Unstepping Mast on 88' 272LE

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jfmid

.
Jan 31, 2010
152
Oday 27 LE Manahawkin, NJ
Hello All,

I will be pulling her out of the water next weekend and am having the mast unstepped to allow me to add a spreader light, a steaming light mid mast, and work on the anchor light that doesn't seem to go on.
Any hints, suggestions, or do's or dont's that I should be aware of. Haven't worked with this marina (Ted & Sons on Forked river, NJ) and it's my first winter with boat and while they come well recommended I still have concerns.
thanks in advance

John
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
John,
Does the mast have internal halyards? This is where you can run into problems when you're adding wires. At least, it was a problem for me when I reworked my wiring. Years ago I delivered an 86 O'Day 272 from Cape Cod to Bristol RI and I don't remember whether the mast had internal halyards. This guy's boat wasn't an LE.
 

jfmid

.
Jan 31, 2010
152
Oday 27 LE Manahawkin, NJ
Yes there are internal halyards.
What concerns me is how the mast is held on the "Step????" besides the shrouds and stays. I'm not sure if that is the correct term. There are four short #14 X 1" brass screws ( one at each corner) of the mast plate????. Forgive my terminology if it's incorrect. Dont know all the labels yet.
The two forward ones are out and that is a worry. I tried to reseat them and they didn't grab. Seems to be that the holes are stripped out. Is that all that stabilizes the mast. I know the shrouds hold the mast down and also the stays but to me the screws seem very insignificant.

As to the innards of the mast is there a conduit??? I'm guessing from your answer there isn't. I dont seem to have any mast slap as it is configured now so I will look when it comes off. Really just have to run one additional wire for a steaming/deck combo light. Hoping I can get to mid mast without too much difficulty.

Things are never as easy as they seem and projects always take triple the estimated time to complete.
It's going to be a long fun interesting winter.

John
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
Yes there are internal halyards.
What concerns me is how the mast is held on the "Step????" besides the shrouds and stays. I'm not sure if that is the correct term. There are four short #14 X 1" brass screws ( one at each corner) of the mast plate????. Forgive my terminology if it's incorrect. Dont know all the labels yet.
The two forward ones are out and that is a worry. I tried to reseat them and they didn't grab. Seems to be that the holes are stripped out. Is that all that stabilizes the mast. I know the shrouds hold the mast down and also the stays but to me the screws seem very insignificant.

As to the innards of the mast is there a conduit??? I'm guessing from your answer there isn't. I dont seem to have any mast slap as it is configured now so I will look when it comes off. Really just have to run one additional wire for a steaming/deck combo light. Hoping I can get to mid mast without too much difficulty.

Things are never as easy as they seem and projects always take triple the estimated time to complete.
It's going to be a long fun interesting winter.

John
Yes there are internal halyards. I kind of figured that John, but I wasn't sure.
What concerns me is how the mast is held on the "Step????" besides the shrouds and stays. I'm not sure if that is the correct term. Yes. that's what they call it, the mast step. There are four short #14 X 1" brass screws ( one at each corner) of the mast plate????. Forgive my terminology if it's incorrect. Dont know all the labels yet. You're doing OK John. I'm not what you would call an expert on sailboat maintenance. I learned the same way that you're learning now, like on the job training, the public library, and the books I've read as well as knowledgeable friends.
The two forward ones are out and that is a worry. I tried to reseat them and they didn't grab. Seems to be that the holes are stripped out. Is that all that stabilizes the mast. I know the shrouds hold the mast down and also the stays but to me the screws seem very insignificant. From what I have been told, the mast steps on some of these boats are made to rip off the cabin top in the event that a stay should let go and the mast goes over the side. If your mast step was bolted through the cabin, your mast would bend in half like mine did out around Newport RI back in the 1990s.
My friend Del in our club owns a Hunter 27 and his mast step is set up the same way that yours is. Last year his turnbuckle let go during a storm while the boat was sitting at the mooring in back of the club, and the mast was in the water. He later took the mast and boat down to the boatyard and they repaired the stay along with the area under the step and set his mast. He was back in business in no time at all.

As to the innards of the mast is there a conduit??? I'm guessing from your answer there isn't. I really don't know John. I never really knew how my wiring was set up until I went down to talk to the rigger at Rig-Rite to go over some changes and modifications that I wanted him to do on my new Z-Spar mast. He had it all apart that day and there was no conduit in my mast. The wires were all zip tied in a bundle about every 12" I don't seem to have any mast slap as it is configured now so I will look when it comes off. Actually, I've never had any mast slap from wire inside either. Really just have to run one additional wire for a steaming/deck combo light. Hoping I can get to mid mast without too much difficulty. I had the rigger install a steaming light on my mast when it was being worked on. Years later, one of the wires to the steaming light broke inside the mast at the light. I don't know if one of the halyards rubbed up against it and cause this. So when I was working on my mast about a year this past spring, I pulled my wiring out of my mast and removed the steaming light and the feed wire. My boat never really came new with a steaming light to begin with and I never used it more than a few times when I had it. You can get away without a steaming light on a small boat like mine, but I really believe that the larger boats like yours should have them though.
The only way to find out what you have is to remove the wiring. If it has conduit,-- great! If not, then it would be wise to install one just for these two lights.
When I worked on my mast I took all the stays off it including my spreaders because I do that anyway in the fall. I use my mast as a ridge pole for my 18'X30' polytarp cover. My mast is only 27' long and it's easier to handle and flip up or down on my portable work bench in my back yard with all that garbage off it. I had on end of the mast laying on the grand kids play house, and the other end was in a notched board in the vice of my portable work bench. I removed my mast step and I also removed my mast head. I tied tag lines of strong twine to the ends of my wires so that when I pulled my wires out through the top of my mast I could pull them back in the same way. You want to make sure that your wires don't get dipped or crossed with any of your halyards. I was able to fix my anchor light that hadn't worked in about four years and remove my steaming light and feed wire. A Dremel Tool comes in handy for cleaning electric contacts in lights as well as the metal on the bulbs. Also, for testing the lights, you can use a small 12v battery charger to test your lights and make sure that they're working before putting it all back together.

I had brought my mast to a marine welder to have the area near the hinged tabernacle plate welded and filled. When the rigger replaced my old cast Aluminum mast hinge with a new stainless steel hinged plate, he never insulated the stainless steel from the Aluminum. This caused a chemical reaction that was corroding my mast. This this was one of the other jobs that I had to do while the mast was apart. Some guys use plastic from the milk jugs and place it in between the two metals. I coated the inside area of the mast with epoxy and let it dry out before putting the hinge back on.

Things are never as easy as they seem and projects always take triple the estimated time to complete. You're right about that one John. Been there, done that.
It's going to be a long fun interesting winter. Just take your time and think it through. Some food for thought would be; how many wires will I need? Will I need a ground for each light? Will I need separate switches? Will I need a conduit or can I get by without it? I really don't know how you could anchor a conduit inside the mast anyway. Don Casey has a method but I'm not keen on using it. Check out his web site or his books for that. Good luck with that John. I hope that I was able to be of some help to you here.
Joe

John[/
 

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jfmid

.
Jan 31, 2010
152
Oday 27 LE Manahawkin, NJ
Thanks so much for your answers to my questions.
I guess I'm going to "repair" the screw holes and redrill the holes for the brass screws. From what you wrote I see that the tension of the shrouds on the mast holds it down and the screws are just for a bit of stability to keep the base from slipping around.
I will look when the mast is off and see what's inside. I'm hoping for a conduit but if not I'll figure something out. I'm checking out Casey's site to see what is recommended for attaching wires inside the mast. A 16-3 wire should be ok I think. One lead for the steaming light, one for the deck light and a ground. The next concept to solve is how to go through the deck/roof of cabin. There are two connectors already in place. One for the antenna lead and one for the anchor light (currently not working). They allow for disconnection for removal of the mast so I guess I have to find a way to install a third "socket" for the steaming/deck wire.
Who knows what other wonders I'll find as I go along. It's the journey that's so much fun and not just the destination. If I was only worried about getting to the destination I would have bought a powerboat. LOL LOL:D:D
I'll try to take pics and show what I'm doing as I go along.

Thanks again and take care

John
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
John,
Some of the large boat masts have a built in conduit inside close to the mast track. I never knew this until Rudy Nickerson of D & R Marine pointed it out to me when I was in his store one day.
The 16/3 stranded copper wire sounds good. Also, I neglected to mention that if you remove any small machine screws from the mast, you would be wise to use thread locking cement on the threads. I have six of these screws that hold my hinge plate to my mast and they were always getting loose. I got tired of tightening them and got a bottle of Lock-Tite and I haven't had a problem since. I remove my lifeline rails every fall when I cover my boat and in the spring I use thread cement on the screws that hold the rails.

As for Don Casey's conduit method; I think he drills holes through the outside of the mast to hold the conduit in place. I'm not too keen on that one. It's too bad that they don't have some kind of thin flat metal clips that can hold the conduit to the inside of a mast. For instance; years ago they had these metal clips that you could wear over your right pant leg near your ankle while riding a bicycle to keep your cuff from getting caught in the sprocket. These metal clips sprung in, but they could make a clip to spring out and have a round indentation in the center to accommodate the conduit. The clips could be riveted to the conduit every 12" and all you had to do is cut the conduit to length and slide it into the mast. You watch. Somebody is going to come out with a patent on that.

On the electric outlet: You may be able to find a good one out there but you need to look hard. A lot of the sockets that they sell at "Worst Marine" are made in China and if you go that route, make sure you check it out for defective screws before leaving the parking lot. Also, your going to need a polarized connector. In other words the plug can only fit one way into the outlet. That's about all I can think of at the moment. Good luck with that.
Joe
 

Pat

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Jun 7, 2004
1,250
Oday 272LE Ninnescah Yacht Club, Wichita, Ks.
I think you've been given good advice. Taking the mast down is not hard..just have plenty of people there as mine (272) falls aft and just slips out of the base....which by the way should be re-screwed as you plan to do....I've not seen any 272 's without all four screws/bolts in..so I couldn't even describe them.....we've anchored a lot and not had too many issues with halyard or wiring slapping in the mast.....just like nearly everyone, our mast light/anchor light has only work once in a while...and the steaming light was never installed...I'm not sure how O'Day managed to pull that little omission off so well...my biggest complaint when anchoring is play in the rudder making noise all night....locking the wheel does not help....tying the wheel with bungee cord does help. Good luck to you. They are great boats....we have enjoyed ours since we bought it new in 1986....this evening we will be enjoy steaks cooked on the magma grill and wild rice cooked on the little origo....cannot get better....80 degrees in Wichita today..but windy.
Patrick
 
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