well. Mistakes made.

No, corporate raiders did not kill O'day. O'day died (just like C&C and Cal and Islander, and S2 and ...) because they did not see or could not adjust to the huge change in the market caused by changes in American recreational interest.
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,709
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
No, corporate raiders did not kill O'day. O'day died (just like C&C and Cal and Islander, and S2 and ...) because they did not see or could not adjust to the huge change in the market caused by changes in American recreational interest.
Actually S2 is alive and well thanks to the power boat market. They simply could not survive on sailboats alone.. They now build Tiara & Pursuit power boats. I was just on the phone with their engineering department a few weeks ago for a proprietary sensor issue on a pretty new Tiara. Still good folks who build some of the better power boats out there..
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Actually S2 is alive and well thanks to the power boat market. They simply could not survive on sailboats alone.. They now build Tiara & Pursuit power boats. I was just on the phone with their engineering department a few weeks ago for a proprietary sensor issue on a pretty new Tiara. Still good folks who build some of the better power boats out there..
Yea I should have put Ranger or someone like that there and not S2. Leon never liked sailboats as much as he did powerboats, and as soon as his non-compete ended, he jumped back to power. Looks like a genius move now.
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,709
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Yea I should have put Ranger or someone like that there and not S2. Leon never liked sailboats as much as he did powerboats, and as soon as his non-compete ended, he jumped back to power. Looks like a genius move now.
It helps when you produce a quality product amidst a sea of garbage like Larson, Sea Ray, Trophy, Mako etc......;)
 
Jul 15, 2014
73
Oday 322 Freeport, Bahamas
It helps when you produce a quality product amidst a sea of garbage like Larson, Sea Ray, Trophy, Mako etc......;)
As JackDaw noted, it was a time of great change in the sailboat market and O'Day wasn't the only company to fail. Also remember the stock market crash of 1987.
It looks like O'Day had $1,400,000.- of capital the day before it was sold in a LBO (leveraged buyout) and $1,343.- cash the day after. The company was loaded up with debt. I looks like funds that came in from the sale of other O'Day assets went to the LBO instead of the O'Day bank account.

Here is the Bankruptcy proceeding. It's a long but fascinating read. You'll note references to quality variations and high labor turnover.

http://www.leagle.com/decision/1991496126BR370_1415.xml/IN RE O'DAY CORP.

Here is a study on the use of LBO (leveraged buyouts) as Constructive Frauds. The O'Day LBO is cited as an example - scroll down 21-pages.

While several other boat companies came to a natural end, it sure looks like O'Day was pushed off the cliff.
http://repository.jmls.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1206&context=lawreview
 
Last edited: