Okay,I have to admit that to me the most nerve racking part of sailing is not reefing a mainsail in 35 winds or riding out an electrical storm, ITS BACKING OUT OF A SLIP! I moved docks recently to get into a quieter cove location, but found that my trusty Catalina 30 with a two-blade prop pushed by a Universal M18 (14 hp) has not been very co-operative when going to starboard. Yes, I touch the throttle, back up, hit neutral and swing the rudder to starboard, but somehow, the damn thing still nudges to port, but she loves to fight me everytime and find a way to heave to port. The slightest breeze on the nose offers no help. So imagine if you would seeing a 30 foot sailboat going backwards for 5-6 slips thru the marina as I make my way to open water to turnaround!! Gee, do I continue this practice if the vessel feels right at home?! That is what I have had to do on several occasions. I will hold off on a 3-blade until I get her on shore for a paint in a year or two. I know their are folks reading this that have had similar experiences (at least once in their sailing careers), so any useful hints, methods or actions that can make this "art-form" a walk in the park for me will certainly get my gratitude. The funny thing is that its a lake with no tides or current!
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backing out..,,, don't use the engine
I have a slip where I must turn to starboard quickly as I exit the slip. I have tied port side dock line from the dock to the stern tie pole. Using this line, I just "walk" the boat backwards and the boat naturally turns to starbaord. I don't put her gear until after the turn. I do this single handed all the time. It's all very calm and in control and uses very little muscle.
I have a slip where I must turn to starboard quickly as I exit the slip. I have tied port side dock line from the dock to the stern tie pole. Using this line, I just "walk" the boat backwards and the boat naturally turns to starbaord. I don't put her gear until after the turn. I do this single handed all the time. It's all very calm and in control and uses very little muscle.
also
Stick with your 2 blade prop. It's fastest for sailing. A 3 blade prop is for power boats or those sailboats traveling the intercoastal.
Stick with your 2 blade prop. It's fastest for sailing. A 3 blade prop is for power boats or those sailboats traveling the intercoastal.
backing down
People will think that your highly skilled at backing down the fairway. We have a narrow fairway and a number of bow sprints that over hang, we alaways back down the fairway. Its the fastest safest way to get sailing.
People will think that your highly skilled at backing down the fairway. We have a narrow fairway and a number of bow sprints that over hang, we alaways back down the fairway. Its the fastest safest way to get sailing.
What I Do...
Start with the stern on the starboard side of the slip. Apply 3/4 throttle until good stern way on. By this time the stern is centered or slightly port. Shift to neutral and steer to starboard. Works for me. However, sometimes if wind and current are working against me, I just back out of the finger. I had an O'Day that had some real tough prop walk. I was also at an end slip near a bulkhead. That boat I just elected to back out of the finger each time. It worked fine. If backing works for you, it's a good choice. Rick D.
Start with the stern on the starboard side of the slip. Apply 3/4 throttle until good stern way on. By this time the stern is centered or slightly port. Shift to neutral and steer to starboard. Works for me. However, sometimes if wind and current are working against me, I just back out of the finger. I had an O'Day that had some real tough prop walk. I was also at an end slip near a bulkhead. That boat I just elected to back out of the finger each time. It worked fine. If backing works for you, it's a good choice. Rick D.
Or....back in
to the slip, then leaving is a piece of cake
I back in a bit different then most because the fairway is narrow. I go down about 3 slips and then start backing up. Get the boat moving, then let her coast into the slip and I also get used to the turning going backwards. I only have about a foot on each side for clearence but that's not a problem because of how easy it is to steer with the boat coasting backwards. So, going backwards, whether backing into a slip or leaving a slip isn't bad. That being said...don't forget about trying a long thin line from the stern cleat to the finger cleat to turn the boat manually after your out of the slip. Don't even need to pull on it. tie it off at the right length and when you back out of the slip, it will turn the boat for you. When your turned, untie it and roll it back in. Careful not to get it fouled though.
to the slip, then leaving is a piece of cake
I back in a bit different then most because the fairway is narrow. I go down about 3 slips and then start backing up. Get the boat moving, then let her coast into the slip and I also get used to the turning going backwards. I only have about a foot on each side for clearence but that's not a problem because of how easy it is to steer with the boat coasting backwards. So, going backwards, whether backing into a slip or leaving a slip isn't bad. That being said...don't forget about trying a long thin line from the stern cleat to the finger cleat to turn the boat manually after your out of the slip. Don't even need to pull on it. tie it off at the right length and when you back out of the slip, it will turn the boat for you. When your turned, untie it and roll it back in. Careful not to get it fouled though.initial way
A long slow shove from a dock stander, even on a 15000 boat can make a huge difference in being able to counteract prop walk and allow the rudder to bite. Singlehanding I have often rigged a line in a v arrangement from aft piling to bow location of dock to other aft piling. Using stretchy nylon rope this serves not only to arrest and control the bow coming in but also, when going out, a short half throttle burst in forward will stretch the lines, and as the throttle is placed gently in reverse with idle rpm, the taut lines acting like giant rubber bands will gently give the boat a little initial reverse way and rudder bite before reverse throttle is applied.
A long slow shove from a dock stander, even on a 15000 boat can make a huge difference in being able to counteract prop walk and allow the rudder to bite. Singlehanding I have often rigged a line in a v arrangement from aft piling to bow location of dock to other aft piling. Using stretchy nylon rope this serves not only to arrest and control the bow coming in but also, when going out, a short half throttle burst in forward will stretch the lines, and as the throttle is placed gently in reverse with idle rpm, the taut lines acting like giant rubber bands will gently give the boat a little initial reverse way and rudder bite before reverse throttle is applied.
Some Additional Info.
The responses have been interesting with an emphasis on dock line configurations as assistance. I do not have pilings as part of my dock. Pilings would make the whole approach much easier. Rather, I have long docks on each side that extend the length of the boat, so I either need someone to shove my nose off or back out while manuevering under power in a successful manner. A non-breathing bow shoving apparatus? Now there is something for the inventor!! If I swing my starboard side around via a line setup I will hit the stern of my neighbor who extends a few feet further out then I. Backing in is not the way I wish to approach it. Anyways, the challenge to succeed at this goes on. Thanks Everyone Bob
The responses have been interesting with an emphasis on dock line configurations as assistance. I do not have pilings as part of my dock. Pilings would make the whole approach much easier. Rather, I have long docks on each side that extend the length of the boat, so I either need someone to shove my nose off or back out while manuevering under power in a successful manner. A non-breathing bow shoving apparatus? Now there is something for the inventor!! If I swing my starboard side around via a line setup I will hit the stern of my neighbor who extends a few feet further out then I. Backing in is not the way I wish to approach it. Anyways, the challenge to succeed at this goes on. Thanks Everyone Bob
Prop Walk
I have a Cat30 in a 28' slip w/stbd tieup and narrow fairway so when the wind is blowing hard across my stern qtr in the moorage I also have trouble getting my bow around. Sometimes I just go for it, other times I back up the fairway but the sure fire method has been this.....I have an old 30'+ spinnaker sheet(it floats), I tie one end to the stbd stern cleat, loop it around the mooring cleat at the end of the dock and bring the end back on the boat. I back out w/ rudder amidship letting the line slip thru my fingers until I'm about 1/2 way into the fairway then I hold the line. This stops the stern, forcing the bow around smartly whereupon I put the gear in foward and proceed up the fairwayway while retrieving the line. Don't despair of the nasty Catalina prop walk I've actually found it pretty handy from time to time, like if you ever need to do a 180 in a narrow fairway......
I have a Cat30 in a 28' slip w/stbd tieup and narrow fairway so when the wind is blowing hard across my stern qtr in the moorage I also have trouble getting my bow around. Sometimes I just go for it, other times I back up the fairway but the sure fire method has been this.....I have an old 30'+ spinnaker sheet(it floats), I tie one end to the stbd stern cleat, loop it around the mooring cleat at the end of the dock and bring the end back on the boat. I back out w/ rudder amidship letting the line slip thru my fingers until I'm about 1/2 way into the fairway then I hold the line. This stops the stern, forcing the bow around smartly whereupon I put the gear in foward and proceed up the fairwayway while retrieving the line. Don't despair of the nasty Catalina prop walk I've actually found it pretty handy from time to time, like if you ever need to do a 180 in a narrow fairway......
Scott, I agree
Scott, Last week we had had a nice breeze coming down the fairway, which hit me in the nose when I backed out, so I had no option but to back out and head "up" the fairway in reverse. Actually, I ventured about 50+ yards with the wind and prop walk to port keeping it all balanced! I actually did my 180 just before the pump out dock well past the end of my dock. As nice as this may have looked to any viewing audience it was an exercise in patience, intestinal fortitude and sheer luck!! I think the best answer is an electric trolling motor attached to the bow!! Thanks Bob
Scott, Last week we had had a nice breeze coming down the fairway, which hit me in the nose when I backed out, so I had no option but to back out and head "up" the fairway in reverse. Actually, I ventured about 50+ yards with the wind and prop walk to port keeping it all balanced! I actually did my 180 just before the pump out dock well past the end of my dock. As nice as this may have looked to any viewing audience it was an exercise in patience, intestinal fortitude and sheer luck!! I think the best answer is an electric trolling motor attached to the bow!! Thanks Bob
If you have the money......
...get a 3 bladed max prop. My Gulf 32 had terrible prop walk with a two bladed prop and "barn door" rudder. The max prop meant that reversing is MUCH better (although I still need to go into neutral during the reverse turn to the right) and progress through chop is much better. Picks up an easy half knot during sailing (blades feathered). JW
...get a 3 bladed max prop. My Gulf 32 had terrible prop walk with a two bladed prop and "barn door" rudder. The max prop meant that reversing is MUCH better (although I still need to go into neutral during the reverse turn to the right) and progress through chop is much better. Picks up an easy half knot during sailing (blades feathered). JW
3 Blade prop
I had a 2 blade on my 32 ODay last year and changed it to a Cambpell sailor prop and what a difference in reverse! I still have prop walk but not as bad with the old 2 blade and the thrust in reverse and forward is like night and day, I'm much more confidant in tight quarters with anchors hanging off bows that my boat will respond in both directions when needed very quickly
I had a 2 blade on my 32 ODay last year and changed it to a Cambpell sailor prop and what a difference in reverse! I still have prop walk but not as bad with the old 2 blade and the thrust in reverse and forward is like night and day, I'm much more confidant in tight quarters with anchors hanging off bows that my boat will respond in both directions when needed very quickly
most of the advantage of a 3 blade...
Bob: Most of the advantage of a 3 bladed prop is because the prop is a smaller diameter. The other obvious advantage is there is slightly more thrust with throttle. I would agree that you should try to solve your problem with a 2 blade prop to preserve your sailing ability. I have a two bladed CDI composite prop. I can back straight out of my slip (as long as the boat is not kattie-wompass in the slip. The other option is the non-slip tip prop. It is also suppose to help with prop walk. It too is going to be slightly smaller in diameter too. http://www.bay-ship.com/bayprp_nonsliptip.html
Bob: Most of the advantage of a 3 bladed prop is because the prop is a smaller diameter. The other obvious advantage is there is slightly more thrust with throttle. I would agree that you should try to solve your problem with a 2 blade prop to preserve your sailing ability. I have a two bladed CDI composite prop. I can back straight out of my slip (as long as the boat is not kattie-wompass in the slip. The other option is the non-slip tip prop. It is also suppose to help with prop walk. It too is going to be slightly smaller in diameter too. http://www.bay-ship.com/bayprp_nonsliptip.html
Use spring line
I'm not clear on you docking situation, but will this work- problem is that you are tied to starboard and the stern walks out (to port) and you would rather the bow go our. Solution is to tie a line from strbd aft to dock about midships. Put in slow reverse. The slack will come out of the line and the reverse pull on the line pulls the aft end into dock (where you have a waiting fender). Hold steady on the throttle and the bow (which is already released) will move to port. When the bow is clear, cut the lines loose and go in forward. Make any sense? PS-don't give up on the 2 blade. Once you learn to compensate and use the walk, its nice to have while sailing. Lots of sailors back into the slip using a 2 blade.
I'm not clear on you docking situation, but will this work- problem is that you are tied to starboard and the stern walks out (to port) and you would rather the bow go our. Solution is to tie a line from strbd aft to dock about midships. Put in slow reverse. The slack will come out of the line and the reverse pull on the line pulls the aft end into dock (where you have a waiting fender). Hold steady on the throttle and the bow (which is already released) will move to port. When the bow is clear, cut the lines loose and go in forward. Make any sense? PS-don't give up on the 2 blade. Once you learn to compensate and use the walk, its nice to have while sailing. Lots of sailors back into the slip using a 2 blade.
Bob, Deja vu
Bob, I have exactly the same situation. C30 with an M-18 Port tie with wind usually from the Port side. Lots of prop walk! My answer: back out & drive the boat backward out of the marina dock. When you're in the open, spin her around (clockwise to take advantage of that propwalk) and head out. I do hand walk the boat out when winds are light. But I tried that when the wind was up & didn't matter, she went bow down wind & I ended backing out after a small fire drill. Once you get the hang of driving backwards, you'll look like a pro doing it. Personally, I turn around facing the stern and work the wheel behind my back. Appears tricky, but in reality, it's quite easy. P.S. when you get some sternway, keep a grip on the wheel/tiller. She'll want to roll hard over. Practice never hurts either (on calm days).
Bob, I have exactly the same situation. C30 with an M-18 Port tie with wind usually from the Port side. Lots of prop walk! My answer: back out & drive the boat backward out of the marina dock. When you're in the open, spin her around (clockwise to take advantage of that propwalk) and head out. I do hand walk the boat out when winds are light. But I tried that when the wind was up & didn't matter, she went bow down wind & I ended backing out after a small fire drill. Once you get the hang of driving backwards, you'll look like a pro doing it. Personally, I turn around facing the stern and work the wheel behind my back. Appears tricky, but in reality, it's quite easy. P.S. when you get some sternway, keep a grip on the wheel/tiller. She'll want to roll hard over. Practice never hurts either (on calm days).
Windwalker...your so right
Windwalker.....to port in reverse the boat handles like a Porsche, but her starboard manners stink! Right behind me (perpendicular)is a beautiful Bristol 40 with this invisible bulls-eye on her I have to avoid when backing out. Funny thing a few weeks ago; I left my wife at the dock after trying the "walk back and swing her nose out" routine. That procedure will never happen again. I will forego all the crazy rope tricks as recommended by so many, because they will just not fair well in my location and configuration. I will get this right sooner or later, but its nice to know its a large brotherhood of sailors who suffer from the same dilema. Thanks Bob
Windwalker.....to port in reverse the boat handles like a Porsche, but her starboard manners stink! Right behind me (perpendicular)is a beautiful Bristol 40 with this invisible bulls-eye on her I have to avoid when backing out. Funny thing a few weeks ago; I left my wife at the dock after trying the "walk back and swing her nose out" routine. That procedure will never happen again. I will forego all the crazy rope tricks as recommended by so many, because they will just not fair well in my location and configuration. I will get this right sooner or later, but its nice to know its a large brotherhood of sailors who suffer from the same dilema. Thanks Bob
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