Wheel or Tiller?

[Alan ONeill]

E-Tiller

I think Bill's reference to an e-tiller was referring to the Emergency Tiller that is there in case the linkage for the steering breaks.

 

[David11054]

Tiller

Below 30 feet, I think the feedback and feel give the tiller the advantage.I don't understand knee knocking, or having to move people when tacking. The tiller on our '77 h27 curves up above all knees. With a full cockpit nobody moves on a tack. The helm just stays on the lee side, where the jib telltales are more visible, and you can see under the jib.I have no problem with buying what you like. The other responders have laid out every advantage and disadvantage I can think of. Like every sailing design aspect, this is a tradeoff!David Lady Lillie

 

[Don s/v Tellico]

Well David...

have u ever sailed on a 24/26 water ballast Hunter? You really can't compare your 27 with these boats. They have significantly different sailing charateristics.

 

[David11054]

Well, Don...

Which of my comments don't apply because I don't sail a 260/240? Since my boat is of a similar length, with similar sail area, I thought I (like others with 27 footers) might contribute my 2 cents.In your previous post, you recommend a wheel to handle the tendency of the boat to round up. Rounding up usually indicates the time to reef has past, the traveler is too high, or the rig is out of tune. Are you really saying that the 260 tends to round up if none of these are the case?DavidLady Lillie

 

[alan]

David,

the set-up of the cockpit in the 26/260 is such that tiller movement during tacking does cause people to move. Both are tender water ballasted boats with kick up rudders that sometimes creep up when they are not supposed to resulting in a lot of pressure on the helm. The tenderness means even with sails set (reefed properly) for conditions, a gust will quickly heel them hard causing need for rather large tiller swing. Depending on where you are sitting or who is controlling the main sheet, it may not be eased quick enough to avoid the need for hard rudder use. Trust me, in the face of heavy traffic the need to control the boat out wieghs placing the tiller in someones knees, gut ect. As these boats are tender with high windage, going to weather in high winds can be a choice of heeling hard or just motoring. To sail flatter in certain conditions you would have to reduce canvas to the point that the wind forces exerted on the hull would be greater than those on the small sail left. The inherent tenderness means that you want the meat on the windward side. It's also not very comfortable for some of us to be on the lee side. Those of us whom own these boats know and accept the tradeoffs. It's pretty hard to see under many head sails and depends on the cut. I placed a window in mine. alan

 

[Don s/v Tellico]

David...

I think Allan pretty much explained it. My point is/was that the water ballast boats are significantly different than fixed keel boats in many ways. You should/would/need to acknowledge that difference in any meaningful comparison. Both types have their advantages/disadvantages.Didn't really mean to offend you (which I obviously did.) Nuff said?

 

[David11054]

So the differences are

- A high force is needed on the rudder if it is not completely in the down position.- Water ballast boats are tender, heeling more than a ballasted keel.A wheel would certainly help counter the first issue, but I would think getting the rudder right and keeping it there is the preferred solution.I am changing my own thoughts about heeling in a gust, based on a recent post in another discussion. The idea is that it is better to keep the boat upright by easing the sheet or the traveler when the gust hits. This approach keeps the boat moving, (and the Admiral and crew comfortable.) Applying maximum rudder at maximum heel is braking the boat with lots more drag than turning lift. If the rudder stalls, this is also the recipe for losing control, and rounding up. Getting the tiller into my gut usually means I am close to stalling it.Another possible difference just occurred to me. If it's a nice day, people who don't have the helm tend to congregate on the cabin roof to windward with their feet on the deck. Maybe the lack of side decks, and other issues tends to keep them in the cockpit in the 240/260.Any offense is forgiven, Don. I really enjoy figuring out the real issues in these discussions.DavidLady Lillie

 

[crazy dave]

260

Unless you have already ordered the boat from a dealer and it is confirmed they will get one of the remaining 5 to be built, you will need to find a dealer who has one in stock. If you need help, email me and I will tell you whom to call. The 260 production is being stopped.As for a wheel vs tiller, the wheel is a plus. It steers like a car. You do not have to worry getting out of the way as you would with a tiller. Women love it. Better for resale. These alone make it worthwhile to have the wheel.

 

[alan]

Forget it Dave!

My wife will never "love" the boat, I've tried fuzzy dice and leopard skins. No go alan

 

[crazy]

Sorry Alan I aint gonna touch that one

Some folks like Hunter 260 but some do not. Well, if you wanna that boat and she needs some convincin, I will be glad to talk with her.By the way, my hobby is model railroad N scale.Maybe one day I will paint one that has Crazy dave express. I already have a line of trailers that have that.

 

[alan]

N GAUGE TRAINS AND OTHER HORRORS!

After spending many hours as a teenager working on them, one of my memorable moments was taking a sledge hammer to the railroad I made. Lots of good times but lots of frustration with the small tolerances. Do they still make Arnold Rapido? alan

 

[crazy dave]

better made

The quality of N Scale is superb now. Those older engines to include Arnold Rapido did get the wall versus hammer. Atlas, key and Kato are the best now.