VHF knuckleheads

[Fred Ficarra]

Right Peggie, no law will make them WANT to

learn. But that doesn't make laws, with selective enforcement, ineffective in changing behavior in a free society. As my sociology instructor taught; 'More laws=more freedom for the law abiding citizen in a free society" That's because people who would infringe on others are restrained from doing so. Sure, sometimes the laws are a little late, as is enforcement, (which is mostly reactionary) but the Enron bosses are often caught.

 

[Steve Kamp]

Personal responsibility vs. legislation/regulation

Tom S., Peter Suah, and Peggie are in general agreement, and even Fred is on an oblique, but intersecting course.Fred , I have been called a long nosed sob by some of the worst inmates in S.C., but I am still trying to figure out how to tie my nose in a knot. Jefferson said it best over two hundred years ago: "That government is best which governs least." We already have ample laws on the books at Federal, State, and local levels. Making an action unlawful does not prevent the act from happening. Education regarding why the action is unlawful and /or irresponsible, and what the consequences,both practical and punitive, as a result of that action could be, should be sufficient for a "reasonable" person to act accordingly. Unfortunately, our courts, civil and criminal, are backlogged as a result of actions committed by unreasonable or uneducated people. This brings us full circle to the original topic, VHF KNUCKLEHEADS with no resolution, but a lot of venting.Yes Fred I am a Republican. Steve Kamp

 

[Steve G]

My last word..

Thank you all for responding. Discourse of this nature is often healthy. At least we know where each other stands. By the way... I'm as republican as they come, and hate intrusive legislation. I'm working on my own method of enforcement; It involves an air cannon and the contents of the holding tank, but so far I can only use it offshore. As soon as I perfect it you can be sure they'll regulate its use, and they'll hold me accountable if I misuse it. But soon enough everyone will have one, the price will drop, licensing for it will go away, and we'll all be shootin' %$#& all over the place.Oh boy - Think I'll shut up now..

 

[Bill Coxe]

In the New London, Long Island Sound area the CG will often respond to the radio check and caution the requester that CH 16 is for hailing and distress only. I personally would like to see the Capitol One commercial for the desert island banned, the one where the rescue helicopter crew is greeted with "Gotcha! Did you get it, honey?" This ranks right up there with lowering the drawbridge on a sailboat because a Harley was getting ready to cross. Not funny, especially since it happened (no Harley, though) locally last year. Boat came out yesteray. Bummer

 

[Augie Byllott]

On the water, just as on the highways, and everywhere else, one finds a group of persons that runs the gamut from responsible, courteous and helpful, to ignorant, irresponsible, and foolish.What many people define as 'good' behavior cannot be legislated; the only remedy under law is punishment for defined 'bad' behavior. That's how it is in the land of the free. Not exactly nirvana, but eminently better than any known alternative.I content myself with the fact that, barring an accident, no one can spoil my day on the water unless I permit him to do so. A long time ago I ran across this one, "No one can offend you, but you can choose to take offense."

 

[Stu Jackson]

Can O Worms

Geez, Steve, ever stay up all night wondering what you'd started?I ain't no bleedin' heart Republican or some wanna spend Democrat.I just like a day on the water, and if you can't put up with the idiots, do either of two things:1. Stop boating and complaining (find another complaint, like: "I stopped boating because of all the idiots, but I MISS boating."2. Turn the damn radio OFF. We scan 09, 14 (VTS) and 16. It's NOT a big deal, and if someone's hoggin' 16, there's 09 and others, you'll eventually get a patch if it's a real emergency.Lotsa really good stuff in this one, folks, thanks so much for the entertainment.And, really, thanks to Steve, it's an important topic. Only wish the idiots would read it.......Stu

 

[Steve G]

Re: can o worms

Thanks Stu,Actually, I thought it was a good topic. but I meant it to be light hearted. My "last word" response was a sarcastic ditty, I know, but it came on the heels of an argument with my 11 year old daughter as to what was an innapropriate halloween costume, so I had a bit of a hair you know where. I'll be asking alot of questions about winch repair etc this winter so I want to keep everyone friendly with me -- agree or not, a lot of good sports on this topic.Steve

 

[Eric]

Confused on protocol

Hi all. Great thread. I received my Restricted Radio Operators Certificate with the Canadian Power and Sail Squadron a few years ago. Malcom may be able to straighten me out if I'm wrong here, but in Canada we are required to keep the radio on CH16 while on the water. We are required to monitor 16, in case of an actual emergency. However, we are also able to use 16 to call another station. It is apparent that in the US you are not able to call another station on 16. I recall hearing the admonitions from the US CG while I was sailing Lake Erie(on the Canadian side)not to use 16 for anything but emergencies(mayday). I don't get that. How are you supposed to contact other stations?What happens in the case of a Securitee? What channel are these broadcast on in the US? A Securitee is not an emergency, but is important information to mariners. Once again, we are all monitoring 16 on the water in Ontario, and the station announcing the Securitee will be heard. What happens in the US if mariners are all monitoring different channels, because 16 is for emergencies(mayday)only? What channel do you use for calling other boaters, calling pan pan, or securitee.I was taught when a call is made to another station, the receiving station, is to immediately direct the calling station to a "working" channel. IE: Sunshine, Sunshine, this is Paradise, Paradise over.Paradise, this is Sunshine, go to channel **Knowing the proper protocol enables you to call other stations on 16, and keeps the channel clear of unnecessary conversation. When there is a Mayday, all other transmissions must cease on 16.Eric

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Not quite true, Eric

Ch 16 may only be used for emergencies and hailing. Hailing vessel says "Albatross, Albatross, Albatross...Flying Dutchman calling"...the other vessel should respond with something like "This is Albatross, switch and answer on ch. 68...out." End of conversation on 16. That's not just in US and Canada...that's what international rules for VHF use call for.Not that very many people actually do it that way, though....unfortunately.

 

[Malcolm Young C36]

Channel 16

Eric,You are essentially correct. Canadian (and International) regulations indicate that Channel 16 is for emergencies, safety and calling (hailing). It is not for carrying on conversations. Emergencies include a Mayday (grave and imminent danger and requiring immediate assistance), Pan Pan (Urgency signal - concerning the safety of a ship, an aircraft, another vehicle or a person on board or within site - but not a situation not involving grave and imminent danger)Safety messages are preceeded by Securite which indicates that the station is transmitting an important navigational or meteorlogical warning ie. a large log is adrift in a certain area and is a hazard to navigation or a large vessel is aproaching a narrow passage in which there is limited manoevering room.Calling on 16 (or hailing) is just as you and Peggie indicated. You may initiate contact and must switch to a working channel (not 16) as soon as contact is established. Calling can also be done on other 'working' channels. Note that in the case of calling shore stations (in Canada) calling should not be done on chanel 16 eg. use channel 68 for Marinas, assigned channels for Seaway locks and bridges etc. I think this is somewhat different in the states as Marinas use various other channels.Prior to any call you are to listen on the channel you are using to make sure you don't interfere with someone else that has just made the call, or in the case of a working channel, is in fact using the channel.... a pet peeve with meI have heard the US Coast and Candian CG admonish people using Channel 16 incorrectly but never for simply making a call in the correct way.... this may be a local thing though. One of the exceptions is that if you are in the midst of a Mayday, silence on channel 16 is automatically imposed except for messages related to the distress situation. This silence must be kept until the controlling station (usuaslly the CG) indicates that it is OK to resume normal communications with the words 'Seelonce Finee' - the international wording. There are a number of other rules/guidelines which are important. These, as others have indicated, can be easily studied through a one evening course or self studied with a reference book. Finally, in Canada, it is not a requirement to keep your radio on channel 16 while underway. It is a real good thing to do however. My understanding is that only those required by law to carry marine radios must monitor 16.

 

[Eric]

Thanks for the clarification

Peggy and Malcolm!If ever you're sailing southern Georgian Bay, or Lake Simcoe, give a hail, "Paradise". You know I'm monitoring 16!Eric

 

[Dana s/v Kiskadee]

And another thing...

One point we must pass on to all is the reason for the 1-Watt button. Regardless of the channel, use low power unless it is a true emergency. Communictaions made on low power have a little less than a third of the range of normal power (1 Watt vs 25 Watts). Even a handheld can cut it's range by over half as it drops from 5W to 1W.A low power transmission has 1/25th as much total area covered. In high traffic areas your low power hail to a nearby boat does not bother distant stations. Several simultaneous conversations can take place on the same working frequencies without interfering with each other. In an emergency leave the radio on 25W and hope the world hears. I don't mind rules to protect the innocent from the stupid. However, I think the rules are there already and we just need inforcement. We've heard vessels ignore a Silonce order on VHF16. We've all heard false or unnecessary MAYDAY calls. We've seen CG respond at great expense and risk. But we've never seen a prosecution of a vessel's captain... We should. If I operate my boat with above 0.08 bac or have open alcohol while underway I am charged and will lose my car license. If I am speeding in my boat in controlled waters it will affect my car license. So why not nail a few captains who don't follow marine VHF regulations? I don't think the captain's children would be able to sing "Mary had a little lamb" on VHF if the captain could have to walk to work for a week.