I have a H260: I'm sailing in the Patuxent river for a couple of weeks before moving back to the Bay. The creek I'm in is shallow so I raise and lower the keel as needed. Yesterday, I was out in a good 15 knot breeze, with a full reefed main and a partial jib, sailing with about a 10-15 degree heel. Everything seemed normal. On my way back up the creek I noticed I had never put the keel board down. Knowing that, I was shocked at how she sailed. Now I'm thinkning... Last year on the Bay, more then once, in heavy winds, I felt like I was the head of a tack. All she wanted to do is spin around. At the time, I was envying the full keeled boats. I'm wondering, if I lowered the keel half way, I'd have more lateral resistance against the boat turning. Has anyone else played around with this idea? Can we use the keel to our advantage? Thanks,
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marty albright
half-board
Regarding the use of partialboard/keel...... Last evening I was sailing my 240 in a brisk breeze after anchoring in shallow water. I noticed the lack of weather helm and almost neutral steering. I noticed that I had forgot to lower my centerboard and had it up halfway. The boat also seemed to be more stable and point better into the wind. I will definitly use this technique in the future.
Regarding the use of partialboard/keel...... Last evening I was sailing my 240 in a brisk breeze after anchoring in shallow water. I noticed the lack of weather helm and almost neutral steering. I noticed that I had forgot to lower my centerboard and had it up halfway. The boat also seemed to be more stable and point better into the wind. I will definitly use this technique in the future.
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Hayden Jones
Thanks for sharing
I too am sailing in shallow waters. I just bought a 23.5 swing keel boat. I palnned on moving the keel up and down while under sail to accomodate shoals, etc. I couldn't find info on sailing with the keel partially up/down, only when under power. You've just made an old sailor feel much better about his purchase. Fair winds!
I too am sailing in shallow waters. I just bought a 23.5 swing keel boat. I palnned on moving the keel up and down while under sail to accomodate shoals, etc. I couldn't find info on sailing with the keel partially up/down, only when under power. You've just made an old sailor feel much better about his purchase. Fair winds!
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Tom Wootton
The way I learned it....
...(starting with daysailors) was: board fully down when close hauled, partially down on a beam reach, fully up when running. I try to remember this when sailing my H26. The problem with close hauled sailing is making leeway, which I'm not very good at sensing when it's happening. The function of the centerboard is to reduce leeway; it may seem to sail better close hauled with the board up, but you might not be aware of how much you're sliding sideways. It's hard to imagine that the board in its horizontal position (with half its surface area concealed in the well) provides more resistance to leeway than when it's fully deployed, but I guess it's possible. I'll play around with it next time I get the chance.
...(starting with daysailors) was: board fully down when close hauled, partially down on a beam reach, fully up when running. I try to remember this when sailing my H26. The problem with close hauled sailing is making leeway, which I'm not very good at sensing when it's happening. The function of the centerboard is to reduce leeway; it may seem to sail better close hauled with the board up, but you might not be aware of how much you're sliding sideways. It's hard to imagine that the board in its horizontal position (with half its surface area concealed in the well) provides more resistance to leeway than when it's fully deployed, but I guess it's possible. I'll play around with it next time I get the chance.
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Ray Bowles
Frank, Very interesting concept, now think about
this. With the CB about 1/2 the way down it would still have the upper 1/2 of the board very close to the bottom of the hull thereby trapping water against the side of the hull and the bottom of the CB. If the board is fully down then the hull above would offer very little sideways resistance. The main latterial resistence would only come from a 16" wide board 6 feet deep. With the board close enough to the bottom of the hull so as to not allow much water to pass between the upper edge of the board and the bottom plane of the hull you might have a much higher resistance factor to the sideways force produced by the wind. Basically a full keel type of boat verses a fin keel. In many wind conditions this could be the better hull shape. We must try it and post back. Thanks. Ray S/v Speedy
this. With the CB about 1/2 the way down it would still have the upper 1/2 of the board very close to the bottom of the hull thereby trapping water against the side of the hull and the bottom of the CB. If the board is fully down then the hull above would offer very little sideways resistance. The main latterial resistence would only come from a 16" wide board 6 feet deep. With the board close enough to the bottom of the hull so as to not allow much water to pass between the upper edge of the board and the bottom plane of the hull you might have a much higher resistance factor to the sideways force produced by the wind. Basically a full keel type of boat verses a fin keel. In many wind conditions this could be the better hull shape. We must try it and post back. Thanks. Ray S/v Speedy
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John Revenboer
Centerboard UP
When I was sailing a great deal in the Great Lakes and other areas deep enough to put the CB down, I found that sailing in strong winds, the boat would have a mind of its own at times and round up into the wind on a sort of fast broach, regardless of full rudder to stop it. I guessed that it was due to too much sail up for the wind conditions. But now that I sail Biscayne Bay and the Keys here in Florida, the CB stays up becasue the water is so shallow here. The boat actually sails better, heels less and it has never tried to broach again. However the lateral drift can be a lot. Usually it is of little consequence. It only because a problem when trying to stay inside the very narrow ICW Channel through Biscayne Bay. On the plus side, I have passed (Smoked by) other fixed Keel boats that have run aground on the ICW.
When I was sailing a great deal in the Great Lakes and other areas deep enough to put the CB down, I found that sailing in strong winds, the boat would have a mind of its own at times and round up into the wind on a sort of fast broach, regardless of full rudder to stop it. I guessed that it was due to too much sail up for the wind conditions. But now that I sail Biscayne Bay and the Keys here in Florida, the CB stays up becasue the water is so shallow here. The boat actually sails better, heels less and it has never tried to broach again. However the lateral drift can be a lot. Usually it is of little consequence. It only because a problem when trying to stay inside the very narrow ICW Channel through Biscayne Bay. On the plus side, I have passed (Smoked by) other fixed Keel boats that have run aground on the ICW.
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Alan
With the keel up you have a lot of leeway and...
you would do better by dropping the keel and sailing a bit off the wind. Look at your wake with the keel up sailing close to the wind. You will notice very smooth water at the windward side. That is made by the boat bottom as it slides leeward. So, you are pointing towards the wind (slower point of sail) but actually your direction is well off the wind (because of leeway or side slippage). As far as the keel being halfway up, well think of how hard the helm becomes with the rudder partly kicked up on the boat with tiller configuration. I think that would induce alot of stress on the CB. Centerboards or keels that lift strait up are a lot different than our swing keels. I also tried sailing with the keel up because I thought it would reduce heel at the expense of a little leeway. Actually I found that it reduced heel very little at the expense of a lot of leeway. The only time I sail with the keel up is downwind or in shallow waters. alan
you would do better by dropping the keel and sailing a bit off the wind. Look at your wake with the keel up sailing close to the wind. You will notice very smooth water at the windward side. That is made by the boat bottom as it slides leeward. So, you are pointing towards the wind (slower point of sail) but actually your direction is well off the wind (because of leeway or side slippage). As far as the keel being halfway up, well think of how hard the helm becomes with the rudder partly kicked up on the boat with tiller configuration. I think that would induce alot of stress on the CB. Centerboards or keels that lift strait up are a lot different than our swing keels. I also tried sailing with the keel up because I thought it would reduce heel at the expense of a little leeway. Actually I found that it reduced heel very little at the expense of a lot of leeway. The only time I sail with the keel up is downwind or in shallow waters. alan
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Jeff Peltier
Pivot point
From past experience racing scows. In heavy air, sometimes we would pull the board up part way to move the point of balance back. This helps balance the helm. The board pivot on a scow is a little higher up than on a H260, so moving the board up 1/3 would move the balance point further back on a scow for the same angle. This can also be done by moving the sail draft forward with various techniques, but during a short race, changing mast bend, etc isn't always an option. If one is looking for passenger comfort and not concerned with making headway to windward, having the board up moves the balance point back and allows the boat to slip in the gusts, giving a smoother ride with less helm. Having the board up during jibs on a windy day will also help take some of the shock load out of the procedure by allowing the boat to slip. This was also a survival technique for jibing a scow on a windy day with a light crew.
From past experience racing scows. In heavy air, sometimes we would pull the board up part way to move the point of balance back. This helps balance the helm. The board pivot on a scow is a little higher up than on a H260, so moving the board up 1/3 would move the balance point further back on a scow for the same angle. This can also be done by moving the sail draft forward with various techniques, but during a short race, changing mast bend, etc isn't always an option. If one is looking for passenger comfort and not concerned with making headway to windward, having the board up moves the balance point back and allows the boat to slip in the gusts, giving a smoother ride with less helm. Having the board up during jibs on a windy day will also help take some of the shock load out of the procedure by allowing the boat to slip. This was also a survival technique for jibing a scow on a windy day with a light crew.
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