This lower swage was exactly 10 years old when replaced. The cracks are hard to see but..... Check your rig spring is coming...
Why I Replace Standing Rigging
- Thread starter Maine Sail
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I just took apart the Profurl unit on Seafever to inspect the wire and while it was PITA i am really glad i did as the wire was worn badly from well furling 
I am sure it would have failed in the near fiuture and hurt somebody or worse
I am sure it would have failed in the near fiuture and hurt somebody or worse
My previous boat, a wonderful old C&C, had oversized rigging. I think that back in the mid-70s C&C used the same sized rigging on all its boats 30ft and under. This caused me to think the standing rigging would last much longer than average. When I finally replaced the rig, I believe it was about 27 yrs old. While no visible cracks, meat hooks, rust, or other signs of wear were noticeable with casual observation, a close inspection after the rig was down indicated the tangs on the uppers were just beginning to show signs of crevice corrosion. If your rig is -- like us -- getting on in years, I suggest getting a professional rigging survey now and then an avoid the lost time, cost, and danger associated with a rigging failure....
But if you wait until it fails, can't you file an insurance claim and get a new mast and standing rigging for free? Maybe even some new sails if the old ones go down with the mast when you cut it free. I'm just saying...
No you can't. The insurance companies deem it routine maintenance and with manufacturers like Hayn and others in the industry recommending a 10 year cycle, and you don't have receipts, well...good luck!
While inspecting the standing rigging of my '78 Cape Dory 25, I found all of the lower ends of the stays and shrouds were clean looking Norseman swage-less studs for turnbuckles. These all look very clean and new-like with the size of the fitting stamped on it. The boat was last registered in 1996 and stored inside for much of that time. It has not been in the water since then.
The back stay was replaced last year and the forestay is being replaced this year. The forestay didn't look right. When I pulled it out of the very old, long single extruded foil, I was glad that I am replacing both the stay and the furling.
I want to check the upper ends of the shrouds one-more-time just in case. Three on each side give me a little more confidence, but I don't want to have the mast fall when I most need it.
I am trying to get a sense of the age of the rigging. When did the Norseman swage-less fittings come into existence?
The back stay was replaced last year and the forestay is being replaced this year. The forestay didn't look right. When I pulled it out of the very old, long single extruded foil, I was glad that I am replacing both the stay and the furling.
I want to check the upper ends of the shrouds one-more-time just in case. Three on each side give me a little more confidence, but I don't want to have the mast fall when I most need it.
I am trying to get a sense of the age of the rigging. When did the Norseman swage-less fittings come into existence?
I know someone who just did this and the insurance covered it and then dropped them.
I have had conversations with many sailors and the general feeling is why bother to change out old rigging. Many have stated that they have never heard of something like this failing. Two of those people have had rigging failures and in one case the mast came straight back into the cockpit. Luckily it fell right between 5 people sitting in the cockpit and no one was injured.
Mine is getting on 13 years and I had it professionally inspected. Although everything tested out fine, I did have some minor kinks in two lower shrouds. I had them replaced. The remaining rigging will get replaced next winter and the existing will be carried as spares. All new riggining will have swages up top and sta-lok at the bottom. Mast gets stored inside every winter.
Mine is getting on 13 years and I had it professionally inspected. Although everything tested out fine, I did have some minor kinks in two lower shrouds. I had them replaced. The remaining rigging will get replaced next winter and the existing will be carried as spares. All new riggining will have swages up top and sta-lok at the bottom. Mast gets stored inside every winter.
While I lack the long expereince of some...
I will add that all of the failures were with togles or upper ends, so wax would not have mattered.
- I towed a boat in who's stick was in the water, a few years ago. It was a little breezy, but not bad.
- I've replaced rigging on my boats 3 times, in each case with cracks like those shown or worse. In 2 cases, there was no way the rig would have stayed up for a season (granted, it was a souped-up race boat).
I will add that all of the failures were with togles or upper ends, so wax would not have mattered.
I was just chatting with a very knowledgable broker/rigger about my rig. We're in the Great Lakes. He's been involved in sailing for at least 30 years here. Said he has not seen ONE failure from corrosion on a Great Lakes boat. Even 40 year old boats. Failures from kinked wire or damaged fittings yes, but zero failures from corrosion. Knows many 30+ year old boats with original rig.
That is consistent with what I have heard and seen on my 1980 boat that was in MI until I brought her to Maine in 2005. There is still no sign of cracking or problems in the rigging.
I'm sure I could go a few more years but I'm replacing it all this year because I can do it now easily and want to start the long distance cruising I'll be doing with zero time on the rig. I'm also correcting the serious design issues discussed in previous threads.
The latest discovery is under the pop riveted spreader mounts. There is no compression tube and the holes in the mast under the mounts is drilled for one so is larger than the bolt that holds the tanks for the lower shrouds. This means that the entire load of the lowers is being taken by the pop rivets. If these were to sheer, the shrouds would remain attached but the spreaders mount would be loose. It probably wouldn't come adrift but it wouldn't be good and would require the mast to come down for repair shortly after.
Cracks are easier to spot if you use a 'dye penetrant' (Magnaflux, etc.) -- A 'system' of cleaner, dye, and 'developer'. Dye penetrant will differentiate between actual cracks and 'swaging scars'.
Never ever use dye penetrant ON the boat as will deeply penetrate into the Gelcoat/FRG and then cannot be removed. WM, etc. 'used' to offer so you can probably get them to 'special order' if you cant find a Magnaflux, etc. distributor.
eg.: http://www.markingpendepot.com/magnafluxspotcheck.aspx?gclid=CL362c6kxKcCFR9x5Qod5nLKCQ
Method: Remove rigging part from boat. Apply cleaner then wipe, spray-on dye & wait and 'wipe-off', spray on developer then wait. Cracks will show as faint 'red' lines as the dye retained inside the crack 'bleeds' into the developer.
I 'dye-pen' all my rigging terminals every time I drop my mast ... about every 4 yrs.; I dye-pen my bowsprit cranse collar (a weldment) every year; and every damn time I 'pull' and recaulk my 'kinked' chainplates.
Method2: take suspected part to an automotive machinist, etc. ... will have 'magnetic' techniques to ascertain 'macro-cracks'.
Without getting into 'technical discussions', dye penetrant etc. test methods probably should be done whenever one can approximate/guesstimate that the rigging has 'gone beyond' 30% of Ultimate Tensile strength for 0,5 million load cycles - about 1/2 circumnavigation. Backstays (with adjusters) under full sail loading can easily exceed this limit under 'normal' conditions; so, the forestay-backstay combo should probably be assayed more often. Ditto any chainplate or tang, etc. that has a 'kink' in the design.
Never ever use dye penetrant ON the boat as will deeply penetrate into the Gelcoat/FRG and then cannot be removed. WM, etc. 'used' to offer so you can probably get them to 'special order' if you cant find a Magnaflux, etc. distributor.
eg.: http://www.markingpendepot.com/magnafluxspotcheck.aspx?gclid=CL362c6kxKcCFR9x5Qod5nLKCQ
Method: Remove rigging part from boat. Apply cleaner then wipe, spray-on dye & wait and 'wipe-off', spray on developer then wait. Cracks will show as faint 'red' lines as the dye retained inside the crack 'bleeds' into the developer.
I 'dye-pen' all my rigging terminals every time I drop my mast ... about every 4 yrs.; I dye-pen my bowsprit cranse collar (a weldment) every year; and every damn time I 'pull' and recaulk my 'kinked' chainplates.
Method2: take suspected part to an automotive machinist, etc. ... will have 'magnetic' techniques to ascertain 'macro-cracks'.
Without getting into 'technical discussions', dye penetrant etc. test methods probably should be done whenever one can approximate/guesstimate that the rigging has 'gone beyond' 30% of Ultimate Tensile strength for 0,5 million load cycles - about 1/2 circumnavigation. Backstays (with adjusters) under full sail loading can easily exceed this limit under 'normal' conditions; so, the forestay-backstay combo should probably be assayed more often. Ditto any chainplate or tang, etc. that has a 'kink' in the design.
I don't think that most marine insurance polices would cover the cost of a new rig if the failure cause was determined to be normal wear and tear and/or corrosion. What probably would be covered by most policies having "consequential damage" coverage (see BoatUS Insurance explanation) would be the damage done to you, your boat, other boats, etc., if your rig did fail due to wear and tear. A rig failure, on the other hand, caused by storms, accidents, or being run over by a power boat operated by a moron probably would be covered. The latter happened to a friend of mine who owns a beautifully restored CD28. His boat was out of service, and he had no sailling, for nearly 2 years as he waited for a new mast, boom, and standing rigging to be obtained and installed. He kept himself busy by re-doing the damaged deck and gel coat, and teak....
CHANGE YOUR RIGGING NOW!!!!! You are one of the lucky ones who got a warning.... I have been manufacturing masts and rigging for 25 years and know what can happen with old rigging and when I say old I mean anything over 10 years. Most 1x19 wire is made by a company called Koss, who give wire a 10 year life expectancy...some fitting manufacturers tell you to replace at 7 years but the industry standard is 10 years to replace all your standing rigging regardless of "what it looks like" I have seen too many injury’s from masts coming down and in every case the rigging failed without warning. Replace it now or wait and replace the rigging, mast, repair the boat and pay your medical bills......Get the top end swaged and use Sta-Lok at the bottom, let me know if you need help.
Cheers
Cheers
I would be interested then in what you think about the rather appalling engineering details I've found on the Kenyon rig of my 1980 Endeavour 32. These are the upper tangs
The lowers were even worse. Looking around mast racks and marinas since, I think this practice of supplying tangs bent to a generic angle which then flex with every load change is pretty widespread. Sharp break lines in the bends are also common.
The common double tang design is sized assuming both tangs effective but, with only slight miss-alignment, one tang will take all or most of the load. A lot of rigs are therefore half as strong at this point as they were designed to be.
Other things I found in my rig:
The hole for the upper tang bolt was drilled to the size of the compression tube so it could be inserted from the outside and it was functioning only as a bushing.
There was no compression tube at the spreaders. The hole in the mast was drilled for the compression tube but the bolt bushing was only bearing on the s.s. spreader mount. All the sheer load of the lower shrouds was being taken by the pop rivets holding the spreader mount on.
I'm amazed because I have never heard of one of these boats losing its rig and couldn't find any visible deterioration in my wires and terminals (professionally inspected two years ago). The rigging is original 1980 as far as I know but was in fresh water until 2005.
It will be all new this season along with all new mast tangs of single plate design.
That is most likely what you are seeing as this boat spent three of the ten winters in freezing temps with those stays.
This type of failure is quite common to Northern boats and why many professional riggers swage the uppers but not the lowers. Our boat is now all swaged uppers and mechanical lowers. I mixed and matched our mechanical fittings so I could compare how the hold up and fair. We have Norseman's, StaLoc's & Hayn Hi-Mods. So far the StaLoc & Hi Mods have the best finish for resisting rust. The Norseman's not so much..
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