Was i in the wrong?.......

[frank balcer]

Was sailing back in today from the MS.Sound, coming up the channel. Myself and another boat were tacking back and forth coming in from out front. The channel is about 100 yards wide. Outside the channel the depth runs around 4 to 6 feet depending were you are, my boat draws 5 feet. There were 4 trawlers motoring in also. As i was tacking West to East (port tack) 3 of the trawlers which were behind me fell off to my stern, the fourth kept coming, only at the last minute to fall off below me (he would be the overtaking vessel). As he went behind me there was a lot of gesturing from two fellows on there flybridge. I imediately tried to hail them 3 times on chanell 16, as they would not answer i then hailed my sailing partner in the other boat to make sure i was getting out. He informed me that, yes i was getting out. At this point my wife had a jamb on the winch on her side and my attention was off the radio and on clearing the jamb. My friend said he heard the trawler later asking if i had a radio on my boat. As i was involved with the wife and a tangle of jib sheet i did not hear/ could not acknowledge the late return from the trawler. My question is. Was I in the wrong not falling off and letting the trawler keep coming????? Or perhaps was this individual in the wrong??? Frank

 

[TT23844]

Probably

It seems to me that it's pretty inconsiderate to tack back & forth across a narrow channel and hold up traffic. Also illegal.The 'Collision Regulations' ( full title - International Regulations for Preventing Collisions at Sea) Rule 9 - Narrow Channels - International saysin b.) "A vessel of less than 20 meters in length or a sailing vessel shall not impede the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway."Other parts of Rule 9 also address the situation you described. Rule 18 - "A sailing vessel underway shall keep out of the way of..........avessel restricted in her ability to manoeuvre".You didn't specify the size or the draft of the trawlers that were overtaking, but they were presumably limited to the channel by their draft, and therefore clearly had the ROW.Additionally, while you're playing sailor, the guys on the trawlers were working for a living and probably anxious to get home & tie up after a fishing trip. Morally & legally, you were in the wrong.

 

[frank balcer]

Let me clarify....................

these trawlers were between 30 and 40 feet in length and are recreational vessels. Most likely these folks were out at the islands for a day of recreation. My draft is 5 feet I have seen some of these boats on the hill and they are around 3 to 4 feet draft.

 

[Rick Webb]

Nah, That is Hardly a Narrow Channel

The fact that he was overtaking you says to me he is more maneuverable and should steer clear of you as you stay on course. Don't sweat it he probably had his autopilot on and was too lazy to kick it off and steer the boat himself.

 

[sailormanbigd]

i dissagree

i'm sorry, but i have to dissagree with TT. He is certainly up on rules of the road, but...In my opinion...the sailboat is limited by draft as well as the trawler, but the sailboat under sail is "more limited" by the direction of the wind-under sail and not power. The trawlers can just power back to a safe "maintain steerage" speed and wait alittle for a safe openning to pass. In my neck of the woods-water, a 100 yard channel is huge, very huge. Most of the dredged channels on the west coast of FL are around 10-20 yards wide. Now granted I would never-almost never- try to tack back and forth in that small of a road-the exception, motor failed. I have "run" the channnel home when sea breeze is favorable. There are those smokers that respect me and power back until they pass me, and then there are those that will pass within 20 feet throwing a five foot bow wake. So, even though they work on a boat, are eager to arrive home, don't give them cart blanch in the water way. If it was me in that situation...i would have tacked away, dropped sail, and fired up the iron genny. Just my 2 cents. Incidently, the gambling shuttle in my area slowes down both comming and going from my port. Ps, how did the situation end up?

 

[Josh]

Not only..

Not only were you impeding traffic in a restricted channel but you were being very rude and inconsiderate. The first rule is to avoid collision. Tacking up a 100 yard wide channel by design is not attempting to avoid a collision! Beyond that many of these trawlers draw close to five feet and sometimes more while loaded and under power. For example spec draft on a Grand Banks 42 is 4'2" dry. Load her up, add a dinghy, water and fuel and the draft is edging towards 4'6". Now power up that same vessel and the skeg depth drops close to 8 to 10 more inches under power. We as sailors need to stop being so rude and adamant about "rights of way" (which does not exist) or the correct terminology "stand on".. Tacking up a 100 yard wide channel is rude and inconsiderate! Just because we're rag baggers we don't not always have the almighty stand on status.

 

[jackhartjr]

Josh...

...me thinks you might have been a little rough on our boy here. After all, he was asking if he had messed up...that tells me he is trying learn. You took out a sword and cut his throat. Were are all here to learn, please lighten up there son.Jack HartHickory, NC

 

[MoonSailer]

Always good to be nice

If the wind was coming straight down the channel that is a lot of tacking...but if you had an angle to work with so that you were doing a long tack and a short tack it doesn't sound so bad. Overtaking vessel is burdened!!!! Power boat is burdened when meeting sailboat. Legally you were right. But being nice is always appropriate. If you were just playing around and they were being needlessly impeded in their pursuit of happiness why not let them pass??? Now if they were a ship or barge you should have gotten out of the way.

 

[Ross]

Only had to tack down a channel one time

they had a six mph speed limit and the boats were spaced such that I could cross under the stern one one tack and cross under the stern of the next on the next tack. Nobody got bent out of shape and everybody kept a good interval.I don't expect it to ever happen again. But it was nice when it happened.

 

[frank balcer]

Moonsailor....

The other three boats in the group maintained their speed and made course alterations so they would go behind me. This fellow either had his auto pilot on or just was not worried about altering his course. As for being nice, I for one go out of my way to communicate with tugs, and pogey (menhaden) boats as to my intentions, and almost always tell them to keep on their course and i will alter mine.

 

[Pete]

had there been a collision

Yes you would have been wrong. Both vessel are required to do what is ever needed to avoid a collision. "right of way or stand on vessel" does not matter had there been a collision. In a maritime court of law both operators would have been access some fault, IMO most likely 50%/50%. So where does that leave you ? No place I would want to be. ! Since there was not a collision I might just write this up to a learning experience. Maybe rethink tacking across the channel especially with other traffic in the area and maybe rethink how the "other guy" is going to react or not react. My point here is you need to be proactive in this type of situation and avoid collisions and near misses at all cost. All in all don't let it ruin your day.

 

[Chuck Creel]

my 2 cents

Dick is right, this could get both interesting and difficult.having pushed coal barges in / out of the biloxi channel for years, and owning a hunter 30, i can relate to ALL vessels in concern. First of all, all navigation traffic in that channel is on ch 13 and not 16. Even though we are required to monitor ch 16 , it is not always easy.Right of Way?, lets say i am pushing abt 3000 tons of steel barges in the channel and restricted to a 9 ft draft. If you had tacked in front of me thinking a sailing vessel on a starb tack has the right of way , there is no way i can change course and often cannot slow down because of wind.I would hate to have a collison with anyone regardless of ROW.an earlier post was absolutely correct when saying that BOTH vessels would have been wrong. End result is often loss of life and or injuries. Why take a chance?And for future reference, empty barges catch wind just like a 200 foot sail 15 ft high. sometimes taking ALL the channel.Just my 2 cents.Captain Charles Creel200 ton masters/ sailing/ towingtugboat captain / sailor when i can.

 

[r.w.landau]

Frank, You have questioned yourself.

Note: did not read all responses.I think you know the answer to your question. I was not there.It's ok. Fortunately you will have more opportunity.If you think you are wrong, you probably are. If you don't know, study and learn.Sailors often have the right of way, but a courtious person may make alternative choices in their route or their means of achieving that route so that others are not imposed upon.Boating/sailing is a luxury. You may even call it a gentleman's sport. Some times we are called to be gentlemen.I am sure that the next event will have a different outcome.Good sailing with respect for other boaters!r.w.landau

 

[frank balcer]

Charles....

i do realize working channels. My handheld VHF is set to 16 and 13 for working vessels and the CSX bridge. This WAS a recreational vessel who was hailed by me three times and either did not have his radio on or did not care to answer. Maye i am naive or just uninformed but I was always told that it was a boaters responsibility, if they had a VHF, to have it on and to be monitoring chanell 16. Had this been a tug or any other working vessel i would have taken apropiate action early so as not to cause them to have to alter course.

 

[Don12364]

What if he had given way?

Frank,Just think, if you had given way to the fishing boat and a collision had occurred whilst he was giving way to you, then you would have been vilified, especially as the other fishing boats had shown by example and given way to you.IMHO fishermen think that they are ALWAYS the stand on vessel. If they have hoisted their two nets point to point or other 'fishing' signal than you must give way even if they are not actually fishing at the time. Most learn their craft at their father's knee and have never read the rules. FIO A survey of fishermen was done in the UK a while ago and the average reading age was between 10 and 12 years!In future just give them best and smile and wave as they go by. You are there for the pleasure rather than to prove a point.

 

[iain]

missing another point

frank, you didn't mention the size of your boat(or i missed mention of it).i will presume that it was at least 25'+ and had a motor.if you DID NOT have a motor, as a vessel in a (not really)tight channelALL power vessels should give you ROW. obviously, don't expect a 100,000tonne oil tanker to do that ;D .if as i suspect you had a motor, you might want to rethink the sailingup the channel bit until such time as there are fewer boats around.btw, i too like to try and sail in. i feel it hones the skillsvs. lazily tacking out in the lake.happy sailing ya'lliain.

 

[higgs]

What am I missing?

We have 4 recreational vessels inside of a 100 yard channel and the boat under power has a problem getting out of the way of the sailboat? I don't see why there was any question as to the proper course of action. Tthe rules clearly state the boat under sail is to "stand on". It has nothing to do with being polite. The rules are set up so we all know what the other guy is going to do. If you are "stand on" that is what you should be doing. Obviously, if a collision is imminent, you are no longer in a "stand on" position. a 100 yards is plenty of width for recreational boats to manuever.

 

[GuyT]

I give way to all commercial vessels

To me, I don't care about my right of way - they are on the water to make money. I am there just to have a good day so, I dont interfere an iota in their plight to make a living.But, just yesterday I was on a starboard tack and an approaching sailboat was on a port tack and I had to fall off to avoid collision. When the boat passed it had about 12 people on board and I figured someone was at the helm that simply did not know the rules. This happens all the time with pleasure boaters - there may be a captain aboard who knows the rules of the water but, he may not be at the helm and may be distracted with something else(like a clogged head one of his land lubbers just gave him).Bottom line - always be prepared to change course. Right or Wrong it doesn't matter.

 

[MoonSailer]

When two A$$holes meet

The right thing to do is to avoid a collision. When two people with attitude meet things can go wrong. Most of us just want to have a good time out on the water. I remember one guy on a pontoon boat that wanted to prove that he didn't have to give way. We were out in the middle of the lake and I was close hauled minding my own business, he comes up beside me and refuses to bear off. Finally I fall off to avoid collision. Sure I was in the right and probably could have won a court case.... But who wants to spend time in court??? He was a total A$$HOLE and could have easily avoided me by changing his course but I didn't want a collision and even if I had won the court case it was a lot easier just to fall off. there are just too many people with attitude to try and "educate" them all with a ball bat. Just smile and avoid a collision and pray that they will meet an equally obstinate person and have a real good collision. Meanwhile enjoy your sailing.

 

[tommays]

??

300 ft channel You must need to tack every 60 seconds and thats if its deep right up to the shore Tommays