We're picking up a new (to us) H260 in a few weeks, so no experience with water ballast yet. The question is whether the boat needs a full ballast when we're putting around the small bay using the outboard? Is the boat stable enough for an outboard without a full tank of water? How about half, a quarter full, no ballast? I seem to recall that Mac26's can go without water ballast, but have no interest in learning the hard way with a new boat! ;-( This is my first post and I thank all of you for your counsel!
Water Ballast, question from a Newbie
- Thread starter Rick H260
- Start date
- Status
fill er up
totally full, very unstable with less, the water will slosh to the low side and cause the boat to heel over past anything comfortable The 26X mac could run empty, but that boat had a flat bottom, and was designed to plane with empty ballast...
totally full, very unstable with less, the water will slosh to the low side and cause the boat to heel over past anything comfortable The 26X mac could run empty, but that boat had a flat bottom, and was designed to plane with empty ballast...
lesson learned!
Full ballast it will be for both sailing and motoring... What with yet another hurricane on the horizon, it furthers my comfort level with having chosen a trailerable boat, too. Thanks for the lessons, gentlemen!
Full ballast it will be for both sailing and motoring... What with yet another hurricane on the horizon, it furthers my comfort level with having chosen a trailerable boat, too. Thanks for the lessons, gentlemen!
George and Rick,
George, Mine leaks too. I'm wondering if it's designed to, so if the operator forgets, it will eventually fill anyway. It certainly leaks slow enough for mine to float like a cork off the trailer. Rick, When you first put in, notice how much your body movement impacts the stability of you boat prior to filling the tank. That will give you an idea of how important the ballast is. I would be terrified to try sailing or motoring with empty or partially filled tank.
George, Mine leaks too. I'm wondering if it's designed to, so if the operator forgets, it will eventually fill anyway. It certainly leaks slow enough for mine to float like a cork off the trailer. Rick, When you first put in, notice how much your body movement impacts the stability of you boat prior to filling the tank. That will give you an idea of how important the ballast is. I would be terrified to try sailing or motoring with empty or partially filled tank.
whoa! Dave
Dave your statement "It certainly leaks slow enough for mine to float like a cork off the trailer" makes it sound as though you cruise around with the boat on the trailer with the ballast FULL! yipes..say it aint so!! I don't think the trailer is designed to carry the extra ton anywhere but draining as it is hauled from the water...perhaps mis read/understood your intent. I posted a picture of my ballast seal replacement, but could not find it to paste a link here..but to retread that ground, the stock seals leak, and I would think if on a long enough tack you would be losing ballast until the "raised water" on the high side matches the waterline...and as this was happening you would have to reef or slack the mainsheet.. call me a perfectionist..but I don't like the idea of my ballast leaking out Sooo I replaced my seal with a !/2" thick neoprene wetsuit remnant, the extra loft of the thick seal fills the voids caused by the fact that the ballast disc plate is at an angle and not 90 degrees to the hull, long story short, my old ballast seal leaked so badly that it would lose 5 gallons in 10 minutes. It is a Hunter issue that could have been solved by a wee bit more thought, the original seal is too thin and hard to work properly.
Dave your statement "It certainly leaks slow enough for mine to float like a cork off the trailer" makes it sound as though you cruise around with the boat on the trailer with the ballast FULL! yipes..say it aint so!! I don't think the trailer is designed to carry the extra ton anywhere but draining as it is hauled from the water...perhaps mis read/understood your intent. I posted a picture of my ballast seal replacement, but could not find it to paste a link here..but to retread that ground, the stock seals leak, and I would think if on a long enough tack you would be losing ballast until the "raised water" on the high side matches the waterline...and as this was happening you would have to reef or slack the mainsheet.. call me a perfectionist..but I don't like the idea of my ballast leaking out Sooo I replaced my seal with a !/2" thick neoprene wetsuit remnant, the extra loft of the thick seal fills the voids caused by the fact that the ballast disc plate is at an angle and not 90 degrees to the hull, long story short, my old ballast seal leaked so badly that it would lose 5 gallons in 10 minutes. It is a Hunter issue that could have been solved by a wee bit more thought, the original seal is too thin and hard to work properly.
Water Ballast,
I agree with Dave D that practice is the most telling feature. After I float the boat off the trailer, I'll climb aboard and rock her at the dock...and with the ballast open, so as the boat fills with water, I should notice the difference in motion. My original question had to do with whether I'd need to fill ballast when using the motor, and I think the responses received so far tell me to fill the ballast as a function of launching; not of propulsion. Am I reading these right or....?
I agree with Dave D that practice is the most telling feature. After I float the boat off the trailer, I'll climb aboard and rock her at the dock...and with the ballast open, so as the boat fills with water, I should notice the difference in motion. My original question had to do with whether I'd need to fill ballast when using the motor, and I think the responses received so far tell me to fill the ballast as a function of launching; not of propulsion. Am I reading these right or....?
Water Ballast
Rick: Some people keep the ballast valve closed at launch so that the boat will float off the trailer easier. Then they open it before leaving the dock. I've never had a problem getting the boat off the trailer so I open it before launch -- a tap on the brakes at the right time and the backwark momentum forces the boat off the trailer. By the time I finish tying the boat up at the dock, the tank is full.
Rick: Some people keep the ballast valve closed at launch so that the boat will float off the trailer easier. Then they open it before leaving the dock. I've never had a problem getting the boat off the trailer so I open it before launch -- a tap on the brakes at the right time and the backwark momentum forces the boat off the trailer. By the time I finish tying the boat up at the dock, the tank is full.
AND
have some knives stashed around the boat. One at the helm and mast base as a minimum. A good rope wrench can save the day and your life IF you can get to it in a hurry. A trully tragic story about the Mack kids!
have some knives stashed around the boat. One at the helm and mast base as a minimum. A good rope wrench can save the day and your life IF you can get to it in a hurry. A trully tragic story about the Mack kids!
Rob,
Sorry dude, miscommunication. I was saying that it leaks slowly enough that my tank holds air until well after launch, or lunch depending on time of day. I do not transport water for recreational purposes!
Sorry dude, miscommunication. I was saying that it leaks slowly enough that my tank holds air until well after launch, or lunch depending on time of day. I do not transport water for recreational purposes!
Perdido Bay H26
Hi Rick: Welcome to the neighborhood! While you're out sailing, look for the Perdido Star, an H26. I sail Perdido Bay, Big Lagoon, Pensacola Bay, etc. The very reason I selected my H26 was to be able to pull her out of the water before a big "blow". BrianW
Hi Rick: Welcome to the neighborhood! While you're out sailing, look for the Perdido Star, an H26. I sail Perdido Bay, Big Lagoon, Pensacola Bay, etc. The very reason I selected my H26 was to be able to pull her out of the water before a big "blow". BrianW
The boat will quickly tell you....
....that somthing's not right. I recently delivered my wb H240 to its new owner and told him to open the valve and start filling the ballast while I parked the trailer. He unscrewed the knob but didn't push the stopper down. It took about 3min before I noticed and could give him a valuable lesson on how unstable these boats are w/o a full ballast. It may have saved a future catastophe. I'm a "closed valve until launched" kind of guy because our ramps are typically shallow. But the FIRST thing after getting aboard is filling the ballast, full. I kind of wish I could pump it out prior to reloading so I didnt have to back in so far when we're using shallow/obscure ramps that never see boats our size. The end of many shallow ramps are blown out by powerloading a stinkpot at low tide but thats a rant for another day
Rob, thanks for the seal upgrade prompt. Not a bad idea to spend a few min fixing this potential prob considering how much effort is put into other projects onboard. I'll be checking it tonight while it's tucked inside the shop waiting for Ernesto. Michael
....that somthing's not right. I recently delivered my wb H240 to its new owner and told him to open the valve and start filling the ballast while I parked the trailer. He unscrewed the knob but didn't push the stopper down. It took about 3min before I noticed and could give him a valuable lesson on how unstable these boats are w/o a full ballast. It may have saved a future catastophe. I'm a "closed valve until launched" kind of guy because our ramps are typically shallow. But the FIRST thing after getting aboard is filling the ballast, full. I kind of wish I could pump it out prior to reloading so I didnt have to back in so far when we're using shallow/obscure ramps that never see boats our size. The end of many shallow ramps are blown out by powerloading a stinkpot at low tide but thats a rant for another day
Rob, thanks for the seal upgrade prompt. Not a bad idea to spend a few min fixing this potential prob considering how much effort is put into other projects onboard. I'll be checking it tonight while it's tucked inside the shop waiting for Ernesto. Michaelslow fill?
I hear that about recreational water transport..so I guess you are saying it takes a very long time to fill?..that happens sometimes because the seal comes free from the ballast plate, and when you open the ballast valve some fill holes are still obstructed, check it out, the fill holes (4) look to be over 1" dia, and should fill the ballast tank in 5 minutes or so.
I hear that about recreational water transport..so I guess you are saying it takes a very long time to fill?..that happens sometimes because the seal comes free from the ballast plate, and when you open the ballast valve some fill holes are still obstructed, check it out, the fill holes (4) look to be over 1" dia, and should fill the ballast tank in 5 minutes or so.
unable to fill due to outside pressure
Not slow to fill once properly disengaged from the bottom of the boat. In these wb boats if, when filling, you don't physically depress the SS rod handle, the outside pressure can often keep the exterior plate pressed against the boat hull, creating a slow/not filled tank. A new owner(even really old guys like me) should always look down into the vent for water at the top. I guess anything could potentially plug the inlet when filling (weeds,jelly fish,baggies,mermaids)or prevent proper closure if stuck in the inlet. It does create quite a suction. Sorry if I was unclear before. Michael
Not slow to fill once properly disengaged from the bottom of the boat. In these wb boats if, when filling, you don't physically depress the SS rod handle, the outside pressure can often keep the exterior plate pressed against the boat hull, creating a slow/not filled tank. A new owner(even really old guys like me) should always look down into the vent for water at the top. I guess anything could potentially plug the inlet when filling (weeds,jelly fish,baggies,mermaids)or prevent proper closure if stuck in the inlet. It does create quite a suction. Sorry if I was unclear before. Michael
Water Ballast, Id like to know...
how come Hunter decided to phase them out for short keel trailerables?
how come Hunter decided to phase them out for short keel trailerables?
H260 vs. H25
Thanks Michael and Kelli for your comments, because our needs are a duplicate of yours; ease of transport, ability to transport during hurricanes, and being able to work on it at the house. George, we looked at the new H25 and didn't care for the headroom compared to the 260's. That keel sits quite low, too, and we were concerned that the wing might bury itself into our sugar-like sands up here in the northern Gulf of Mexico's many shallow bays that we frequent. We aren't blue water cruisers (yet), so the issue of stability differences between the two boat types wasn't a factor.
Thanks Michael and Kelli for your comments, because our needs are a duplicate of yours; ease of transport, ability to transport during hurricanes, and being able to work on it at the house. George, we looked at the new H25 and didn't care for the headroom compared to the 260's. That keel sits quite low, too, and we were concerned that the wing might bury itself into our sugar-like sands up here in the northern Gulf of Mexico's many shallow bays that we frequent. We aren't blue water cruisers (yet), so the issue of stability differences between the two boat types wasn't a factor.
260 vs new 25
Rick, When I was buying my boat I was trying to decide between the 260 and the new 25 as well. I ended up going with the new 25. The draft on the boat is actually only 3 inches deeper than the 260 with the keel up. The problem with beaching the new 25 like the 260 shown below, is that the rudder does not swing up enough to be completely out of harms way if there are any waves at all where you beach. The keel itself actually beaches nicely as it is very flat and about a foot wide on the bottom. Both boats have features that I liked, I just went with the new 25 for the simplicity of it, compared to the water ballast and swing keel. I am very happy with my boat as I am sure you will be with yours.
Rick, When I was buying my boat I was trying to decide between the 260 and the new 25 as well. I ended up going with the new 25. The draft on the boat is actually only 3 inches deeper than the 260 with the keel up. The problem with beaching the new 25 like the 260 shown below, is that the rudder does not swing up enough to be completely out of harms way if there are any waves at all where you beach. The keel itself actually beaches nicely as it is very flat and about a foot wide on the bottom. Both boats have features that I liked, I just went with the new 25 for the simplicity of it, compared to the water ballast and swing keel. I am very happy with my boat as I am sure you will be with yours.
H260 beaching around Pensacola
Good point, Jeff, about the draft of both boats. Around here the water's very shallow, with lots of boat traffic through Perdido Pass, so waves are very much a part of life while beached on an island. No keel is the best bet. Brian W on Perdido Star will hopefully find us in Grand Lagoon or PNS harbor while we try to learn OJT about handling the lines! Brian, if you would, drop me a message at rspickering@gulftel.com and maybe we can organize a Pensocola mini-regatta; winner and second place both enjoying some refreshment befitting a fun (if not a close) "race"! ;-)
Good point, Jeff, about the draft of both boats. Around here the water's very shallow, with lots of boat traffic through Perdido Pass, so waves are very much a part of life while beached on an island. No keel is the best bet. Brian W on Perdido Star will hopefully find us in Grand Lagoon or PNS harbor while we try to learn OJT about handling the lines! Brian, if you would, drop me a message at rspickering@gulftel.com and maybe we can organize a Pensocola mini-regatta; winner and second place both enjoying some refreshment befitting a fun (if not a close) "race"! ;-)
H260 Wt
I weighed the rig on a certified scale and got 5740 for the boat & trailer. Check out this website: http://kobernus.com/hunter260/travel/travel.html
I weighed the rig on a certified scale and got 5740 for the boat & trailer. Check out this website: http://kobernus.com/hunter260/travel/travel.html
H260 Wt
I weighed the rig on a certified scale and got 5740 for the boat & trailer. Check out this website: http://kobernus.com/hunter260/travel/travel.html
I weighed the rig on a certified scale and got 5740 for the boat & trailer. Check out this website: http://kobernus.com/hunter260/travel/travel.html
H260 Wt
I weighed the rig on a certified scale and got 5740 for the boat & trailer. Check out this website: http://kobernus.com/hunter260/travel/travel.html
I weighed the rig on a certified scale and got 5740 for the boat & trailer. Check out this website: http://kobernus.com/hunter260/travel/travel.html
- Status