My boat has a tendancy to point into the wind. Just prior to letting go, I can feel the rudder begin to lose its bite. I tried to raise the swing keel a little bit to try and move the cg aft, but it didn't seem to help. Short of buying a new, higher performance rudder, is there anything I can do to tune the mast and move the moment arm closer to the CG with full sail?
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Hull Balance
It is all about balanceing the jib and the mail power. Sounds like you either (or both) need to power up your main or depower your jib. Smaller boats respond to changes in wind speed much more than larger boats so perhaps you need to go to the next size down on the jib. With that said I have heard of production boats with smallish rudders.
It is all about balanceing the jib and the mail power. Sounds like you either (or both) need to power up your main or depower your jib. Smaller boats respond to changes in wind speed much more than larger boats so perhaps you need to go to the next size down on the jib. With that said I have heard of production boats with smallish rudders.
Rounding Up
Scott, I have a 93 vintage 23.5 and this is a trait of the large mainsail Hunters with centerboards. You will find that reefing the main at winds of over 15 knots or so will greatly reduce this tendancy. (The old adage of reefing early and often.) Reefed, with a good wind will still get you up to hull speed, with much less drama for those riding with you. Another technique is to feather up into the wind when a gust hits, to help flatten the boat and keep the rudder in the water. These are small helm corrections as the gusts hit. Another aid is to let up on the main sheet. You see a few Hunters sailing with a bubble luft in the leading edge of the main to depower. Unfortunately, the Hunter has a fixed position for the main sheet (no traveller) and that really limits adjustment to depower that main. The basic problem is the large powerful main and excessive heel, which allows the rudder to stall hydrodynamically. It loses it's bite, and around you go! Weather helm (tendency to steer up into the wind) can also be affected by mast bend, which without a backstay is fixed for all conditions. Checking your fixed rigging, the mast should angle aft slightly. See your boat manual, or check the Hunter website. Hope this helps you. A lot of guys just won't reef the main, but that will help a lot in gusty or higher wind conditions. With the reef in the main, the tiller is much more responsive and much of the weather helm goes away. Mike Collins
Scott, I have a 93 vintage 23.5 and this is a trait of the large mainsail Hunters with centerboards. You will find that reefing the main at winds of over 15 knots or so will greatly reduce this tendancy. (The old adage of reefing early and often.) Reefed, with a good wind will still get you up to hull speed, with much less drama for those riding with you. Another technique is to feather up into the wind when a gust hits, to help flatten the boat and keep the rudder in the water. These are small helm corrections as the gusts hit. Another aid is to let up on the main sheet. You see a few Hunters sailing with a bubble luft in the leading edge of the main to depower. Unfortunately, the Hunter has a fixed position for the main sheet (no traveller) and that really limits adjustment to depower that main. The basic problem is the large powerful main and excessive heel, which allows the rudder to stall hydrodynamically. It loses it's bite, and around you go! Weather helm (tendency to steer up into the wind) can also be affected by mast bend, which without a backstay is fixed for all conditions. Checking your fixed rigging, the mast should angle aft slightly. See your boat manual, or check the Hunter website. Hope this helps you. A lot of guys just won't reef the main, but that will help a lot in gusty or higher wind conditions. With the reef in the main, the tiller is much more responsive and much of the weather helm goes away. Mike Collins
Aft Rake
Thanks for the response Mike, my H23.5 is also a '93. Are you sighting the mast rake or do you measure it somehow? Scott
Thanks for the response Mike, my H23.5 is also a '93. Are you sighting the mast rake or do you measure it somehow? Scott
Balance Question
Thanks Bill. To me, and my omittedly limited experience (about two years), your recommendation seems intuitively backwards. If I increase the power on the main sail and/or decrease the power on the head sail, doesn't that increase the relative force aft of the CG and make it more likely to weather helm?
Thanks Bill. To me, and my omittedly limited experience (about two years), your recommendation seems intuitively backwards. If I increase the power on the main sail and/or decrease the power on the head sail, doesn't that increase the relative force aft of the CG and make it more likely to weather helm?
Scott
Mast rake is measurable and is easy to adjust. It is controlled by the length of the headstay. On a no wind day, drop a weight on the main halyard and let it settle just above the boom. The distance from the halyard to the aft face of the mast is the rake. Try to set the rake at about 3" if you are feeling too much helm. Shorten the headstay by adjusting the turnbuckle at the foot of the stay. Then go ahead and readjust the shrouds to specs. BTW, never try to adjust the headstay turnbuckle for ANYTHING other than rake.
Mast rake is measurable and is easy to adjust. It is controlled by the length of the headstay. On a no wind day, drop a weight on the main halyard and let it settle just above the boom. The distance from the halyard to the aft face of the mast is the rake. Try to set the rake at about 3" if you are feeling too much helm. Shorten the headstay by adjusting the turnbuckle at the foot of the stay. Then go ahead and readjust the shrouds to specs. BTW, never try to adjust the headstay turnbuckle for ANYTHING other than rake.
Alan
Thank you, Alan. I have roller furling so I will have to take a look at it and figure out how to adjust it, if needed.
Thank you, Alan. I have roller furling so I will have to take a look at it and figure out how to adjust it, if needed.
Scott
An alternative to changing your rake would be to flatten the main and drop the traveler down. This will depower the main and minimize heel. Excess heel will stall your rudder, high aspect or not. In fact, a high aspect performance rudder has a much narrower 'grove' and so is has to be much more critically driven. Learning to play the puffs with a quick response at the traveler will keep your boat moving under control. However, the point about reefing early is valid and will make life easier.
An alternative to changing your rake would be to flatten the main and drop the traveler down. This will depower the main and minimize heel. Excess heel will stall your rudder, high aspect or not. In fact, a high aspect performance rudder has a much narrower 'grove' and so is has to be much more critically driven. Learning to play the puffs with a quick response at the traveler will keep your boat moving under control. However, the point about reefing early is valid and will make life easier.
OOPS
Yes Scott, I tried posting BEFORE my second cup of coffee. I did indeed get it exactly backward. Sorry for the confusion.
Yes Scott, I tried posting BEFORE my second cup of coffee. I did indeed get it exactly backward. Sorry for the confusion.
Weather Helm
What you describe sounds like weather helm, a positive characteristic as a result of proper tuning of your rig. The opposite characteristic is lee helm, a very bad thing... Think about it...
What you describe sounds like weather helm, a positive characteristic as a result of proper tuning of your rig. The opposite characteristic is lee helm, a very bad thing... Think about it...
weather helm
Lots of good advice here. One additional comment - get some meat to windward. Flatter is better. Get an inclinometer and see if you can keep your boat under 15 degrees of heel. If you don't have meat you need to flatten your main and reef.
Lots of good advice here. One additional comment - get some meat to windward. Flatter is better. Get an inclinometer and see if you can keep your boat under 15 degrees of heel. If you don't have meat you need to flatten your main and reef.
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