Who's on the hook?

[Peter Brennan]

Anchor buoy

Marking the actual location of the anchor with a float of some kind is a very good idea. We have done it from time to time and it certainly helps define the swinging circle in advance.But the other day we saw a rather curious variation on this theme. There was a power boat that had a stern anchor to the beach and a bow anchor in the water. There was a fender floating ahead of the boat, which all assumed marked the seaward anchor. Yet boats kept tangling with this rode and were helped out of trouble by the owner in an inflatable. Eventually, this boat was the "anchor" of a four-boat raftup.When the raft broke up, it became apparent that the fender did not mark the anchor but only where the rode entered the water! He had at least 400 feet of line out. No wonder other boats kept getting entangled. As he pulled in that rode, he came perilously close to us and several other boats, all of which had assumed they were anchored in the clear. His (or his wife's) efforts to retrieve the anchor provided much closely watched entertainment for some time, not to mention overhearing some choice bits of discourse between wife on bow and husband on wheel. Finally, they got it up and proceeded to take off, but had neglected to secure the inflatable, which turned sidewise, swamped and broke loose. "Get another hobby!" someone yelled. "Hush!" said my wife. "We have all screwed up one time or another." "Not me," sez this other guy. Liar!Actually, we had spoken to the people earlier and they were a very nice couple. We felt for their embarrassment.Anyway, put the float where the anchor is, not where the rode enters the water. And oh yeah -- don't retrieve an anchor by backing down. You only dig it in deeper. Get the rode straight up and down and go forward. But he wasn't listening. His ears were burning too much.

 

[Mitch Simmons]

Not just stink potters!!

Even though it does seem that, in general, sailors are more aware of good seamanship, years ago, while anchored off Saba Rock in the BVIs, I had this experience: we were the only boat in the designated anchorage, when well after dusk, a large (45' to 50'), very salty appearing, wooden gaff rigged cutter motored past our position. We watched them drift to a stop about 75 yards directly ahead of us and heard many fathoms of chain rode leaving the hawse pipe. It was difficult to judge distance with certainty, but we were a little apprehensive about the nearness of his final position. Not wanting to be "bad" neighbors, however, we keep our concerns to ourselves. Right at the crack of dawn, one of our crew unable to sleep, wandered on deck and was startled to see our neighbor less than fifteen feet off our bow and both boats "sailing" at anchor in the stiff morning breeze. By the time we roused the crew of the other boat, they had dragged within boat hook distance. Without a word to us (or a stitch of clothing!) the crew of the dragging boat hoisted their main, retrieved their ground tackle and sailed off the anchorage. No damage done, but a sphincter tightening experience, none the less!!

 

[Justin - O'day Owners' Web]

Legal legs to stand on

Its been a while since I've waded into one of these discussion in response to assertions of legaility but here I go - We have all at one point or another been on both sides of the coin in this situation if we have done any significant cruising at all. If we haven't we will be. Even if we've never known that the boat nearby thought we were too close someone did one time - probably more. I have moved when other boats have anchored near me and had boats move when they thought I was too close - a few thoughts.First - you can tell if the guy to leward of you is getting ready to hoist and move. You almost always have time to jump in the dinghy and offer to move your boat to a location they will be happier with - never hurts to be a good neighbor.Secondly - if someone anchors above you there is simply no right to have him move. If you approach as if asking for a favor maybe you'll get somewhere. Approaching as if your entitled will get you nowhere.Most importantly - there have been several assertions in this thread that if you either fly the don't anchor here signal or make clear to another vessel that they are endangering you that you will have a superior position in a subsequent law suit. With respect to those posters making these assertions, this is not a good strategy.The rule is supposed to be protect life, then boats. You're not doing that if you sit back self-satisfied and let the guy above you drag into you. Maybe not a legal problem but its bad seamenship.As far as the law - if you see the guy anchored above you, assess the situation as potentially dangerous, and do nothing about it you are going to wind up at least liable in part. The court or jury will assess your relative negligence and any recovery you might have from the other guy will be reduced by whatever percentage is your fault.What do you think the jury is going to do if you sit smug, the wind veers 180 and you drag down on the other guy? I wouldn't want to be there, especially as ignoring a dangerous condition probably voids your marine casualty insurance.Flame suit on - though I won't be around to feel it. I'm off to take the bar exam tomorrow morning. Wish me luck.Justin - O'day Owners' Web

 

[Bill Kroll]

Talk it out now!

Talk now before it's dark or you have a change in weather. This happened to me in the Virgin Islands and the other boat was fine with moving and we were releived.On that same trip our anchore slipped late at night due a back draft off a mountain and were very close to another boat. We posted a watch all night to make sure we did not hit and came very close. At dawn we were out of there.

 

[Terry Marzen]

Please protect us both

Courtesy is always a part of the "rules" of the sea. In this case the "invader" has broken the rules and should be made mindful of it in a courteous way. Contact on the VHF to discuss is the way I would try. If that fails then a trip in the dingy is next. State your purpose for the concern and remind him of the changing conditions such as wind , tides, and current. Safety is at stake and all parties should do their best to maintain safety concerns. If they are unwilling to heed this advise then it is in your best interest to pull up anchor and reposition a safe distance away. This will allow you and the crew to sleep in comfort and safty thru the night.

 

[LaDonna Bubak - CatalinaOwners.com]

Suggest a raft up

The best technique I've seen is to suggest that since it's a little tight, why not a raft up? Usually folks are pretty pleased to do so rather than have to reanchor plus you have the opportunity to make new friends!LaDonna

 

[FatCat]

Ahoy Skipper

I would alert the skipper of the possibility of the two boats bumping in the night and (and if they look like good boaters)ask them if they would like to raft up for the night and try to figure out a better position in the morning.

 

[Michael Alexander]

I would try to raise them on the radio first and if this does not work go over in the dinghy and express my concerns or demand that he find another spot

 

[Bob Todd]

Good luck, Justin!

Hard work does pay off!

 

[newly anonymous]

just the facts

I row over to the offender, and calmly explain the facts. "My boat displaces ten tons and I have 90 feet of chain out. Because I have a bulb keel, my boat tends to swing through a 160-degree arc. The tide will be turning in another three hours. I do not consider it safe to anchor in the spot you've chosen." This approach works at least 90% of the time. However, if the troglodyte doesn't seem to understand his predicament at that juncture, I calmly ask for the name of his insurance carrier. At this point, even the most recalcitrant stinkpotters will move.

 

[newly anonymous]

trip line floats

The trip-line float idea is a great one, but I stopped using it a few years ago when a Bayliner came along, snagged my fender with his boat hook, and tied up to it. When I explained that he was moored to my anchor's trip line, he didn't seem to understand what the problem was. Maybe when Justin passes the bar he can give us advice regarding the point at which it's justifiable to begin shooting.

 

[Les Blackwell]

Learn to relax

I don't want to tell others how to act or behave least of all how and where to anchor. The only person I want to be superior to is the person I was yesterday.I can remember several times (I'm a slow learner) where someone has anchored too close to me and I would stand on the bow of my boat, looking at my anchor and then sending looks of deadly distruction to the other skipper, who on a number of occasions would say, "Hi, come on over for drinks." It is interesting how a rum and coke can make the space between the boats look a lot better. Now when someone anchors too close, I say, "hey, come on over for drinks and goodies when you've gotten done anchoring. I've met a lot of nice people this way. One skipper, after seeing it from my boat, has actually moved his anchor (but then he let out a lot more scope (on my advice) and was probably back in the same position that he was in the beginning--go figures).And there is another interesting phenomenon that I have observed. I look from my boat and ".those ....are too damn close." But we row over to their boat and even before the drinks are served, I look back on my boat and it is a good distance away. I suspect it is a matter of persective--I wish I knew.I have to admit that some years ago, I anchored in a cove and a number of other boats come in and anchored all round me. I kept pulling up on my anchor line and doing a fair amound of cussing under my breath, well, maybe no all under.... And, damn, if we didn't drag right into one of those suckers whos skipper came on deck and said, "We probably anchored to close to you--come along side and raft up--we got some great crab cooking for dinner--join us." It has turn out to be a great friendship. He has taught me how to crab. So I guess when someone anchors too close to me, I just let it happen. If he drags, I'll help him tie up alongside until morning and if he asks for advice, I'll give it but not until he asks. It's the way we learn.Les

 

[Tom Alves]

Les has the right idea

You're right Les - there's enough stress in most people's lives without adding to it while we're out sailing. A friendly & helpful attitude is always a good thing. I particularly like your attitude: "The only person I want to be superior to is the person I was yesterday." We need more sailors like you around.My 2 cents...Tom

 

[Bill]

Ask him to reevaulate his position!

Ask the person to rethink his position in reguards to your boat and a good nights sleep!

 

[Mike Whalen]

Good Luck Justin

I had a trial bumped 'cause the judge in is the hospital. So I'm thinking about going to my boat tomorow. I took the bar and passed! I'd rather be at the boat or in the hospital with the judge then take that damned thing again. Go to bed early! Don't show how smart you are just that you see what they're after. A lot of smart folks burn time and get to take it again.Good Luck,Mike

 

[Bill Lamb]

Too close to comfort

If it is flagrant, I ask them to move. If they refuse, I do so myself. If it seems more like a judgement call to me, I keep watch for a while and then decide if I want to hold or move. Last week I experienced a surprise and last laugh - for me. I had anchored for Friday night and intended to stay thru early Saturday evening. About 4 p.m. Saturday, another sail boat from Annapolis anchored uncomfortably close to us. I knew I was going to leave; but of course they did not. I thought about saying something, but since I was intending to later pick up and go, thought it would be senseless to make an issue of their indescretion. Within an hour, three other boats rafted up with the first. I became more than a little upset at all of them until I realized that those who had joined likely did not know that I had been the first to anchor. For all they knew, I had been the transgressor! I had the last laugh when a fifth and larger yet vessle (with a deeper draft than any of the rest of us) ran aground when motoring around us in an effort to join the raft. All of the men from the other vessles joined in a vain attempt to free their friends. They worked their tails off struggling to winch in on first one, then two anchors set off the stern quarter and their beam. After being entertained by their struggles for more about half an hour, I suggested they attach one to their main halyard to heel over some and break lose. After another hour watching them struggle while ignoring my suggestion, I weighed anchor. I felt just a little bit smug (and a little bit ashamed of my feelings) as I headed back to Annapolis knowing they would likely have to all move to stay clear of their friends who would be spending the night aground.

 

[Paul K]

A picture is wortha thousand words

Perspective is everything. If it really seems to close for comfort I will dink out to near the other craft to see how it looks from there. If I still determine that there isn't sufficient room I then contact the other skipper to lodge my concern. If the problem is resolved then I just go back and rest easy. If not then I take several pictures with my digital camera. When the thought of that type documentation is available, the problem is usually resolved. Having anchored in many harbors round the world and been bashed in the middle of the night, the live and let live attitude has caused me much grief.

 

[Charlie]

Go for the jugular

When it get just dark enough, judgement to be made after about 6 beers (not light beer), don the snorkel and flippers and cruise over to the vessel with a stick of dynamite or reasonable fascimilie and blow him(or her) out of the water....;-))))

 

[Mark Price]

When in doubt, let more out.

Once I was sound asleep only to awake at the sinking sound of an anchor draging. Upon checking the sitution out I found that a "New Comer" had anchored to close ( his keel was bumping my rode, not my anchor draging). It was 3AM, a storm, and we were about 5 feet apart. I just let out more rode. In the morning I made sure I was up early and made him ask me over for breakfast, been good friends since.

 

[Bill Kerr]

don't know

I've wondered what to do in this situation.I was the culpret once myself. Chartering in the BVI on a 47' (much larger and heavier than I own or usually sail) I squeezed into an anchorage that forced me to keep a too-short scope and had less swinging room than I realized. By the time I realized my position was untenable I was frighteningly close to a beautiful privately owned 70'. We motored through the dark to a distant mooring ball. I've wondered why no one told me that I was in the wrong place. No call on the VHF. No "Body Language." So ever since I've wondered what I'd do if it happened to me.