Whats new in the world of sailing? Inflatable sails anyone?

Jan 19, 2010
12,553
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
Actually as I look at it again, it looks like it has Velcro strips for reefing and may already have one reef in. It seems scrunched up at the bottom.
 
May 12, 2004
1,505
Hunter Cherubini 30 New Port Richey
Now, I think I have a pretty good handle on the aerodynamics involved in sailing and flying but I cannot for the life of me see how this sail achieves lift even after looking at the "concept" section on their site. What am I missing? :confused:
 
Jan 19, 2010
12,553
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
Now, I think I have a pretty good handle on the aerodynamics involved in sailing and flying but I cannot for the life of me see how this sail achieves lift even after looking at the "concept" section on their site. What am I missing? :confused:
Symmetric foils can still generate lift. It is a relative pressure thing. And on this sail, I doubt it is truly symmetric. The windward side probably gets deflected some.

Your keel and rudder are most likely foil shaped (mine are) and as you make leeway, the pressure on the leeward side of the keel is greater thus generating lift to windward on your keel. Since water is dense (relative to air), the lift generated by your keel is actually a significant contributor to how your keel helps you minimize leeway.

On foil shaped rudders, you also get an advantage in that the lift generated by the rudder when you turn it in the water helps you turn the boat without having to drag your rudder at such a large angle. A well shaped rudder adds boat speed in that you don't use it as a break to turn.
 
May 12, 2004
1,505
Hunter Cherubini 30 New Port Richey
Symmetric foils can still generate lift. It is a relative pressure thing. And on this sail, I doubt it is truly symmetric. The windward side probably gets deflected some.

Your keel and rudder are most likely foil shaped (mine are) and as you make leeway, the pressure on the leeward side of the keel is greater thus generating lift to windward on your keel. Since water is dense (relative to air), the lift generated by your keel is actually a significant contributor to how your keel helps you minimize leeway.

On foil shaped rudders, you also get an advantage in that the lift generated by the rudder when you turn it in the water helps you turn the boat without having to drag your rudder at such a large angle. A well shaped rudder adds boat speed in that you don't use it as a break to turn.
Thanks, I understand that concept, just didn't think about it enough. However, would the keel and rudder give you enough lift to generate the kind of apparent speed shown in the picture and the clips on their site?
 
Jan 19, 2010
12,553
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
Thanks, I understand that concept, just didn't think about it enough. However, would the keel and rudder give you enough lift to generate the kind of apparent speed shown in the picture and the clips on their site?
I don't think of the keel as giving you any speed because generally I sail in a lake that has relatively no current. The "current" from air is what is driving the boat and once the boat starts moving you get counter lift from the keel if it is foil shaped. I've never really thought about how water currents might affect the lift vectors on a submerged keel while underway but on first pass, they would either add to or subtract from the lift vector. But if they are subtracting from the lift vector that means the current is helping to push you to windward so all-in-all that is a good thing and probably is not worth pondering over (go sailing). I guess the rudder is acting in a similar way but sine I use it to steer I mostly think of it that way and not as a major component in leeway reduction. You change the angle of attack on your rudder foil so the change in lift vectors can contribute to the steering power of your rudder.
 
Nov 8, 2007
1,578
Hunter 27_75-84 Sandusky Harbor Marina, Ohio
Symmetrical wings can provide powerful lift. All of a rudder’s turning force comes from lift. And it’s lift on the keel that resists the sideways component of the wind to keep a boat on course heading into the wind.

I did a study of the lift on a symmetrical wing shape in fluid mechanics lab long ago.
 
Apr 16, 2017
841
Federation NCC-1701 Riverside
Symmetrical wings can provide powerful lift. All of a rudder’s turning force comes from lift. And it’s lift on the keel that resists the sideways component of the wind to keep a boat on course heading into the wind.
If some boats had sails in the shape of ceiling fan blades they wouldnt sail any worse.

What i dont like about the inflatable is there are too many variations of draft. The shape has low draft at the folds and beteeen the folds max draft. I bet the lift is confusing. Probably great for consumers that arent sure what the outhaul is good for.

Just sail with every combination of outhaul at once.
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Back at school, I always used to laugh at people (usually engineering freshmen) who would argue the abstract nature of some pet theory they just learned versus sold empirical evidence of something working.