Twin Head sails, Pro or con

Status
Not open for further replies.
Dec 8, 2007
478
Irwin 41 CC Ketch LaConner WA
My new boat has deck and mast hardware for a second head sail ( Staysail ). I like the Idea of redundancy to the forward stay for safty reasons but am wondering about sail handeling of the main geona with the other rigging in the way. I have no experience with twin head gear. All advice apreciated.
 
Aug 21, 2006
203
Pearson 367 Alexandria, VA
Two threads worth reading

Below are two nice threads http://ssca.org/DiscBoard/viewtopic.php?t=51&highlight=cutter&sid=01d9e60f8d7a97c331ccd43651fd98cct and http://archives.sailboatowners.com/pviewarch.htm?fno=441&sku=2007255173414.27&id=492653&ptl=#2007256141110.54 Garner
 
G

Gerryt

Cutter or twin head-stays

Do you have 2 head-stays, or are you set up as a cutter? If you have a cutter, the main thing to be aware of is to be very careful with the headsail. While not necessary, you really should furl it on every tack and jibe. If you have a larger boat an electric winch is very helpful.
 
May 5, 2006
1,140
Knutson K-35 Yawl Bellingham
I have a quick disconnect for the baby stay.

I disconnect it when I know I'm not going to need the staysail. If I have both stays up, I furl the headsail (Genoa) when tacking. It's easier on the sail and crew than trying to stuff the 135 through that little gap in the stays.
 

higgs

.
Aug 24, 2005
3,736
Nassau 34 Olcott, NY
Depends

If a cutter is using a true yankee for the headsail, tacking is not too much of a problem as teh yankee will come through alright. Many cutters, especially in lighter wind areas, have replaced the yankee with a genny. This can be a problem and then it is better to furl the genny when tacking. The other solution, of course, is the removable jumper stay, but then if you want the stay sail on a furler, you cannot do this. I just finished my 3rd season with a cutter and I am still learning how to best use this rig.
 
Dec 8, 2007
478
Irwin 41 CC Ketch LaConner WA
I am a Ketch

with a 135 on a furler, A friend of mine is on a 2 year cruise with his wife and two girls. He put a twin head furlling system on his new 48 Jeanneau , I havent been able to get any feed back from him as to his thoughts. It just seems there is a lot of fatigue induced side loads with regard to the roller furler. And I thought for piece of mind a second forstay would be nice. Am I being to parinoid? This is the tallest stick I have personaly owned and never want to see it in two pieces.
 
May 5, 2006
1,140
Knutson K-35 Yawl Bellingham
Stillraining, the shrouds are for side load.

The extra stay won't help with that, only with back force. Not likely you'll drop the mast but I kinda like the versatility of my rig.
 
G

gerryt

Charlie, what size boat are you doing that on?

Also, Do you drop the jib first, or lash the furled jib to the mast?
 

Taylor

.
Feb 9, 2006
113
Warwick Cardinal 46 Seattle, WA
Rigging survey

Some boats need the baby stay or inner forestay to control the mast shape and keep it from pumping (for and aft harmonic oscillation.) One other thought is - how big does your working jib need to be? Some newer boats are using two headstays very close together, one to carry the working sail for upwind and the other one (further forward) for an offwind asymmetrical sail. You never tack the asymmetric sail, it gybes in front of the forestay. Caveat - I've not had experience with either rig, so I might be talking through my hat. This is just what I've heard. I do, however, know what you mean about being paranoid! My boat is 8 feet longer than anything I'd sailed before, and loads in higher winds can get a little scary. One thing you should do if the boat is new to you is get the rig assessed by a good rigger and figure out what you want to replace. I believe that most buyers surveys only point out really obvious problems with the rigging, and disclaim anything further. For me, I was not comfortable until I replaced the standing rigging, I believe mine was 25 year old rigging, and its only supposed to go 20 years. From a piece of mind standpoint, this was a good first season expenditure. One additional thought - I looked at the Irwin 41 CC's on Yachtworld (all ketch rigged) and with the bowsprit on that boat, it seems like it was designed for a cutter headsail setup, two of the four boats there had a working job on a boom. But you have to consider the cruising ground we have in the pacific northwest. If this is where you are going to cruise - we spend a lot of time around here with our big sails up waiting for wind. What I have is sometimes a just powerboat with a big stick. So if you are planning on summer cruising inside Vancouver Island, a 135 on a roller and no inner forestay is probably a good choice. Was this a local boat?
 
Dec 8, 2007
478
Irwin 41 CC Ketch LaConner WA
Charlie / Taylor / Seadragon

Charlie, I was meaning the side loads put on the forestay from the furrler not the mast side loads, It just seems excessive at times even with a good qualty harken furller as you are basicly piont loading the forstay a third of the way up when pulling out the on initial set of the geona. Taylor, I had a Hull, Rigging and Mechanical survy done on the boat , The rigging is 8 years old. I bought the boat in San Deigo. Your explanation of sail use makes sence. I can see that working well on long downwinds crusing. Seadragon, Great read thanks, I like the idea of the quick release like Higgs and Charlie mention but Im all about frullers anymore so that wont do. I guess I could just forget the hole idea and have a inter forstay made up as a quick release type secured at the mast and if caught out in a gale run it forward and hook it up. Then if plans come togather later in life for the cruising lifestyle go with the furller and staysail then. As I agree with Taylor in not wanting to box in my 135 geona as we need it around here.
 

Joe

.
Jun 1, 2004
8,318
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
ketch rig comments

Actually, I don't have that many comments, just a link to a discussion that may help you a bit. Your description sounds like the boat is rigged for a staysail with a wire sewn in the luff... negating the need for a fixed forestay. The sail simply attaches to the deck and is hoisted by the topping lift rigged to the mast attachment. You can also use the existing hardware to rig a spinnaker (or whisker) pole foreguy and topping lift. http://www.pearson424.org/faq/faq1.html Speaking of ketches....look at this beauty.. it's equipped with an inner forestay, which makes it on topic, heh,heh. http://www.royalhuisman-deneb.nl/home/index.asp
 
Sep 19, 2006
643
SCHOCK santana27' lake pleasant,az
hey charlie

did you just buy that boat cause there's a guy in san diego selling one just like it gorgeous boat but wont trailer well
 
May 5, 2006
1,140
Knutson K-35 Yawl Bellingham
Yeah, I got her on Sept 12 of this year.

Hard to believe I've been in so much rough weather with her in that short time. I love the boat.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.