Wow! $19K For Using VHF

[sailortonyb Allied Mis]

Did I miss something?

The only acounts of this that anyone here has referenced is from boating related publications. Are there no stories of this in a real newspaper? Seems like there should be.I'm always a little skeptical of stories like this.Tony B

 

[Stillraining]

Tony B

I verified it with an acquaintance in Australia...There have been 3 cases like this go to court so far...wasent told how the others turned out..Guess we just better know and follow the rules..*o

 

[sand sailor]

we can just put them on the same list with

iraq,cuba,north korea and iran as far as tourism goes???

 

[letterman]

here is Australia's response

Dear Sir / Madam,Thank you for your inquiry.The Master of a vessel arriving in Australia is required by law to givenotice of impending arrival not later than 96 hours before arrival.Penalties may apply for failure to do so.There are several agencies interested in your arrival - principallyCustoms, Quarantine and Immigration.96 hours notice may be given by the following methods;* Sending an email to yachtreport@customs.gov.au: * Sending a fax to +61 2 6275 6331; * Phoning the Australian Customs National Communications Centre on+61 3 9244 8973. You will need to provide the following information* The name of your craft; * Your intended first port of arrival; * Your estimated arrival time; * Your last four ports; * The details of people on board including name, date of birth,nationality and passport number; * Details of any illness or disease recently encountered; * If you have any animals on board; * If you have any firearms on board.Regards, Sarah Wheeler Senior Information Officer Customs Information and Support Centre Ph: 1300 363 263Fax: 02 8339 6714 Website: www.customs.gov.au This information is provided as a guide only and should be clarifiedeither by lodging a formal advice request with the appropriate sectionof Customs or employing the services of a customs broker if appropriate.Please respond to email address information@customs.gov.au to ensure your communication with Customs is answered. -----Original Message-----From: tho52mas@aim.com [mailto:tho52mas@aim.com] Sent: Monday, 3 March 2008 06:59To: Customs InformationSubject: need info --- 00446358Stories are growing on the cruising sailboat net about the lunacy ofentering Australia. If part of the story is true, it's like you hiredthe KGB to run your operations. So, what is the real story? And whywould a VHS call not be sufficient? I do not have, nor do I plan tohave, a fax machine on board, a satellite phone aboard, or a computer tosend an email, all telling of my arrival 96 hours in advance.Tom Habanek in Cleveland Ohio

 

[letterman]

more of it

You will see, she never answered my question. Same as the guy that I asked what a headstay is. Nobody does it anymore unless you bug the shit out of them, then they get upset, and FINALLY answer your question. Then they carry the hate of you forever. "It's my precious" said Bilbo.I once got into an argument with a guy that lasted for one hour. All I asked was a question. Around and around we went. It was like a Chess Match. All the other plant workers were paying great attention because they knew I would win. After one hour (I noticed the clock at the onset) he told me the answer, which proved him wrong and me right. He didn't get it.Neither did the girl from Australia.Neither did the headstay guy.Neither did the 3487 HR people I applied to for a stinking job in the last 7 months.

 

[Bob V]

People skills

Letterman, you might want to brush up on your people skills. It sounds like you keep getting into arguments with people. The problem just might be with your approach."Stories are growing on the cruising sailboat net about the lunacy ofentering Australia. If part of the story is true, it's like you hiredthe KGB to run your operations. So, what is the real story? And whywould a VHS call not be sufficient? I do not have, nor do I plan tohave, a fax machine on board, a satellite phone aboard, or a computer tosend an email, all telling of my arrival 96 hours in advance."Look for the key words and phrases in your post "Lunacy, KGB, you bug the shit out of them, then they get upset, and FINALLY answer your question. Then they carry the hate of you forever.I once got into an argument with a guy that lasted for one hour. All I asked was a question. Around and around we went. It was like a Chess Match. All the other plant workers were paying great attention because they knew I would win. After one hour (I noticed the clock at the onset) he told me the answer, which proved him wrong and me right."These do not sound like effective communication skills, especially when dealing with foriegn goverment agencies and 3487 HR people. Now I will admit that I do not know much about you, I only know what you show me in your post, much like the HR people know what you show in your interview. This is the saame problem all of those other losers you have to deal with have, we don't have time to get to know the real you because we don't suffer fools gladly.Bob V

 

[Clark]

Interesting and Unfortunate. The key for me was that the

captain "did" contact Australian authorities for the proper way to notify the host country and was given bogus information. To wit:"Manzari told a Bundaberg, Australia magistrate court -- and, later, a District Court -- that the Australia Consulate office in Noumea, South Africa had given him a document called “Information for Yachts Traveling to Australia” that included outdated 2005 requirements for Customs notification. He followed them, using the then-allowed VHF radio and following a 48-hour notification rule, not knowing that the law had been changed." He was then punished for abiding by that information. Sounds typically 'governmental'. . . . or he lied about contacting the consulate in SA.

 

[Ross]

The timing of this news troubles me as much as anything

The whole problem started in September 2006 and It made the boating mags in February 2008. I would have called the local papers and TV stations and the chamber of commerce not to mention the US Consul as soon as I had a problem. This is either an urban myth or only a portion of the story is being told. Bundaberg is very proud of its tourist trade and hospitality. The local politicians could have been brought to bear on the customs enforcers.Edit to add: the first flag went up for me when they cited South Africa as the last port in the report. Bundaberg is on the east coast of Queensland, Aus. They finally put Neumia back in New Caledoniawhere it has been for many years.

 

[NautiDuck]

The AU response was fine

She ignored your dumbass questions and got to the real point. And, the points look valid to me and not so difficult to follow. Play the game, follow the rules. My guess is the guy arriving in AU acted like a jerk and got his due.

 

[PHitchcox]

Too funny

Let's see if I get this; you write a snotty email to Australian Customs about the KGB and think it's reasonable to expect answers to ridiculous questions. Got me why she didn't answer you.

 

[Stu Jackson]

What does this mean to you?

"...give notice of impending arrival not later than 96 hours before arrival."Not later than 96 hours BEFORE arrival...does this mean 96, 97, 98 etc. hours, so you CAN'T report that you're coming LESS THAN 96 hours?If so, it appears unreasonable because not everyone has email, fax or cell phones that cover that far out.Just askin'.Changing from being able to use VHF (that's F, not S, which is a video tape) makes little sense. After all, the same guys get the message, don't they?

 

[Ross]

Stu, I have spent several hours searching Australian customs

and they request 96 hours to ten days notice of your expected arrival. These people in another blog claim to have earn their living on the information superhighway. Why, when they were in Noumea, New Caledonia they didn't go on line in a cyber cafe and get the most up to date enter requirements has not yet been explained. I am quite sure that had they come from South Africa and landed in Perth the reception would have been quite different. Noumea, New Caladonia is as close to Bundaberg as Bermuda is to Newport. Had this same thing happened to me I would have had no choice but to apply for citizenship. A 19000 dollar fine would bankrupt me.

 

[letterman]

interesting

She did answer me, but not to the questions I asked. So I emailed her again and got the same standard reply Email, fax or phone.The reality is they want to have one place to take care of all the paperwork, and it isn't near water. And since conducting business over VHS over land is illegal, they don't allow it. New technology will soon make it OK to use VHS again and all will be OK with the Australian world. As for the guy I had with the Chess Match with, he was a boss wanna be. He knew very little about business as shown by his leaderships skills. This was the guy that made me take two interviews to get a revolving door job! As long as he paid for lunch both times, I went along with it, but told my buddy that owned the company that he was wasting money, his money. and yes, I really should work on my people skills.

 

[David10790]

$4,000 fine; the rest was for arguing

As I read the report, the boaters were fined $4,000 for breaking the law, which stupid or not, they clearly did. Ignorance of the law is not excuse, as they saying goes, and it is true everywhere.The $15,000 of court costs arose due to:a. an unsuccessful trial in Magistrates' Court; the rules allow the imposition of costs against the losing party, as is common throughout the British Commonwealth;b. an unsuccessful appeal to the higher level court. Appeals are always more expensive than trials.If the boaters had sucked it up and paid, it would have been a lot cheaper.

 

[Ross]

Just to continue beating this horse. I sent the following Email To Australian

customs and received a reply acknowledging notification of a future arrival with instructions concerning my obligation upon arrival. They asked that I not copy and paste their reply so I haven't.I am organizing for a future long distance voyage aboard my 30 foot cruising sail boat. I anticipate stops at several distant ports. At present I would plan to stop at Cape Town South Africa and at Perth. I know that Customs demands that I notify of my impending arrival but on a six thousand mile voyage is very difficult to establish a schedule. My communications equipment will be limited to ship to ship and ship to shore short range radio. Must I plan more sophisticated equipment or is there flexibility in the notification timetables? Thank you Ross Hill Bel Air ,Maryland, USA

 

[Rick D]

So, Ross, For Clarification...

..did they waive the 'not prior to 96 hour' rule? In other words, how comfortable would you be sailing into their port of entry four weeks from now with what you have from them? Just curious, Rick D.

 

[letterman]

Hmmm And your point?

They know we are on to them. Good post Ross. No secrets out. Stay cool.

 

[Ross]

Since my hypothethical voyage is planned for November 2009

No, I wouldn't sail into port a month from now without amending my schedule. I would also email from Cape Town prior to departure and get a current acknowledgement. Further I would follow their demands carefully. For any of you who like, you may use the text of my email for obtaining your own answers. My impression is they don't like someone showing up on their doorstep unannounced. They sent this link:www.customs.gov.auIt gives details of short passage notification time tables. I am of the opinion that the people in the story that started this discussion were way outside of the lines. They said that they made their living in the information industry. To me, this means they know about cyber cafes, Blackberries, Public libraries and long distance telephones.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Teaser!!! Heck, if you won't tell us what they told you

how does this help us understand if their requirements mean you need high seas communications in addition to a VHF.Ross, please help us out for some clarity.

 

[Ross]

Stu Their reply was that they acknowledge my motice of a future

arrival."Your arrival report to Customs has been received. If you have asked any questions Customs will respond to you as soon as possible." That is the first line of their reply the rest dealt with details for clearing customs.I asked if longer range equipment would be needed and they haven't replied to that question yet.