To those who asked

[sailaway78]

First off the reason for the mast thingy is mostly due to the bottom of the mast being corroded, nearly off. About two inches of it. When the forestay broke a couple months ago, it just about finished it off. The very next sail, after replacing the forestay and the furler, the base completely went away to the point the shrouds wouldn't tighten. What I ended up doing is pulling the mast, cutting the bottom of it off and building a new mast step to raise the base back to the origional height. On the new forestay, I used Norseman fittings both top and bottom, and like them a lot. I don't see any way they can't be at least as strong as a swage. And there is no place remotely close to me that I know of to do the swage fittings. The rest of the rig is OK far as I can tell. Plan on getting the mast restepped tomorrow, and will have the rigger at the yard do a closer inspection. And thanks to who ever it was that reminded me to put a coin under the mast step. I had totally forgotten about that, and maybe that was the real cause of the problem, because there was no coin under it.

 

[MoonSailer]

Where did you Buy your stuff

I have looked at West Marine and Defender for wire and fittings. Where did you buy your stuff??? Did you use 316 stainless or the stronger 302 0r 304 wire??? My mast step is corroded but I am hopeing that the mast itself is OK. It is hard to inspect while it is in place but the mast seems OK. The step is in bad shape. Did you use mild steel or aluminum to make your new mast step??? Finally who did you get to pull and replace your mast. Thanks

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

forget typical currency coins - use a gold one!

it's the only one of value these days

 

[Ctskip]

It can also be a silver coin

They are probably easier to come by.

Keep it up,
Ctskip

 

[Stu Jackson]

We used a LOONIE

Canadian, eh?

 

[dvideohd]

it took a while

to really understand why our Gov't doesn't want to use Gold or Silver as "still legal currency..."

a - you can't print it...

b - Silver is BAD for werewolves and vampires... that could have an adverse effect on our government and financial (what's left of them) institutions....

I wanted to borrow to buy a (new to me) boat this spring.. I am thinking I had better make other plans...

************************

sorry to drop this comment in this topic... but when the subject is "rigging..." well.. I just got carried away...

--jerry

 

[Hermit Scott]

Coin?

Before I get to pulling my mast down, still a few months away, I need to know about the coin. I could have overlooked that with out ever knowing and then what would have happened? Seriously though what is the back story for the coin under the mast?

 

[Stu Jackson]

Hermit, it's a good luck "charm"

Try a Google on ships good luck charms, ship's coins, etc. Wikipedia may also have stuff.

 

[RAD]

No coin

Under my mast, when I pulled the mast 5 years ago I didn't see no coin unless its under the mast step, would the builder have put one there? can I throw one in the hole I drilled at the base for wiring?

 

[sailaway78]

Mast Info

Moonsailer,
I bought the furler through this site. Price was good, and service outstanding. Had to throw that in, as they were really quick and very helpful. Bought the wire and Norseman fittings from Defender. I think the wire is 316. My mast step was OK, just the bottom of the mast gone. After a closer inspection of the mast base and the step, it looked to me kind of like it had been galvanic corrosion that got the bottom of the mast. Mostly because there was so much gone on the mast, and very little gone on the step. The mast is 6061 material, and the step is another type of aluminum. But it looked to me like the corrosion was directional. Not being an engineer, nor an expert on this kind of thing, that is just an opinion. I had thought before it was pulled that I would have to buy a new step. They are available from rig rite. The step for my Kenyon mast was 279.00. Ended up I didn't need it. I did have to raise the mast step up 3 inches, as thats how much I cut off the bottom of the mast to get past all the thin areas. Did a lot of looking and research on that. I needed a riser that had to be 8 x 11 inches and 3" high, cut to fit around 4 keel bolts, with the holes in the bottom for the mounting bolts, and with enough clearance to get to the keel bolts. The keel bolts are not long enough to come through a 3" piece of material. Went to a local machine shop and they estimated 8 hours, at 90 per, plus material to make a simple riser, and almost double that to make it out of stainless. Couldn't find a piece of aluminum or stainless that I could figure out a way to cut myself. Ended up making it out of two pieces of pressure treated 2 x 10, slathered with epoxy, and epoxied and screwed together. Then set the mast step on top of that, fastened down with 5200 and 4, 2 and 1/2 inch screws. The whole rig looks a little, well, different, but very strong and solid. It should last at least as long as the rest of the step. Got the finishing touches on it today, and heading over tomorrow to get the mast back on. Had it pulled at Maritime Systems here in Slidell. They are the only place I know of on this side of the lake that has a cherry picker that can pick it up. They are pretty good, but are at the top of the scale when it comes to their pricing. 200 an hour to pull and restep. They estimated two hours, but I had to do the get it ready, and I pulled all the shrouds when they hooked the cherry picker up to it. But for 200 an hour, I am going to do as much of the work as I can.

 

[tcbro]

About the coin......

I've heard conflicting stories. I always thought it was any valuable coin, for luck. My Grandfather told me he put a silver dollar under the main mast of the Bounty when he replaced it in the mid 70's. More recently I read (somewhere?) that they used a copper coin. The copper in the coin would leach into the base of the (almost always wet)wooden mast and act as a preservative against rot and protection against invertabrates and vegetation. After all, the active ingredient in most bottom paints is copper and they used to sheath the bottoms of ships with copper before they developed the paint. Also, they use copper (and arsenic) in pressure treated wood.

So, you decide which tale you believe. There's nothing that says you can't put 2 coins under your mast!

 

[TimCup]

Nice N Easy- Am I understanding this?

phil- it sounds like you removed about 3 inches of mast and are putting the mast on 2 inches is 4X10 wood, heavily epoxied, is that right? And you used 4 1/2 screws to hold the wood together as one piece?

I'm not an engineer, either, and changing ANYTHING from factory specs scares the bejesus outta me when it comes to the mast. I applaud your guts. Please let us know how the sailing characteristics change. I painted my Oday22 deck and topsides, and still haven't been able to duplicate the sailing characterisitics i had. I need to tune the standing rigging- even though everything is back close to where it was (marked the turnbuckles to get it to where it was), i've noticed I can't sail near as high as i did before.

Did you use a gauge on your standing rigging before you demasted?

I'd love to hear more after you get it back in the water...


cup

 

[sailaway78]

What I did

Tincup,
There was approx. three inches gone from the bottom of the mast, by the time I got all the bad part cut off. Was no way to get an exact measure, as a lot of the mast just wasn't there. I had to go by the paint marks where it went through the deck, and they weren't really that obvious. I used two pieces of pressure treated 2 x 10. They were epoxied and screwed together. This gives a total of right at 3 and 1/4 inches. There were four 3/8 bolts sticking up through what I would call a base plate. This is a stainless piece about 3/8 thick, and the keel bolts also come through it. I taped a piece of cardboard to the bottom of my spacer, put it down where it sits, and with a few hammer taps, marked these 3/8 bolt locations. Drilled 3/8 holes and this is the locator. Then attached the mast step to the spacer with 4, 2 and 1/2 inch screws and lots of 5200. Got the mast back on the boat today, and I am just about 1/4 inch below the origional mast location. I wouldn't think that should make any appreciable difference in the sailing characteristics, as the entire rig is just a tiny bit shorter. Still have to get the boom painted and back on, but soon as it's all back together, will let you know if there is any difference.

 

[sailaway78]

Rig tuning

Cup,
I missed part of your question. When the mast was pulled, the bottom of it had collapsed. All the rigging was so loose that the turnbuckles ran out of room, and it was still floppy loose, so no way to go back to what was. What my plans are is to get the boom and sails on, get the mast plumbed and the rigging snugged up real good, then have a rigger do the final touches.

 

[John]

When to remove standing rigging

I will have to pull my (keel stepped) mast this winter. Did I understand you correctly to say that you had to wait till the crane was hooked up to the mast to remove the standing rigging, or can this be done before? If it can be done before on a boat with a keel stepped mast, is it possible to motor a short distance (like a few hundred yards) with the rigging removed or is it necessary to move the boat first?

 

[Ross]

John , consider the forces and leverages

you have perhaps a forty foot mast sticking out above your deck. You have a collar supporting the mast at deck level and some manner of support at the step. Is there anything to keep the foot of the mast from moving off the step? Are there power boats that create large wakes in that 300 yard journey? What is the hurry to let the standing rigging loose? One large wake and your mast could bent at the partners. OR it could kick the foot across the cabin and take out your cook stove.

 

[sailaway78]

Disconnecting Rigging First

In my opinion this would at the very best be very iffy. I did not disconnect the rigging until the crane had a little tension on the mast. The mast had lost enough off the bottom that the rigging was floppy loose. The mast was moving around quite a bit under these circumstances. I wouldn't even consider taking the rigging loose first.

 

[MoonSailer]

Nice N easy did you consider fiberglass???

My mast step is too low in the bilge so collects some water. I am thinking of putting an inch or two of fiberglass mat below the mast step to raise it out of the water. Mild steel and aluminum standing in water is not good. The other option would be to make a thicker mast step but it would still be in water. BTW it is not a lot of water all of the time. Apparently rain water can get down the mast in small amounts. Since the area is ever so slightly low some of the water stays around the mast step instead of flowing to the bilge. 1" would probably eliminate the depression. When the boat is being sailed the water finds it's way to the bilge.

 

[sailaway78]

Fiberglass

Yeah, I did consider making a fiberglass spacer, and if I could have made just a square/rectangular piece probably would have gone that way. But it would have taken either a custom mold or a lot of cutting after it cured. I am not a big fan of cutting and working cured glass. I always go crazy with the itching/scratching thing when I do. Was kind of a decision on how many hours I wanted to spend on it. I made the entire step, and had it mounted in one day. Which included a lot of time watching epoxy dry. The pilings on my dock, and the planking on the deck are over 20 years old, and other than the deck aging there are no ill effects on either. If this repair lasts 20 years, I will be totally satisfied.

 

[TimCup]

Nice N easy-

I'd appreciate it if you'd post again when it's all put back, and you're sailing again. I'm of the school that believes the manufacturer did a lot of testing to get just right. I know it's true with new cars, most new drugs, and I've assumed as much with boats, although I don't know why. Boat production numbers are so much smaller, that it's almost like a nonproduction business.

I'm a real sissy when it comes to changing the geometry, or mast flex, or anything like that. It sounds, based on your description of the mast before stepping, that your boat was far from factory spec (there's probably only one 20 year old boat that meets spec, and it's Maine Sail's).

I haven't known anyone that's substituted a bigger step for slightly less mast. Being within 1/4" sounds pretty darn good. I'm really curious to see how it works. Let us know.


cup