tuning a oday 222
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C
Chuck R
Also need to know..
Jeff S I also have a new to me 222 O'Day ( with SURK Hin # )built in Santa Anna Calif. I raced her for the first time yesterday and did well but previous owner did not race her and would also like to know about tuning her properly. We have about a 7/8ths fractional rigging and need some good help. Maybe we can hear from some O'Day owners...
Jeff S I also have a new to me 222 O'Day ( with SURK Hin # )built in Santa Anna Calif. I raced her for the first time yesterday and did well but previous owner did not race her and would also like to know about tuning her properly. We have about a 7/8ths fractional rigging and need some good help. Maybe we can hear from some O'Day owners...
D
Dave K.
Original wire-luff jibs or CDI?
My comments are based on my experience with my O'day 192, but I believe the 222 and 192 to be similar in concept. The first question is whether the rig is still in it's original configuration with the wire luff jibs that are set "flying" (not attached to the forestay). If the boat has been retrofitted to a CDI or similar furler over the headstay, then it would be tuned "conventionally" and you should ignore everything I'm about to say. The virtues of the original rig are quick rigging and a lot of control over sail shape. The disadvantages are that that type of furler,winding only the bottom of the sail, doesn't work well when the sail is under load and it can't be used for reefing. For good upwind performance, the jib luff needs to be tight, and that's the reason for the winch on the mast. When the jib is winched in tight there should be very little tension remaining on the forestay. It's a bit of an exaggeration, but you could say that the forestay is only there to hold the mast up when the jib is down. In light air or off the wind you can add a lot of depth and power to the jib by slacking the halyard, moving the rig load back to the forestay, much more so than with a conventional rig. The point to take away from this is that when tuning the mast for straightness, rake, etc the jib halyard should be under tension. In my experience, the tight halyard going to the winch on the side will introduce a bow in the mast which you can remove by tightening the port lower shroud. The backstay tension is varyed automatically in response to wind strength by the triangle plate that the mainsheet is attached to. This allows you to leave the backstay pretty loose which really simplifies rigging the boat when you go to attach the forestay. Since it's a fractionally rigged boat tighening the backstay will increase jib luff tension some but it also introduces some mast bend with helps flatten the main in windy conditions, a desirable trait. However, the mast bend brings does bring the shroud mounting points closer to the deck and that causes the leeward shrouds to hang slack. If you grew up sailing dinghies this won't bother you a bit, but I've had a few folks out who are accustomed to rigid masthead rigs that found the slack shrouds hanging there quite alarming. A fractional rig is more "dynamic" than a masthead rig and tuning is less cut and dried than just taking a Loos Gauge and setting tension. You want things tight enough that there aren't big shock loads generated by the rig slamming from one side to the other in a tack or jibe but not so tight that the backstay is only pulling on the forestay, never applying tension to the jib luff. Best of luck with your 222!
My comments are based on my experience with my O'day 192, but I believe the 222 and 192 to be similar in concept. The first question is whether the rig is still in it's original configuration with the wire luff jibs that are set "flying" (not attached to the forestay). If the boat has been retrofitted to a CDI or similar furler over the headstay, then it would be tuned "conventionally" and you should ignore everything I'm about to say. The virtues of the original rig are quick rigging and a lot of control over sail shape. The disadvantages are that that type of furler,winding only the bottom of the sail, doesn't work well when the sail is under load and it can't be used for reefing. For good upwind performance, the jib luff needs to be tight, and that's the reason for the winch on the mast. When the jib is winched in tight there should be very little tension remaining on the forestay. It's a bit of an exaggeration, but you could say that the forestay is only there to hold the mast up when the jib is down. In light air or off the wind you can add a lot of depth and power to the jib by slacking the halyard, moving the rig load back to the forestay, much more so than with a conventional rig. The point to take away from this is that when tuning the mast for straightness, rake, etc the jib halyard should be under tension. In my experience, the tight halyard going to the winch on the side will introduce a bow in the mast which you can remove by tightening the port lower shroud. The backstay tension is varyed automatically in response to wind strength by the triangle plate that the mainsheet is attached to. This allows you to leave the backstay pretty loose which really simplifies rigging the boat when you go to attach the forestay. Since it's a fractionally rigged boat tighening the backstay will increase jib luff tension some but it also introduces some mast bend with helps flatten the main in windy conditions, a desirable trait. However, the mast bend brings does bring the shroud mounting points closer to the deck and that causes the leeward shrouds to hang slack. If you grew up sailing dinghies this won't bother you a bit, but I've had a few folks out who are accustomed to rigid masthead rigs that found the slack shrouds hanging there quite alarming. A fractional rig is more "dynamic" than a masthead rig and tuning is less cut and dried than just taking a Loos Gauge and setting tension. You want things tight enough that there aren't big shock loads generated by the rig slamming from one side to the other in a tack or jibe but not so tight that the backstay is only pulling on the forestay, never applying tension to the jib luff. Best of luck with your 222!
C
Chuck R
Digesting your thoughts----
David K This 222 is new to me.. I am a 66 year old who owned powerboats most of my working days. I have gone bank to my roots so to speak by getting back to sailing. This OL' sailor sailed woodies from the 50's and these new boats have improved more that I thought. A Lyman Cat boat was pretty simple to sail you just had to keep bailing the water out of her bilges to make her sail well. This boat ,first owner was from California, second owner Minnesota, third owner Tenn and now Lake Erie Oh. I raced her for the first time yesterday and the first for me in 50 years. Out of 20 boats of three different classes raced with starts of 5 min apart and being in the beginners class ( last class to start ) I came in third over 20 boats in the three classes. Simply blew away the beginners boats. Was I surprised !! This fractional 222 goes to windward better than I ever thought a cruiser could. I out pointed 27 and 33 footers thus gaining on them the whole 3 mile race course.. My lee stays were loose big time both port tacks and starboard.. And yes I have the cdi furler with about a 135% jib. For what this is worth,, I built a gin pole to raise the mast and when I did so the bracket for the bow stay has four positions to pin the forstay to and I could only put enough pressure on the ginpole to get the forestay onto the aft slot. Think I need to go to the most forward slot as the boat at rest does not have any real tention on any of the stays. tiller has not much weather helm plus or minus. So shouldn't I be tuned ??? I just can't think I can just buy a used boat and it is OK.. Just feel I need to Monkey with it. My inner thought is to don't monkey.. But-------------??
David K This 222 is new to me.. I am a 66 year old who owned powerboats most of my working days. I have gone bank to my roots so to speak by getting back to sailing. This OL' sailor sailed woodies from the 50's and these new boats have improved more that I thought. A Lyman Cat boat was pretty simple to sail you just had to keep bailing the water out of her bilges to make her sail well. This boat ,first owner was from California, second owner Minnesota, third owner Tenn and now Lake Erie Oh. I raced her for the first time yesterday and the first for me in 50 years. Out of 20 boats of three different classes raced with starts of 5 min apart and being in the beginners class ( last class to start ) I came in third over 20 boats in the three classes. Simply blew away the beginners boats. Was I surprised !! This fractional 222 goes to windward better than I ever thought a cruiser could. I out pointed 27 and 33 footers thus gaining on them the whole 3 mile race course.. My lee stays were loose big time both port tacks and starboard.. And yes I have the cdi furler with about a 135% jib. For what this is worth,, I built a gin pole to raise the mast and when I did so the bracket for the bow stay has four positions to pin the forstay to and I could only put enough pressure on the ginpole to get the forestay onto the aft slot. Think I need to go to the most forward slot as the boat at rest does not have any real tention on any of the stays. tiller has not much weather helm plus or minus. So shouldn't I be tuned ??? I just can't think I can just buy a used boat and it is OK.. Just feel I need to Monkey with it. My inner thought is to don't monkey.. But-------------??
C
Chuck R
Mine has been modified
The triangle is gone. ( actually it was in a plastic bag in the sink area. The main sheet attaches to shackle fastened where the rope is to pull the centerboard. Is your boat made in Santa Anna also ? SURK In the hin#?
The triangle is gone. ( actually it was in a plastic bag in the sink area. The main sheet attaches to shackle fastened where the rope is to pull the centerboard. Is your boat made in Santa Anna also ? SURK In the hin#?
D
Dave K.
Modifications
The HIN on my 192 starts "SURJ". Perhaps it is "J" instead of "K" since it is the smaller model? I don't know that I like the sound of the mainsheet modification done by the previous owner. Boats with mid-boom sheeting often have a heavier boom section since there is more stress on the spar and also the effort to pull in on the mainsheet goes up since you have less leverage. Although it appears to be okay, since there isn't any damage, you usually want to attach the mainsheet to a pretty sturdy part of the boat - an accidental jibe can generate a hefty shock load.
The HIN on my 192 starts "SURJ". Perhaps it is "J" instead of "K" since it is the smaller model? I don't know that I like the sound of the mainsheet modification done by the previous owner. Boats with mid-boom sheeting often have a heavier boom section since there is more stress on the spar and also the effort to pull in on the mainsheet goes up since you have less leverage. Although it appears to be okay, since there isn't any damage, you usually want to attach the mainsheet to a pretty sturdy part of the boat - an accidental jibe can generate a hefty shock load.
C
Chuck R
Yes our boats were made--
by Performance Catamarans at 1800 Borchard Rd Santa Anna Calif according to the US Coast Guard MIC listing..( Manufacture ID Code ) SUR.. I wonder why the main sheet was changed, because it is in the way of the crew to change positions when comming about and there are three sheet lines to tangle. Seems the attachment to the aft boom and the triangle would be a better solution for everyone. I you sail also mfg'd by Neil Pryde ?
by Performance Catamarans at 1800 Borchard Rd Santa Anna Calif according to the US Coast Guard MIC listing..( Manufacture ID Code ) SUR.. I wonder why the main sheet was changed, because it is in the way of the crew to change positions when comming about and there are three sheet lines to tangle. Seems the attachment to the aft boom and the triangle would be a better solution for everyone. I you sail also mfg'd by Neil Pryde ?
D
Dave K.
Mainsheet
I don't know what motivated the previous owner of your boat to change the mainsheet, but they were not the only ones to dislike the std. arrangement. I saw another 192 recently that has a traveller fitted across the cockpit, right in the middle of things. When I bought my boat, it still had the original Neil Pryde sails, plus a genoa made by someone else. All of the original sails were pretty blown out and I've since replaced them. I bought a new main from D&R Marine and got jibs by buying used sails in good condition for other boats and having them re-cut to fit the 192.
I don't know what motivated the previous owner of your boat to change the mainsheet, but they were not the only ones to dislike the std. arrangement. I saw another 192 recently that has a traveller fitted across the cockpit, right in the middle of things. When I bought my boat, it still had the original Neil Pryde sails, plus a genoa made by someone else. All of the original sails were pretty blown out and I've since replaced them. I bought a new main from D&R Marine and got jibs by buying used sails in good condition for other boats and having them re-cut to fit the 192.
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