winter messenger line type

Feb 14, 2010
156
Hunter H33C Quincy, MA
going to use messenger lines on my halyards this year to try and minimize exposure through the winter, wondering what is best to use in this instance. . . thanks for any input. . .
 
Feb 10, 2004
3,919
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
Use some cheap 1/4" nylon line. Do not use 1/8" line - it can wear and break too easily. I have been using the same 1/4" lines for many years.
 
Nov 9, 2012
2,500
Oday 192 Lake Nockamixon
When I was at the Atlantic City Boat show last year, I got some 1/4" polyester utility cord. It's not double braid, more like a single braid cover over parallel stranded core. So, it's kinda softer than, say, double braid Sta-set or similar. It's been doing great as my rudder blade up haul, my fender lines, and pennant halyards for the race committee boat, stuff like that. Based on Rich saying that 1/8" polyester utility cord like New England Ropes makes isn't robust enough, I bet this stuff I have would make great messengers, at cheaper than a polyester double braid. However, I don't see this stuff listed on their web site. I'd give them a call, and ask them about it. http://onlineropestore.com I did just buy some polyester double braid from them, 3/16" to use for my little boat's tarp. I found it to be less expensive than either New England Sta-set, or Sailcare.com, who sells Novabraid for less than Sta-set.
 
Jul 7, 2004
8,402
Hunter 30T Cheney, KS
I just used some left over 1/4" line for a messenger on my CDI Furler halyard but it stops at the top. I'd be interested in how you splice your line so that it can get up and over the blocks to get back to the deck.
 
Mar 26, 2011
3,401
Corsair F-24 MK I Deale, MD
a. How long does it take to remove the halyard, including hauling to the car and bringing it back in the spring?
b. How much does this extend its life?
c. What is your time worth?

If a $200 halyard lasts 12 years instead of 8 years, I have to frog with it 24 times at 30 minutes each, I save $100 for 12 hours od steady work. I also have 24 chances to snag of loose the line. For me, the math does not work. Same goes for the rest of the rigging. I have other things to do.
 
Sep 25, 2008
1,096
CS 30 Toronto
My Halyards are 20+ years old. We store our mast on land, no cover. Never left the mast. Doesn't seem to affect it. This is Canadian Winter ... cold.
 
Jul 7, 2004
8,402
Hunter 30T Cheney, KS
I would think the sun's UV and mast slap from the wind in warmer climes would be harsher.
 
Jan 22, 2008
8,050
Beneteau 323 Annapolis MD
On my B323 I used the same (1/8?) line as is used for flag halyads. It's lasted years as a halyard. I just completed turning all my running lines end-for-end without a problem. I pushed back the outer cover, placed the line inside the inner strands, milked the cover back over it all, then secured it all with string around the cover. Just one or two wraps around, then square knot was strong enough to squeeze it all together.
 
Feb 10, 2004
3,919
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
Sorry, I guess I misunderstood the purpose of the messenger lines. I use my 1/4" lines to attach to the shackle that is on my halyards. I then pull the halyards up and inside of my mast for the winter. In this way they are not exposed to the weather and sun except for the last 3-4" by the shackle and for the 3 feet or so that are exposed between the mast exit point and my winter cover. The rest of the halyards are coiled and under my winter cover.

I didn't realize that the purpose was to remove the halyards completely for the winter. I think that would be a lot more work to create a secure attachment between the messenger and the halyard so that it doesn't part.
 
Mar 26, 2011
3,401
Corsair F-24 MK I Deale, MD
Sorry, I guess I misunderstood the purpose of the messenger lines. I use my 1/4" lines to attach to the shackle that is on my halyards. I then pull the halyards up and inside of my mast for the winter. In this way they are not exposed to the weather and sun except for the last 3-4" by the shackle and for the 3 feet or so that are exposed between the mast exit point and my winter cover. The rest of the halyards are coiled and under my winter cover.

I didn't realize that the purpose was to remove the halyards completely for the winter. I think that would be a lot more work to create a secure attachment between the messenger and the halyard so that it doesn't part.
True enough. And since you aren't pulling the knot/splice through, a knot will do.

But what are you protecting? The failure point is always near the end. I trim that a few times if needed, either way. The winch or jammer area? That is under my sail cover, and if halyards go to the cockpit there are many options. But again, the cure is to trim the end every few years, moving the wear point before it is noticeable.

As for halyard slap, I'm guessing that was a joke? Properly secured halyards do not slap or chafe. Additionally, in warm climates, why not just sail all year?
 
Feb 10, 2004
3,919
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
I just think that having the lines subjected to 5-6 months of sun and weather is needless and simply can't be bendficial for the line. Maybe the harm is small, but so it the effort to protect them the way I do. Mast slap is not an issue for me at all.
 
Jul 1, 1998
3,062
Hunter Legend 35 Poulsbo/Semiahmoo WA
No big deal

Rich - The sun and it's UV is not beneficial to the lines so using a messenger line to run the shackle end up the mast and get the halyard out of the sun. The companies that make lines, say that their strength decreases with UV exposure.

In my case, I've got one messenger line, dacron 3-strand, that is over 30 years old and is still a good. However, last year I bought a couple new 1/4" braided Nylon lines and the UV degraded them by spring to the point they were chalky.

Since I use the main halyard to go up the mast, this is one line I really want to protect. However, I use the jib or spinaker halyard as a second line for safety purposes.

Time required: not very much. Just one more part of winterizing or spring commissioning.
 
Last edited:
Mar 12, 2013
28
Oday 25 Milwaukee
I use good 'ol duct tape to splice the lines. I lay the line (cheap 1/8" double braid poly) end to end with the halyard and do about 4-5 wraps with the tape for about a 6 inch long splice. Need to tug it a little to get over the top of the block but it works. Helps to have the line & halyard at the opp ends of the boat for less of an angle. The hardest part is getting the duct tape off afterwards it sticks so well.


I just used some left over 1/4" line for a messenger on my CDI Furler halyard but it stops at the top. I'd be interested in how you splice your line so that it can get up and over the blocks to get back to the deck.
 
Nov 9, 2012
2,500
Oday 192 Lake Nockamixon
John Nantz, nylon would not be my first choice in line while having a discussion about UV degradation. Polyester is a much more UV stable material. I think polyethylene is about the worst for UV resistance.

My Grandfather taught me a lot about boating. And I paid attention to everything. He used polyethylene single braid for dock lines. I guess because it was easy to splice? And cheap? I used to hate when that line would start to get old. Poly-e splinters in the hands are oh so comfortable. I use laid nylon for my dock lines, and I go to the trouble of splicing it to length. It didn't take me that long, Granddad! :D:D:D And, I'm fully prepared to buy new if these start getting icky.

For everything else, I look for polyester covers at a minimum (for example, my halyards are Vectran core, with a polyester cover.)
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
My 14 year old sta-set running rigging is still completely serviceable.
 

Joe

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Jun 1, 2004
7,999
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
a. If a $200 halyard lasts 12 years instead of 8 years, I have to frog with it 24 times at 30 minutes each, I save $100 for 12 hours od steady work. I also have 24 chances to snag of loose the line. For me, the math does not work. Same goes for the rest of the rigging. I have other things to do.
What if re running each halyard takes less than 5 minutes... (a Flemish eye on the halyard will save connection time?) If you set it up correctly it shouldn't take more than a minute to clip on the halyard, pull it through and secure. If you're spending 30 minutes changing out a halyard that you have set up for change, there's something you've left out.

Use 1/8 or 3/16 polyester line for the messenger.
 
Jun 8, 2004
853
Pearson 26W Marblehead
halyard messenger lines

I have to agree with thin water I store my mast outside on 3 saw horses my halyards are 8 years old they are fine At my age I have no time to waste
 

DougM

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Jul 24, 2005
2,242
Beneteau 323 Manistee, MI
Everybody has a preference, and that's good. I have been tying messenger lines to the headboard shackles and pulling the halyards up to the masthead. For the jib halyard and the Spinnaker halyard, I lead the messenger lines to the bow pulpit. Similarly, the main halyard messenger line is secured to the stern pushpit. It take but a few minutes. The boat is completely covered so, lines can be coiled and hung on the mast cleats so they don't lay on the cabin top and potentially get wet if the cover should happen to get some weather damage.

On the spring, as the halyards are pulled down, they can be inspected for chafe. I have not had any issues in nine years. I can be out sailing shortly after re-commissioning. Then as time permits, every couple of years, I can end for end the halyards.