Trailer mods?

[SailShannon]

Hi all,
I'm looking at purchasing a Cat 22 with a wing keel. The boat is about 300 miles from me and doesn't have a trailer. I'm intending to keep her in a slip when I get her home so don't want to spend a lot on a trailer. One idea I have is to use the trailer I have for my 21 ft center console powerboat. I could build/attach higher bunks and a keel bunk. Add an extender for launch. I could put the PB in the slip for a few days during the transition.

It's a solid dual axle aluminum trailer that I know would handle the weight. And this option would possibly keep me from having to maintain 2 trailers going forward. ( could always do the swap with the slip when I need to pull the sailboat).

Am I crazy to consider this? Can anyone point me to how I might find the right measurements for placement of the bunks?

 

[CloudDiver]

I had to do pretty much the same thing, but for a swing keel, not a wing keel. The difference is quite a few inches, maybe 4 to 6 inches in vertical height of the bunk supports.
I got my measurements by looking at another C-22 trailer that belongs to Capt Don (a member here and Fleet Commodore). What I ended up determining was I needed 15 inches (16 for a little safety margin) for the hull to sit on the bunks and the keel to rest on the center rollers. I did this by laying a straight board across the bunks and dropping a tape measure at the center. I also Checked how much the bunks 'toe in' from back to front as well as how far apart they are center to center, front and back.
I'm sure a wing keel owner could do the same measurements off of their trailer for you. My guess is that you need roughly 20 inches of vertical clearance where the keel rests on the trailer keel support.
I got my vertical bunk supports from eTrailer.com. The tallest ones they have in galvanized steel are 16.25 inches but only provide about 14 inches of rise; because of the Ubolts it depends on where you are starting from, how high or low your cross members are to begin with. Here is the link;
http://www.etrailer.com/Boat-Trailer-Parts/CE-Smith/CE10196G-4.html

You mentioned you have an aluminum trailer... Putting on steel accessories, even if temporary could be a bad idea, possibly damage your trailer. It's plausible to build an effective, but temporary, cradle from lumber since you are going to retrieve the boat and travel 300 miles, then launch it and leave it.

I'd suggest looking into borrowing or renting a trailer that would suit your one time need, probably still cheaper and far less time-consuming than trying to modify your current trailer.

 

[CaptDon01]

I hope the purchase price reflects there is no trailer. The discounted price should be substantial in my opinion. It's just dang hard to sell a trailerable boat without a trailer. An issue to think about with a wing keel C-22. A proper wing keel trailer is designed so the majority of the boat's weight is supported by the bottom of the keel. The bunks simply keep the boat upright and support very little of the total weight. Will 300 miles cause a problem? I don't know. Might try inquiring with C-22 Fleets in your area to see if you could rent or borrow a trailer for a few days, then start looking for a trailer yourself so you don't have to give the boat away down the road because it doesn't have a trailer.

Don

 

[SailShannon]

Based on my research so far I think the price does reflect the lack of a trailer. I just got a quote from Sailtrailers for a new one and still in a good price range combined. Nice guys there and said if I send them some pictures/measurements of my PB trailer they will see if they can offer some attachments to make it work.
Haven't seen the boat yet so still need to assess condition, but sounds promising.

 

[watercolors II]

“Don” is right a trailerable boat without a trailer is just another boat. With a functioning trailer this boat will hold it’s value for many many years so you can recover your investment when you want to, you can not say that about your present center console powerboat.

Attached is measurements for my swing keel, check the difference in measurements for the wing to find the final height.

 

[SailShannon]

Thanks for this guidance. I had the owner send me a bunch of pictures. Unfortunately this is a situation where the owner is not very knowledgeable and what he thought was a "boat in impressive condition" has significant water damage to the main bulkheads on both sides. The decks don't appear to have hairline fractures around any deck hardware but certainly raises the question of wet core. I also noticed the standing rigging may be old (turnbuckles look a bit rusty) and the sails look original. Although I feel confident I could tackle the issues myself, I'm inclined to move on from this boat unless he was very flexible on the price. Any insights on what a '91 wing keel with no trailer, no motor and some definite issues would be worth? Hard to figure out "comps": in this situation. He's currently asking $3900.

 

[watercolors II]

Finding a trailer and having it modified to fit this boat would be about 700, a new sail 600, a used motor 700 and other structural and cosmetic 500 would add 2500 to the 3900 asking which would be close to 6500 not counting labor, you should find a Catalina 22 in real nice condition, ready to sail for 6000 to 7000 dollars.

 

[allen-deckard]

that's just a matter of what ya like doing. My boat is done now. I had as much or more fun working on it making it just so than I do sailing it. Planning little things how they are gonna work where to get the parts etc. etc. etc.

If ya just want to sail and not work on it then I'd say yah find a finished cat that someone has babied and fixed up and is moving on to a bigger boat or getting out of sailing for something else and you'll spend less. It just depends on what ya want.

Only real thing that boat has going for it that I'd jump on it myself is the wing keel I'd kill to have that transplanted onto my boat. The boat must have been insanely abused to have that much damage though I know some have boats in the 70's with out all that. Mine is an 86 that wasn't babied but didn't have the structural issues.

Anyway I think it's a matter of personal opinion on what ya want but if the bones of the boat are bad then getting to them would be to much for me.

 

[SailShannon]

I too love doing projects on boats almost as as much as sailing them. My wife knows it keeps me sane; hence her agreement ona purchase. Seems like I can always find a way to improve something.
I'm actually downsizing (and simplifying) from an Island Packet 32 I sailed for 10 years on Chesapeake Bay; had an O'Day 28 before that. So I admit I like the idea of the ballast being fixed to the bottom of the boat! The 'new design' wing keel models do seem a bit more difficult to find so I haven't given up on this boat just yet.
Saw an '89 wing keel a bit closer to me with the same bulkhead issues plus others things. Broker listed and he had not even been below, just opened the hatch and snapped a couple pictures. He was surprised when I pointed out the extent of the damage but he would not accept it was more than cosmetic; trust me it wasn't. It had a 2009 6hp tohatsu and a nice sail inventory, but an old trailer which needs tires and hubs/brakes. Listed at $6500, I offered $4100 which I thought was reasonable given the issues. Don't think he liked my offer as he hasn't responded.
The search continues...

 

[SailShannon]

Well what do you know, the broker that I thought had walked away just informed me the seller has accepted my offer! Pending final inspection and a little sea trial it looks like I'll be joining the ranks of Cat 22 sailors soon. Luckily the winters are warm enough here in Louisiana that I can knock out the work and hopefully have her sailing as soon as Feb/March. Woohoo!

 

[allen-deckard]

good deal. Always fun starting a new project for me anyway.

 

[SailShannon]

Agreed, already starting "the list"; you know the one that never actually ends. And to your point about the boat being abused. I don't think it was abuse as much as neglect of that oh so critical maintenance issue of keeping the chainplates properly bedded and not paying attention to what was happening. That's really all this is. Fortunately I'm going to be able to store the boat at home while on the trailer to work on her and only 5 min from the marina where I plan to keep her. Beats the 90 min drive I had back in Virginia!
I may be paying a tad much for the boat. But to grab a wing keel boat was worth paying a little premium.

 

[CaptDon01]

SailShannon,

Congratulations, and let me be the first to welcome you to the C-22 Family! I hope you had a chance to read the previous issue of the MainBrace. Lot's of information and photo's on the "new design" C-22. We have an 88 swing keel version, and although we LOVE our MK-II wing keel C-22, I still think the new design C-22's when kept clean and maintained, are the prettiest boats in the marina.

Now get busy, you have a C-22 North Gulf Coast Cruise to join in on next May over at Ft Walton Beach, Florida.

Don