TRAVELER RE-LOCATE

[Halvern]

I have a new-to-me S2 11A. The traveler is located right at the entrance to the cabin, and is a problem if the traveler is right in the center. If I were to move it the top of cabin, what effect would that have on handling? I saw a picture somewhere on an 11A. I don't know what trove of calculations it would take, and I don't have the time to go back to school to learn. There are any number of companies that make that type of mount.
Appreciate the assist.
Hal Wenk

 

[sailme88]

If it were my boat, I'd keep the traveler right where it is.. Moving it forward by 3 or 4 feet will change the dynamics on the boom and possibly lead to failure..

So, I'd have the traveler on an adjustable car with sheets. As long as it moves easily and freely you should be able to keep it to the lee side of the hatchway..

 

[RoyS]

For main sail trimming it is best to keep the traveller near the end of the boom, where it is now. This location provides more vertical control of the boom without requiring the assistance of a vang on most points of sail. This is a sailboat and certain necessary allowances for sail controls must be expected. IMHO, having to step around the mainsheet apparatus to occasionally pass through the companionway while underway is not that great of an inconvenience to justify the modification. For comfort and convenience without those pesky sail controls there are always trawlers.

 

[Timm R Oday25]

As an owner of a sailboat that has the exact same arrangement ,my suggestion would be to leave it where it is also . When I first started sailing with this setup ,I also thought I would move the traveller and mainsheet to the cabin top .After all ,all the new boats are setup this way right ? The designers did this to cleanup the cockpit . I came to understand that having all the lines readily at hand while helming is very much preferred . Especially if you are short handed or solo . I realize this answer wasn't what you asked . Harken has been great with helping me setup and get the most out of my line handling .

 

[PaulK]

It can be done, but as others have mentioned, the cure might be worse than the disease. Moving the traveler forward will mean moving the attachement points on the boom forward as well. Three things happen because of this. First, because the sheet is attached closer to the pivot point of the gooseneck, you need more power to trim in the sail. If the sheet was attached 12 feet from the gooseneck and you move it to six feet from the gooseneck, to get it forward of the main hatch, you will need twice as many runs of tackle to trim the sail than before. If it was 4:1, it will now need 8:1. All those pullies result in added friction, so you may need a bigger winch to trim the sail. You will also now have twice as much mainsheet spaghetti in the cockpit than before. Second, moving the sheet on the boom can create point loading on the boom - you have doubled the pressure on it by moving it closer to the gooseneck - so the blocks on the boom need to be spread out to avoid this. This increases the length of line needed for the sheet, by the way. Third, the traveler that you have moved to the cabin top is also being pulled up by the sail with twice the force that was in its original place. Your cabin top may need reinforcing to keep it from ripping off, or from pulling the entire cabin off the deck. People do move their travelers off the bridge deck and onto the cabin top, but they take these issues into account when they do.

 

[jssailem]

Very well said @PaulK

It is your boat and you have to sail it. The helpful discussion hit all the reasons to not move the traveler.

I too have the traveler on the seat in-front of the companion way. It really is not an issue when sailing as we do not often use the companion way. It can be a pain when we are at anchor and there is now traffic in and out of the cabin. When at anchor or in a marina, we move boom to side away from the usual access to the dock. If Starboard tied, the boom hangs on the Port side, and is held in place by mainsheet and traveler. This has eased our stress with companion way access. We have found that when moving about the boat the boom and mainsheet often are a hand hold as one exits the companion way.

All this is said with a traveler that is integrated into the seat. If the boat you have was set up for racing and is standing on posts above the seat, the traveler can be more than an annoyance.

How is yours designed.

 

[thinwater]

Same amount of mainsheet tail. The boom will move half as far with twice the purchase. Think about it. Same force times distance.

As for moving it forward, look at just how far forward it needs to move. Probably a bridge over the slider turtle. Double the bending moment on the boom. It just does not add up on this boat. You could try twin mainsheets; some people like them and the conversion is much simpler (I would located it further back on the S2).

 

[Halvern]

The traveler on the 11A is right at the entrance of the companion way. The car is adjustable, so not really an inconvenience. I have young grandsons that are anxious to sail on the "big" boat and are 100% energy and really like helping. So always a flash of body back and forth, safely.
As part of this query, an option would be to move the sheet attachment point out to a swivel bolt on the end of the boom. That would drop the sheet straight down and put a traveler on a bridge across to the two cockpit seat edges. That would put it right in front of the pedestal guard and then controllable at the helm. My understanding is that if the sheet is at the end of the boom, you can eliminate the need for the vang.
I also have a Colombia 28 with the sheet at the end of the boom, and no vang, and never had any issues running fore. I singlehand the 28 but the Captain says no way on the S2, until I can show her I know enough.
I'd be interested to know if there is a book that might address this issue where I can plug in numbers to see what the outcome would be as far as sheets and pulleys. Be a fun learning experience. Add all this onto working on a six pac license (just because I want one).
Thanks for all your input, Appreciate continuing the discussion. Hal Wenk

 

[Stu Jackson]

My understanding is that if the sheet is at the end of the boom, you can eliminate the need for the vang.

That is incorrect. The reason is this: when the mainsheet is let out there is no longer a large downwards component to its force on the boom, and the boom rises. Once you go from closehauled to a beam then broad reach, you lose vertical control of the boom without a vang.

BTW, I had a Catalina 25 with end boom sheeting and still needed the vang, owned her for 11 years.

 

[Roland5048]

My '77 h30 has almost end of boom sheeting with the traveler at the companionway. Never had a problem with it being in the way when entering or leaving the cabin. In fact, it makes a great handhold to help pull you out when exiting on a close reach. Original set-up did not have a vang so the boom would rise when the sheet was let out. (See @Stu Jackson response above). This resulted in an overpowered main at times. Installed a vang and what a difference in control. Only issue is when you tack or jibe in heavier air. One needs to watch the sheet and blocks to avoid being whacked but, that is hardly an issue anyway unless the cockpit is crowded.

 

[Joe]

Since the boat is new to you, why don't you sail it for a year or two, then if it's still an issue, deal with it how you want. You're going to have a good time no matter where the traveler is.

 

[Davidasailor26]

+1 for trying the boat the way it is before you make any decisions. There are pro’s and con’s to each approach. Moving the traveler back to across the cockpit seats gives you more leverage, but the traveler across the cockpit there can make a good shin bruiser too.

 

[higgs]

If you move the Traveler to the cabin top you will need to add back up plates to the installation. I would guess the S2 has an interior liner which would mean these backing plates will be visible from inside the cabin. The coring of your cabin top would seem to me to be an important factor. If it is the commonly used balsa core would it be up to the compression loads?

 

[Mark Maulden]

our S2 11.0a has the traveler on top of the cabin. When we got the boat, the first thing I was going to do was put it back on the bridge deck. we had one these boats yrs ago so this is our second 11.0a. Admiral did not like the traveler arrangement on the bridge deck of the first boat, so I got nixed on on changing it. One has to pick his battles…