Topping lift question...

Jun 1, 2016
156
Hunter 28.5 Lake City, MN
I have a hunter 28.5 in occasionally the cam cleat that holds the topping lift will release when I'm lowering the main sail. Is there any reason that I shouldn't just tie a knot in the topping lift rope below the cam cleat to keep it from dropping down and clunking someone on the head when I lower the main?

The boom is kind of low across the cockpit when the main sail is down. The sailmaker on my new radial sail cut it with a slight angle upward to allow a little bit more room under the boom.

I've already marked the topping lift rope to indicate how low to set the line to allow me to pull the main sheet so the topping lift doesn't interfere with the shape of the main. I would probably tie a knot at this point.

Is there any reason the boom should go below that level?

Mike
 
Jun 4, 2004
392
Hunter 31 and 25 and fomerly 23.5 Stockton State Park Marina; MO
Get one of these instead;
http://www.boomkicker.com/
Mike,
You can do it but be sure to check the boom level with the main at full hoist and at all reef points. One feature you'll have with an adjustable topping lift that you won't get with the boom kicker is the ability to use the boom as a lifting device to bring anything heavy aboard, or offload that giant tuna you may have caught.
Dennis
 
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Jul 14, 2015
840
Catalina 30 Stillhouse Hollow Marina
Yes, you can do that, but why not fix the setup to work correctly?
 
Jul 7, 2004
8,402
Hunter 30T Cheney, KS
Where is the cleat, on the boom or the mast? Is it worn out? Not sure how a knot would help unless the cleat has a bail to catch it. Pics?
 
Mar 1, 2012
2,182
1961 Rhodes Meridian 25 Texas coast
I have a horn cleat on the mast. My topping lift is cleated there at the place it should be when sail is up. A bit further up the lift, I have tied a loop, at the place the boom should be when the sail is down. After I hoist the main,, I simply unhook the loop from under the horn on the cleat. Conversely, when lowering main, just rehook the loop before lowering. Very simple and never changes..
 

pateco

.
Aug 12, 2014
2,207
Hunter 31 (1983) Pompano Beach FL
I have a horn cleat on the mast. My topping lift is cleated there at the place it should be when sail is up. A bit further up the lift, I have tied a loop, at the place the boom should be when the sail is down. After I hoist the main,, I simply unhook the loop from under the horn on the cleat. Conversely, when lowering main, just rehook the loop before lowering. Very simple and never changes..
My horn cleat is on the boom, but that sounds like a great idea. I will work on the preset lengths this weekend and will add the loops so that I don't have to keep adjusting the topping lift length every time I hoist or drop the sails. Thanks
topping lift.jpg
 
Jun 10, 2017
174
Catalina 1980 Catalina 30 Mk II John's Pass / Tampa Bay
SM,
I didn't like my hokey topping lift setup either.
I purchased a base mount block near the end of my boom (see pic for an example).
I used a double block but a single block will work just fine.

I then installed a power clutch forward near enough to the boom to allow for adjustment
while lifting and/or dousing my main. (see pic for an example).

This has worked great for me. I don't have a boom kicker, I use a mechanical boom vang.
I have had no topping lift problems since.
 

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Nov 9, 2012
2,500
Oday 192 Lake Nockamixon
The question is, what's wrong with your cam cleat that it's letting go? Is it worn out? Springs shot? Bad angle of line so that it can pull out? I look at the system with an eye to understanding why there is a failure, and then go from there.

I only like adjustable topping lifts, because they are useful helping to induce main twist in light wind when the weight of the boom may hang excessive tension on the leech, which removes twist. Boomkickers are nice for fixed position goosenecks, because they accomplish the same thing with regards to twist. Or rigid vangs.
 

Gunni

.
Mar 16, 2010
5,937
Beneteau 411 Oceanis Annapolis
You can have both - rigid vang AND topping lift, many of us do. But without a rigid vang a cam cleat puts the Boom in your boom ;) Poor application.
 
Nov 9, 2012
2,500
Oday 192 Lake Nockamixon
You can have both - rigid vang AND topping lift, many of us do. But without a rigid vang a cam cleat puts the Boom in your boom ;) Poor application.
I don't understand why a cam cleat would be a problem. The only problem I ever had with Harken H150 cam cleats is that they flatten single braid rope, which isn't a problem with the cam cleat, it's a problem using single braid FSE Robline Racing Sheet (which I don't think they make anymore) as a sheet.

I used an aluminum CLAM cleat for my (small boat) topping lift on 3/16" line ('cos it's a small boat) and I haven't had problems with it. Now, I have stripped out plastic clam cleats for control lines (specifically the outhaul on my Harpoon 4.6) so I don't use plastic clam cleats. And I've had a clam cleat let go my rudder uphaul line right on the concrete, necessitating a rudder blade repair.

But, yeah, a proper cleat hitch on a horn cleat won't let go. Just so much more fiddly and time consuming to do than cam or clam cleats.
 
Jun 1, 2016
156
Hunter 28.5 Lake City, MN
Thanks for all the suggestions. I've been looking through my library of pictures of the boat, but I can't find a decent one that shows the cam cleat. It's like they have roller. Is there supposed to be a spring in there?

It only releases occasionally, but I'm just trying to prevent somebody getting banged on the head when I drop the main (almost got someone last week).

I have a horned cleat on the lazy jack, and don't like it. The boomkicker looks to be quite expensive! When there is no price listed, they usually are.

Dennis, there aren't too many large tuna in Lake Pepin (Mississippi River).

I do like Patico's idea of putting an extra purchase and pulleys on to the boom and then us a clutch to tie it off where it's easier to adjust, rather than having to go up to the bottom of the mast.

I may get a second clutch to tie off the lazy jack line. That's another pain in my side.

Thanks guys! I really do appreciate the suggestions!

Mike
 
Jul 14, 2015
840
Catalina 30 Stillhouse Hollow Marina
Yes there are supposed to be springs in the cam cleat. Ignore the knot jacktar keeps suggesting because with a working cam cleat you don't have to draw your attention away from the operation of the boat. With a knot you draw away from what is going on while you tie and untie.
 
Feb 20, 2011
7,990
Island Packet 35 Tucson, AZ/San Carlos, MX
Yes there are supposed to be springs in the cam cleat. Ignore the knot jacktar keeps suggesting because with a working cam cleat you don't have to draw your attention away from the operation of the boat. With a knot you draw away from what is going on while you tie and untie.
I think the knot would be more of a limiter, not an adjusting (tie/untie) method?
 
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May 17, 2004
5,032
Beneteau Oceanis 37 Havre de Grace
How about a compromise - Tie the stopper knot now for safety and go sailing. Over the winter when you're not sailing anyway implement the more elegant solution of your choice.