Making it simple

rs8684 · Jun 4, 2013

I only detach the forestay when trailering. Everything else stays attached, and I use bungees to secure all the wires that can be so cumbersome in the cockpit. I would check your stays every spring - just this year, I had to re-attach wire to secure the stays to the spreaders. I also use a small hammer and a block of wood to remove the pins that secure the mast to the tabernacle, sometimes they just need a little extra force to come out. BE CAREFUL when raising the mast - watch the spreaders. I tape my turnbuckles together loosely so that they won't spread apart while raising the mast. They can get hooked on something, or they can get bent by raising them when they are on the outside of the chainplates!

JoyRide28 · Jun 4, 2013

Yes I only disconnect the forestay as well, although I use black electrical tape to secure the rest of the rigging. I will not allow bungees on or near my vessel. Too many eyes lost...

caguy · Jun 4, 2013

anchorclanker said:
I was curious to know of other setups and procedures to simplify launching and retrieval. Currently, the stays on my 222 are held by clevis pins secured with cotter pins and key rings. I assume pull pins aren't a great idea, but is there a simpler way to attach this stuff? I found a brand new over centering release in the boat that was never installed, but the head-stay is too long. Without making up a new stay, it cannot be used.

I guess everyone leaves all the stays attached to the mast while its down and just loosely secures everything?? Just release the head-stay and drop it all on deck and hit the road?

Is there any visual inspection of the stays that ensures their continued performance, or are they simply replaced at a certain point as a matter of principle?

Also, I had a very difficult time pulling the mast step pins. I had to drive the front one out, it seemed no matter how hard I pulled the mast fore or aft it would not slide freely. The rear one was almost as bad. Obviously this hasnt been apart in a LONG time, but it seems like it should have come apart much easier. Any tricks anyone can pass along would be greatly appreciated.

Are you sure that the head stay is too long for, what I assume you are talking about, the Johnson lever? The Johnson lever is made to replace your turn buckel. It should have some adjustments with I believe 3 holes to which you can attach.

Another controversial time saver is the push pin. My Johnson lever came with one attached.

caguy · Jun 4, 2013

JoyRide28 said:
Yes I only disconnect the forestay as well, although I use black electrical tape to secure the rest of the rigging. I will not allow bungees on or near my vessel. Too many eyes lost...

No bungies??? Your mother ever buy you a Bee Bee gun for xmas?
The only eye I've ever heard being lost on a ship belonged to a Pirate.
A man encounters a pirate in a bar. They strike up a conversation, and the man asks the pirate how he suffered his various injuries. "Arrgh, I lost me leg fighting over buried treasure in the tropics. I lost me ear in a barroom fight with another pirate -- he bit me ear right off." The other man points to the pirate's arm and asks, "How'd you get the hook for an arm?" The pirate replies, "Arrgh, I lost me arm when a winch tore it off in a terrible storm at sea." "And how did you lose your eye?" The pirate says, "Arrgh, I had a terrible itch in me eye." "You lost your sight because of an itch?" The pirate explains: "Aye, it was me first day with the hook."
I know its old, but I still love that joke.

watercolors II · Jun 4, 2013

Secure lines before dropping.

You only need one pin in the maststep to act as a hinge and stabilize the mast at the cabintop, that one pin is maybe as strong as the screws that hold the maststep base to the cabintop, if any part of the rigging fails that extra pin is not going to keep the mast up.

Before you drop the mast make sure all your halyards and lines up and down the mast are tighten and tied to the bottom of the mast, that way no part of the standing rigging can become entangled with these control lines during dropping, towing or raising the mast. Do not attach any lines to the backstay or forestay, they definitely will become entangled with something upon raising the mast. Also, do not let any lines running through blocks, deck organizers or cleats on the deck, such as topping lifts or furler lines, remove all and secure to bottom of mast before lowering the mast.

Only the standing rigging should be laying on the deck before lifting, anything else will become part of something else when you lift and that is not a good time to have problems.

caguy · Jun 4, 2013

anchorclanker said:
No way it could work at the head. The cable end to the turnbuckle is too close to the deck. I just took it out to look at it again. I will have to measure but its possible it could work at the aft stay if its fully shortened and I thread the turnbuckle down further. My lever also has a push pin. Controversial because it could come out, I imagine?

How long is your turnbuckle? It should be about the same length as the Johnson lever retracted.

centerline · Jun 4, 2013

anchorclanker said:
No way it could work at the head. The cable end to the turnbuckle is too close to the deck. I just took it out to look at it again. I will have to measure but its possible it could work at the aft stay if its fully shortened and I thread the turnbuckle down further. My lever also has a push pin. Controversial because it could come out, I imagine?

the push pin is normal on the johnson levers. it is not under load and is only used as a safety to insure the cam lever stays down and closed if the sail starts luffing/flogging bad.... and I have never heard of one coming out, but if it did, it would only cause the rig to slacken but not fall...

the attachment where the johnson lever connects to the stem head fitting, it has to be more secure. a ball lock pin or qwik-loc pin like caguy has shown is the perferred method of attachment. its fast and secure.
or use a regular clevis pin and a ring ding to secure it....

make sure you have a small lanyard connecting the 2 pins together, and have it running thru the ringding at the hinge point.... then you will never have to worry about stowing them in davy jones' locker

Tom G P-21 · Jun 5, 2013

For the forestay I use a toggle pin available here at the chandlery, see link. It's the only one we have to remove when dropping the mast. They are simple and easy to use. Just make sure to get the right size to keep the spring under compression. The rest of the standing rigging uses the standard clevis pin and ring.

http://shop.trailersailor.com/prod.php?17587/Toggle Pins

caguy · Jun 5, 2013

You will be fine with either the Ronstan or the push pin. I have had the ring dings snag on the sails and lines and pull out. I was alway replacing them on the Mac 25 because the had gotten snagged by sheets and looked llike bent paper clips. I finally replaced them with cotter pins on the side stays because they were pretty much permanent once adjusted. I hate putting those ring dings in, I think they are made for left-handed people.

Ray Bowles · Jun 5, 2013

I use my boom vang tackle, attached between the trailer and the headstay(forestay) to give that last bit of pull to attach the pin into the headstay turnbuckle. I use my mainsheet and a ginpole to raise the mast. When the mast is 99% up and just lacking that last 1 inch to pin the forestay I use the boom vang. If another person is there I can usually throw a line through a hole in the headstay attachment to the turnbuckle and then the other person can pull enough extra to pin the stay.
Ray

caguy · Jun 5, 2013

Ray Bowles said:
I use my boom vang tackle, attached between the trailer and the headstay(forestay) to give that last bit of pull to attach the pin into the headstay turnbuckle. I use my mainsheet and a ginpole to raise the mast. When the mast is 99% up and just lacking that last 1 inch to pin the forestay I use the boom vang. If another person is there I can usually throw a line through a hole in the headstay attachment to the turnbuckle and then the other person can pull enough extra to pin the stay.
Ray

What also works is if you attach your jib sheet to the anchor cleat or pulpit and pull it taught. Then you can apply side pressure to it with your knee or body while you attache insert the pin. You generate a lot of pressure that way and it leave your hands free to work with. (It's the end of the school year and I can end my sentences with a preposition if I want to.)

centerline · Jun 5, 2013

caguy said:
I hate putting those ring dings in, I think they are made for left-handed people.

....and us left handed people believe they were designed for use by right handed people

centerline · Jun 5, 2013

anchorclanker said:
I really dont want to blow $500 on stays it may not need

shop around.... there are rigging stores that do rigging at affordable prices.
a rigging store local to me that services the market in portland oregon will build you a new 5/32" forestay for approxametly $35.... with tinned copper crimp sleeves or a couple bucks more for the swaged stainless sleeves...

Tom G P-21 · Jun 6, 2013

Below is a link to a discussion on the toggle pins (drop nose pin in England), quick pins and also clevis pins. I trailer sail so every time I go out I am stepping and unstepping the mast. Last year when we were rigging the boat, I was standing there with jib halyard tring to keep it under tension when my wife dropped the ring ding. She found it right away but I realized we could of easily lost it and would of had to scrambled to the tool box to get a spare, thats when I started looking for alternatives. Some people use the quick pins for their standing rigging with no problems. There are others who've had bad experience with them and don't reccomend them for standing rigging. From what I've read I ended up in the latter not using it for my standing rigging, but I do use quick pin with a button for the boom.

The toggle pin seemed to be a good compromise between safety and ease of use. Just make sure to get the right length. They are showing up more and more in bimini kits. I also drilled the end and put a lanyard on it so it would not get lost.
Here is the link to the discussion
http://bbs.trailersailor.com/forums/precision/index.cgi?read=105801,toggle,pin